Would I find accounting interesting?

College Majors Business Majors
1

<p>I’m a high school junior thinking about my future, and after reading [this</a> thread](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/business-major/511865-everything-you-wanted-know-should-know-about-accounting.html]this”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/business-major/511865-everything-you-wanted-know-should-know-about-accounting.html) I wonder if accounting/auditing might be a good career for me. I really enjoy math (especially proofs) and problem solving in general. I also enjoy public speaking and debate. My ideal job would involve lots of logical reasoning and problem solving as well as interaction with people.</p>

<p>I am a frugal person and could probably be happy without a massive salary, but I dislike risk and strongly desire very stable, reliable employment. I am somewhat concerned with the low salaries the bottom 10% of accountants appear to hold ([Accountants</a> and Auditors](<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos001.htm]Accountants”>http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos001.htm), <$34470) - why is the bottom so much lower than the top?</p>

<p>Here are my other questions:</p>

<p>1) What kind of problem solving do accountants and auditors actually do? What does a normal project entail?</p>

<p>2) Do accounting firms (especially the Big 4) provide stable employment, or are layoffs a constant risk?</p>

<p>3) I have decent people skills but am not the sort to participate in a ‘good old boy’ network (I prefer to judge based on merit). Does accounting tend to be very cliquish, or is work quality ultimately valued?</p>

<p>4) How hard are internal audit jobs to get (or does it vary too much to generalize)?</p>

<p>Just in case it matters, I am also considering the following careers: statistician, industrial engineer, actuary, operations research analyst, other engineering.</p>

<p>Thank you!</p>

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<p>You might not get that much advice here; if you can’t find the answers digging through various resources of the internet, I recommend using Yahoo! Answers. Your question is well-thought out and I’m sure anyone with knowledge would be happy to help.</p>

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<p>If you are looking for a lot of logical reasoning and problem solving. Accounting is not for you.</p>

<p>Looking at your other careers, I would choose any of those over accounting, except the operations research analyst. You also might want to look into finance.</p>

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<p>

I have never had a good experience with Yahoo Answers…

Hm… that’s basically the opposite of what Taxguy said in his thread. Could you provide some more details?</p>

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<p>I’d like to know more about question #3 as well.</p>

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<p>It’s because its so easy. It doesn’t really take any brain power. You will see a lot more complex and challenging tasks in many other fields. I have passed the CPA on first try. I have done, corporate accounting, internal audit, Big 4 audit, and tax (individual, corporate). It’s all a joke. I’m working on moving on quick and soon. Good thing I am only 24 and will be ready to move on in 1 year.</p>

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<p>Dawgie, if it’s so easy why are you so desperate to leave?<br>
Do you want more challenging work?
or are there more reasons, things that you didn’t like about a career in accounting?</p>

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<p>@Dawgie: Thanks for the elaboration, but I think it would be far easier to explain your position if you answer question #1 in my OP.</p>

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<p>I’m the type of person that hates doing day to day routine work. I hate repeating s**t that does not improve or stimulate my mind. I kinda answered it, there is no real problem solving involved.</p>

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<p>@Dawgie, what are you looking at doing now? Corporate finance, banking, or something like that? I’m not a fan of unstimulating work like that either, that’s why I’m asking.</p>

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<p>Big 4 advisory, valuation -> Top MBA -> anything that challenges me at the time.</p>

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<p>Noimagination asks,"1) What kind of problem solving do accountants and auditors actually do? What does a normal project entail?</p>

<p>Respnse: When Dawgie says everything is repetitive, A lot depends on the firm and the project that you are on. Both my sons , who are in auditors with midsize firms, didn’t feel there was a lot of repitition. In fact, my son Matt, got a very interesting job preparing a dozen cash flow statements and balance sheet, where there were holes in the information given him. He had to do some interesting problem solving in order to properly complete these statements. Matt was also given some tax returns to prepare too beceause he wanted the experience.My other son fel that each client was different and had different approaches to each audit.</p>

<p>Beginning accountants at big 4 firms usually aren’t given too much sophisticated work. However, the work does get harder and more sophisticated. Again, let me repeat this, the caliber and type of work does vary with the nature of the client, type of accounting firm, position held within the firm, and even on the experience level of the accountant.</p>

<p>2) Do accounting firms (especially the Big 4) provide stable employment, or are layoffs a constant risk?</p>

<p>Response: I will give you a clear cut answer: it depends. If you have a strong work ethic, good skills and good decent people skills, accounting can be fairly stable since companies need accountants in both good and bad economies. The big4, howwever, are known to have layoffs. In addition, the big 4 tends to week oiut the bottom 10% of the performers each year. If they feel that you don’t have the ability to make partner eventually, they usually notify you to get a job. Many of these folks, however, do get jobs with their clients. Understand, as I noted in post one, “Everything you should know or want to know abouit accounting,” accouinting is a weed out profession in many ways. The courses try to weed you out. The CPA exam is very tough and, thus, weeds folks out. Even accounting positions, especially at big 4 firms are weed out positions in that they usually fire the bottom 10% each year to make up for new arrivals, al least this was the way they worked 30 years ago. Maybe this has changed,but I doubt it.</p>

<p>No industry is immune to layoffs except maybe doctors. Even lawyers just got laid off in mass recently. However, overall, accounting tends to be a more stable field than most because people, with good skills and work ethics, can usually find jobs throughout their life. I have never seen accountants, that I know personally, ever be unemployed for any significant period of time. </p>

