it’s possible that the quality of athlete they will be able to attract in many sports will be severely compromised
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Hopefully some Ivy ADs and coaches will get over their hubris and/or lack of strategic wisdom and/or inertia and start putting together NIL deals/collectives, etc. I would guess Cornell would be first mover.
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Or we’ll have true student athletes - wouldn’t that be refreshing?
I certainly don’t begrudge those leaving though - because their college salaries can become much bigger than whatever enhanced income or opportunity that Ivy degree gets them.
Very interesting article - thanks for posting.
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The Ivies have never been the goal for athletes who want to go pro, except for maybe in ice hockey, so this isn’t surprising at all.
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Check out this list of the Top 100 NIL deals in college sports. Scroll all the way down to #94, a UConn football player that has NIL deals worth $593K. UConn isn’t exactly a football powerhouse, their record last season was 3-9. I’m going to guess $593K in hand now would nullify the career bump from an Ivy across most majors.
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I don’t think this is likely to be the case, especially in sports other than men’s basketball and football.
There’s no doubt the transfer portal has changed things quite a bit across all conferences. NIL, collectives in particular, will have some effects on Ivy transfers at the margins (among a small number of outlier athletes). Even the article suggests these athletes aren’t motivated primarily by the money, although surely it could be a factor in some cases.
But the article ignores the coming roster limits, which are likely to reduce the number of roster spots across all sports (in what was already a zero sum game in head count sports). Not to mention the likelihood of programs being cut. In addition, the presence of NIL money is an incentive for players to go to college and stay in college rather than turning pro early, further reducing available roster spots. At the end of the day, with limited roster spots it’s not as if there won’t be highly talented athletes for whom Ivies are the best option.
So sure, there’ll be some adjustments in these sports across all conferences. But I don’t think the median athlete in most sports at Ivies will be at a lower athletic standard than in the past; more likely the opposite.
Just taking the sport I’m familiar with, Track and Field, as an example: several years ago Gabby Thomas had to give up her final year of college eligibility at Harvard to sign a pro contract. This past year Harvard had at least 2 runners with NIL deals, both NCAA champs, who continued to compete in the conference. So the current structure has actually raised the standard more than dropping it.
I do think the retention issue is something the Ivies will need to figure out. It’s no big deal if an athletic department loses 2-3 athletes to the portal every year. But it IS a big deal if the basketball team loses, say, both point guards in May without the ability to replace them. To me the solution probably has less to do with NIL (as I’m not sure money is the driving factor in most of these cases) and more to do with restructuring recruiting so the portal is more available to Ivy coaches.
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I’m not sure they’ll be affected in “many” sports although attracting basketball and football talent may be more difficult. I don’t think they’ll be hampered in terms of attracting the next great squash talent or rower. As it is, the best football and basketball players aren’t looking at the Ivy League -they are targeting places like Duke or Kentucky or Alabama or Ohio State. Programs that turn out a lot of professional athletes.
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The Ivy League is 100% comprised of true student-athletes. Actually, the majority of college athletes across the country are true student athletes. There are, of course, some that are making money and lots of it. But they are a minority.
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Actually, I just saw today that Cornell’s men’s soccer team has an NIL club. It is not officially affiliated with Cornell, but it looks like money donated goes to the athletes.
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100%!!
Regrettably some non athletes (or those without athletic kids) fail to appreciate the amount of dedication, talent and determination it takes to play at a D1 level. When it comes to Ivies those less familiar with these schools often fail to realize just how academically qualified the vast majority of the athletes are. In our case most of the kids on my son’s teams were top of their academic classes, had great test scores, ECs beyond sports and were the captains of various sports teams beyond their collegiate sport.
In my opinion and keeping in mind that many on CC have Ivy athlete children, it is offensive to casually diminish these students by suggesting they were previously not “true student athletes”. Not sure if the implication is that up until now these kids were not “true” students or weren’t “true” athletes, but saying it will now be “refreshing” clearly is intended to cast doubt on one of the two. It would be “refreshing” if posters would not cast shade on other people’s kids.
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And the minority exist everywhere - especially the big 2 sports.
I didn’t say they were not academically qualified to enter a school.
But these examples highlighted in the article certainly put money ahead of other things. They may also have put their potential athletic career ahead of other things. Maybe their desire is to be a pro athlete and they’ll have better training, competition and financials elsewhere.
I don’t blame them.
Remember the Olympics used to be pure. Our best college athletes made up our sport teams.
Then the world went pro.
College has too and a select few have decided to move to places where they can likely grow more skill wise and financially.
And there’s nothing wrong with doing it.
But they will now have obligations beyond being a student athlete. They will now be pitch men.
I wonder if the great Ralph James, who was a top 5 recruit and chose Harvard many years ago - sits back and wonders - what could have been.
I’m sure he’s done well in life but the amounts some of these players are getting, no matter how qualified fir college entry academically, is astounding.
