I just made an appointment to have impacted cerumen (ear wash) removed.
After several attempts to schedule around my hours, the attendant cleared hurdles to get me in. (I’m at a large PPO)
Then, as we ended the call, she says "Your appointment will be with ‘Ellie Walker’ our NP on this day.
I remembered the name. The last time I saw her, she said she was “Dr. Ellie”. I thought it was weird because everyone at intake had mentioned, my seeing the “NP”.
I saw her badge that indicated, RNP and Ph.D Health. When I looked up the name on the clinic website, it indicated that she was an NP but that she also had a health education background.
She doesn’t have an MD. Not that it matters, when I’m having a minor procedure done, but I really felt uncomfortable with her presentation as a physician in a clinical setting. Also, her bedside manner was not professional.
I have lots of friends that are physicians; I also have friends who are very good nurse practitioners who wouldn’t dream of misrepresenting themselves.
I did tell my primary physician, at the follow-up visit, who seemed surprised, but indicated she would speak to the NP and the staff.
Am I being too restrictive or picky?
Should I just go to the local urgent care? They are very good.
Dr Ellie has every right to the title. She has a PhD. This is a situation that one often sees in the mental health field where there are psychiatrists who are MDs and therapists with Phds that both go by the title “Dr”.
So, Dr Ellie is not misrepresenting herself. You did not understand that Dr does not only me medical doctor. A lot of non medical doctors out there, far more than medical doctors. The letters MD after a name indicate Medical Doctor.
Someone with a PhD can properly be addressed as “Doctor”. DD has plenty of profs that go by Dr. So and so vs. Professor So and so. I don’t see the problem.
I agree that she can use ‘Dr’ with the PhD. It might be confusing to you and it’s fine to ask, but the explanation should have been that she is a NP but also a PhD. almost all the PhD’s I know who work in mental health use Dr. as a title, licenses or not.
Someone with a PhD being addressed “Doctor ___” is not doing anything dishonest.
However, it could be misinterpreted in a health care context, if people assume that “Doctor __” automatically means that has an MD (or DO) degree.
An analogous situation would be that an autopilot in an airplane or a Tesla car is a high feature cruise control (not a self flying or driving device), and the operator must pay attention at all times and be ready to take over when needed. But many people seem to think that the autopilot in a Tesla car is a self driving device.
I suspect any RNP with a Ph.D Is well worth seeing. You should be so lucky as to have an RN with a masters level and doctorate level education to suck the wax from your ear lOL, who knows what you would get at your UC. My kid was in a hospital based UC (totally excellent) but they all wore scrubs. The person who stocked the cupboards looked like the guy who administered the ketamine who looked like the ANP who looked like the NA. I seriously could not tell you who was who.
I try and find NPs to go to for family care, lady care, teen contraceptives. They have way more time and bedside manners.
I don’t think that would matter to most consumers though. The UC is going to show you to a room and someone who is not likely to be a medical doc would do the minor procedures. There won’t be time to do a background check.
[quote]
You did not understand that Dr does not only me medical doctor. A lot of non medical doctors out there, far more than medical doctors. The letters MD after a name indicate Medical Doctor. /quote
In practice, the NP title works. Sometimes I prefer NP’s. Physicians, DO’s, psychiatrists, have the titles to examine and treat.
When she said that she was a doctor and said that she would be treating me, that’s when my ears perked up. If she had said, “I’m the nurse practitioner”, I wouldn’t have had an issue. She never indicated, to me, that she was an NP.
(She earned the Ph.D. in health education. So she has earned her “Doctor” status).
My niece has this degree. I don’t think my niece would be in a clinical setting and begin a visit with, “I’m Dr. Ellie and I’m going to examine you.”
There were a number of elderly patients in the waiting room.
I totally understand you. In a medical practice physicians are addressed as “Dr.”, a PhD in any other field is an awkward situation- it is a misrepresentation given the place. I am glad you addressed this issue with a physician. I am a physician and no matter how highly degreed a nurse does NOT have the same knowledge base as a physician. I do not consider the PhD in nursing to be at all the same as an MD or DO degree. Yes, nurse practitioners will have daily routine knowledge that many of we physicians do not. But- we studied so much they did not. Routine things do not always need the MD/DO’s expertise but any good NP will be able to recognize out of the ordinary and refer to the expert.
You got me on my soapbox. We only see the tip of the iceberg of medical knowledge- it’s the other 90% I care about as well. Doing routine procedures is different than making a diagnosis
Even worse, you can get a doctorate in nursing that is neither an MD or a PhD.
The profession is phasing out the MSN (master of science in nursing) that usually goes along with becoming a nurse practitioner and requiring a doctorate of nursing. One reason why they are doing that is to keep up with other medical professions, such as physical therapy that are requiring this type of doctorate.
I saw an RN who was referred to as “doctor” and he didn’t have a PhD either. I was little surprised, but not totally, because I have a daughter who is a nurse and unless she had immediately jumped into an NP program right after graduating, she’s lost her chance to become an NP with “only” a MSN. All the schools have changed this requirement in the last few years so we’ll be seeing a lot more doctor nurses in the future.
I thought no she is misrepresenting herself. I would probably keep the appointment but not make another with her since you didn’t really like her that much.
My H and a couple of my kids have to get their ears done every few years. If my H goes to the urgent care it’s usually the nurse who does it. I think my D recently had it done by a nurse as well.
I ordered several years ago from Amazon a kit that clears the wax. It is similar to what the urgent care uses. It works great and it saves my H a trip to the Dr.
I think it’s appropriate to call nurses who have doctorate degrees “Dr. Jones” in the academic setting. In the clinical setting, it could certainly be confusing. Having Dr. Jones, Ph.D on her lab coat seems fine, but referring to herself as “Dr. Ellie” in a medical setting seems a little bit on the iffy side to me.
Agree with OP that this was a misrepresentation of credentials. And it isn’t analogous to PhDs in psychology, who are specifically trained and licensed to render mental health care.
That said, so many health fields now award “doctor” degrees-pharmacy/physical therapy/nursing-that didn’t used to that some hospitals have requested that all explain to any patient what type of doctor that provider is.
I’ve read that in some states DNPs, Doctorate of Nursing Practice may not call themselves “Dr.” in a clinical setting. It seems inappropriate to me when the intent may be to confuse who is the MD and who is a nurse’