<p>3) I have decent people skills but am not the sort to participate in a ‘good old boy’ network (I prefer to judge based on merit). Does accounting tend to be very cliquish, or is work quality ultimately valued?</p>

<p>Response:Politics is always important anywhere you go! Say that five times. All firms want people that fit into the culture. Yes, merit and work quality are very important,but so is adapting to the culture of the firm. Let’s face it, no one is going to make people partners that they don’t like or get along with.
"</p>

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<p>Accounting has little problem solving :(</p>

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<p>you can take an intro course in accounting and see whether or not you like it.</p>

<p>im taking the first course of the accounting series (my school offers a bunch for those wanting to take CPA exams) and i’m enjoying it alot.</p>

<p>it really isnt my “thing” but it has taught me alot about business procedure /process more than any other course i have taken so far.</p>

<p>alot of my courses crossover and the stuff you learn in each course can be applied in many ways.</p>

<p>i find that something truly enjoyable rather than learning about “stuff” where i cant seem to apply it on a daily basis.</p>

<p>after a semester or two you’ll know for sure if you want to be an accounting major.
and i think BIG 4 jobs dont pay that low… (at least around here)</p>

15

<p>Thanks for the additional perspectives.</p>

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<p>Hey dawgie, did you by any chance work in the tax department at the Big 4? A few people I talked to said they found he work more challenging/stimulating than audit, so I was wondering if you have any comments on that? The only problem thy say with tax is that you can only exit to tax consulting or become an attorney after getting your JD, but aside from the limited exit ops, do you think tax might be better for people looking for an intellectual challenge?</p>

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<p>Possibly, I cannot comment on something I have no experience in so I won’t really comment. But rule of thumb is accounting was never designed to be very challenging. All said and done, I still believe experience at Big 4 audit is very valuable for your own personal growth.</p>

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<p>I wanted to know more about question #3 and found this while searching…</p>

<hr>

<p>There is a high degree of politics that reside within the Big4Firms. While there are politics in all organizations, the politics that reside within the Big4Firms take a unique characteristic provided the nature of the business.</p>

<p>Favoritism & Diversity</p>

<p>Employees of Big 4 Firms do not have one “boss” and work for different partners on varying accounts. This is different from private industry whereby people typically have one or two bosses whom they consistently report to. This increases the level and amount of favoritism that comes into play when selecting and supporting staff and management to serve the firm’s clients. </p>

<p>As part of human nature, it is normal that people will identify with and support people who think, act, and look like them. Supporting such homogeneity within a business like public accounting, which thrives on differing perspectives and ideas to serve clients as their trusted business advisor, leads to a decline in the quality of professional service that is rendered to clients. For example, employees of the Big 4 Firms are given opportunities to serve on certain clients that will ultimately play a key factor in determining their career progression and success with the firm. </p>

<p>Many staffing decisions in the Big4Firms are based on favoritism and perceptions of certain employees. There are situations whereby the more talented employees of the Big4Firms are not given the proper opportunities and support based on the favoritism and perceptions (not reality) that are cast upon them. While it is human nature to gravitate towards people who exhibit certain characteristics, a key aspect of providing quality professional services is based on the diverse perspectives and talents of the firm’s employees and not based on the homogeneity of the teams that serve the clients.</p>

<p>Catch 22’s</p>

<p>As part of the politics within the Big 4 Firms, there are many Catch 22 situations, or situations whereby the direction, guidance, and requests are contradictory. Especially with the economic downturn in 2008, there has been immense pressure on audit engagement team to find efficiencies in the audits while requiring an increase in minimal chargeable hours. These two pressures are contradictory in nature.</p>

<p>This is coupled with the increasingly complex and additional audit requirements that audit teams must utilize in order to properly conduct an audit. Increased oversight of the public accounting profession and an increased level of audit requirements make it difficult to attain efficiencies while adhering to the required audit standards and audit documentation requirements. While certain efficiencies can be attained in many audits, there is an inherent limitation in the amount of efficiencies that can be implemented while maintaining high quality client service and performing a quality audit.</p>

<p>Do More with Less</p>

<p>Based on the staffing and leverage models utilized by the Big 4 Firms, there is increasing pressure to “leverage down” the audit work to less experienced (and cheaper) audit staff. While leveraging work down to younger professionals provides a valuable learning experience, there must be proper guidance, on-the-job training, and oversight of the younger professionals.</p>

<p>In addition, many staffing and scheduling situations are resolved by having the staff work a ridiculous number of hours at times to meet tight deadlines with limited resources. After working over 50 or so hours in a week, a human’s productivity and cognitive abilities diminish. Based on the nature of the deadlines and staffing models, many key areas of audits or the riskier audit areas are often handled at a time that is close to the deadline. </p>

<p>While the Big 4 Firms have good quality control measures in place, the volume and nature of the work that is performed under conditions of excessive work hours still remains. The employees of the Big4Firms represent fixed costs to the firm since the employees are paid a set salary regardless of the number of chargeable hours worked in a week.</p>

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<p>Noimagination,If you are looking for stable employment you might want to look at government work.In industry ,especially now, employment is “at will” and nothing is assured,even in accounting.As to pay, many accounting jobs just don’t pay well.If you have a very unique skill, are in upper levels of the "big four"or of industry,or run your own accounting firm you will probably be proud of your salary ,otherwise it is likely that you will not. Also ,firms ,both public and private like to use people and then have them train your replacement(I saw that firsthand in accounting).As I have said elsewhere, if you can find another way to make a living (other than accounting )you might be better off.</p>

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<p>Almost a year old thread. You’re dumb.</p>