But it doesn’t come just for being.
That’s my point on they are no longer just student athletes.
Duke isn’t an easy in for athletes but they have one and dones.
The entire system stinks. The coaches recruiting committed players, convincing them to enter the protocol stinks. That these student athletes have agents stinks.
This is completely separate and not relevant to are they good students - but it’s also capitalism and it’s their right to take advantage.
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No, it doesn’t. There are thousands of kids at Ivy League, D2,D3, Juco, and even power conferences who get little to no financial gain from participating in college athletics. Football and basketball exist at these places, too.
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Yes - they do and they’re not division one - and I’m only talking about football and basketball - not women’s gymnastics although they have the highest NIL’er.
Even baseball - look at Vandy - top school - three years - off to the pros.
These folks are marketable - and there’s nothing wrong with that.
After all, kids go to college to become accountants, engineers, nurses - whatever.
Some go to be athletes…especially in the big two. It doesn’t work out for any - and the Ivies are not 1A. It doesn’t mean the kids there aren’t worthy of being there and I never said they weren’t - so not sure why that was brought up.
They are in hoops but not in football - but the kids that are “able” - that’s who I’m talking about - they are taking advantage.
And good for them.
My comment was simply harking back to the time when none of this money polluted the game. It was a nicer, cleaner environment.
That’s all I am saying.
I completely disagree with this. The good ol’ days were the days where college teams made huge amounts of money off their underpaid (unpaid except tuition and room & board) athletes. And the ivies wouldn’t even do that. While they’re not directly making money from the athlete, they’d simply say that this is all good for you. This comment from the Princeton athletic director is telling:
“The lifetime value of a Princeton education will trump any NIL deal that student-athletes are going to be offered,” Mack said. “We want our student-athletes to have those opportunities, but what we don’t want is for them to turn down the opportunity to change their life in a long-term way just for the short-term benefit of getting paid to go somewhere else.”
I think this is out-of-date thinking that basically tells athletes, “We know what’s best for you”.
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I’m not talking about for the students - if my kid was in this situation, I’d have him chasing the $$.
I’m just talking about the game - as a fan - as a viewer - as someone who likes the “pureness” of the sport.
Kids out practicing because they love it. Not signing autographs at a car dealer when they could be studying or practicing or taking their girl friend out to dinner. Not wearing gear they don’t believe in.
I’m all for what’s happening in - why shouldn’t kids get to take advantage - it’s capitalistic.
I’m simply noting - as a sports fan, in watching the actual games, turning these amateurs into pros - stinks.
That’s all I’m saying.
PS - I don’t disagree with the Princeton AD - but that line of thinking will, in certain cases, cause students either to not to look at the school or to leave mid stream - and while it may be few, it’s what the article posted was talking about - a great read.
Look at Duncan Robinson on the Miam Heat. Went from D3 Williams to Michigan. He’s clearly of huge academic brilliance and that was never questioned until people decided to change the meaning of my words. But it’s highly unlikely he’d be on the Miami Heat if he stayed at Williams.
And it’s great for him - he chose to be a pro basketball player and he’ll have another career post basketball - whether in the game or in another part of society.
He is a student athlete - but when I was referencing student athlete - I was harking to the days of old - which yes have passed us by many years.
And to repeat, I get it!! I just don’t like it (as a fan). If I’m a kid and family, obviously I’d love it.
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Don’t take this the wrong way, but I’d argue that if all you cared about was watching the game, then nothing has changed. It’s still great to watch and the athletes love what they do. You won’t be disappointed watching them play.
The difference today is that athletes are able to exercise new found rights to get compensated for their effort. That, to me, is what makes it better today.
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It’s the consistency that lacks.
I was reading an article yesterday about the back up qb at USC, #1 recruit in the nation - just transferred to Boise State.
The Boise State head coach told his recruiter - go out and find me a qb. And buy one they did.
Too bad USC fans will miss out on this young man.
The young man loves LA, USC, and Coach Riley. It’s a shame he’ll never take regular snaps for them.
I get what you’re saying, but I think this is fundamentally the wrong view. It’s implying that YOU would be better off if this player wasn’t offered a pile of cash to move. He was offered a choice to play “where he loved” or get paid. He chose to get paid but all the USC fans have lost. I find it very, very hard to think that it was the good ol’ days when players didn’t have that choice.
Nevertheless, we’ve probably derailed this thread, so I’ll stop here.
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I like watching college sports. I can’t imagine there will be much change. The student athletes will still be student athletes. They will be playing to help their teams win, represent their colleges, and improve their own skills.
Right?
Really…no change. They are real student athletes and will continue to be real student athletes.
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Agreed 100%
To those who might conclude the trends detailed in the OP article will lead refreshingly to the emergence of true student athletes at Ivies, I ask where these same students previously not “true” athletes or were they not “true” students in your opinion? In my experience Ivy athletes are and will continue to be the very definition of true student athletes.
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