WSJ: why is everyone sober-ish all of a sudden?

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I gave up drinking over 10 years ago due to negative effects on sleeping but I have noticed that many in my friend circle are drinking less or not at all.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/why-is-everyone-sober-ish-all-of-a-sudden-33b5703b?st=mwoQ5L&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink

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New York Times has an article in today’s paper saying alcohol related deaths have doubled in 2 decades. Apparently there was a big increase in drinking at the beginning of the pandemic and it has not subsided.

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I thought this part of the article was interesting, where the author said:

The sober-ish life also leads to peculiar new etiquette frontiers. One friend of mine observed, “When you go out to dinner with someone now and the waiter comes to take the drink order and they say, ‘just water for me,’ you know that person is saving their glass of wine for a better dinner. They are not committing to the evening. You’re not worth a drink.”

My gut take on that paragraph:
Well
THAT is a bit of a self-absorbed point of view for the author’s friend to take. Why is it so offensive for somebody to NOT drink? What is the big deal? Maybe the person doesn’t drink hardly at ALL and their reason for not drinking at dinner has NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU? People who get all worked up over somebody not drinking are usually people I end up not wanting to hang out with very much
mostly because they’re pushy and rude.

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I found these 2 comments interesting given they’re relatively close together in the article. Why the admiration for those who drink excessively? Is it nostalgia for the parties remembered from decades ago? I think the glamorizing of drinking/partying seems less prevalent these days in my kids circles. Maybe boomers and millennials look back fondly on those days?

I related to the second paragraph, even though I don’t drink at all, because I do find that dinner conversations with friends are as much if not more fun and substantial when everyone isn’t 3 sheets to the wind.

I can’t help admiring my friends and family who are still excessive and careless, who still go for the third martini.

After half a glass of wine, I couldn’t help noticing that I had better, more substantive conversations with more of them than I recall having at past parties when I might have had more to drink. I talked to everyone I wanted to talk to. I made sure that everyone mixed. To my surprise, as I was blowing out candles and throwing away plastic cups, I realized that I probably had more fun than I would have had on a tipsier night.

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I discovered alcohol in college, and it helped introverted me become more extroverted. It also helped me say stupid things, along with other embarrassing and/or undesirable side effects. I left that behind when I left college, and I have zero interest in seeming more interesting or fun as a result of alcohol use. I wonder how old the author is? I suspect that for many, the older they get, the less their friends will party.

One thing I think causes people to be sober or sober-ish when they are out? Drinking and driving is not dismissed with a warning like it often was when I was young. Unless they are taking an Uber, a lot of people will limit their drinking to limit the chance of being pulled over (or being in an accident).

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Alcohol is a neurotoxin and no level is safe for our health.

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I found this writer obnoxious.

I think kids today are using other things to alter their moods.

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I scrolled below the article and found this piece. :joy:

Is This the Golden Age of Happy Hour? Why the After-Work Ritual Is Better Than Ever

https://www.wsj.com/arts-culture/food-cooking/happy-hour-is-back-and-so-much-better-than-it-used-to-be-1f966c65?mod=WTRN_pos7&cx_testId=3&cx_testVariant=cx_176&cx_artPos=6

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Fair and balanced coverage :grin:.

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I’ve always been a teetotaler. I just never cared much for alcohol and prefer to consume calories I like more. My nephew gave up alcohol when he realized he felt better after having giving it up for lent so he gave it up permanently. Everyone does what they prefer. I never mean to slight anyone by stating I prefer water—that is truly my preference and has always been. Most people I know are NOT offended by my ordering water.

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I enjoy wine and certain cocktails. Same for H. When we entertain, we offer a variety of drinks - with and without alcohol. I do not recall anyone ever being shamed for not drinking, or even anyone remarking on it. That seems to be the norm among my friends - some drink, some don’t , no one over does it and no one cares. Same when we go out to dinner.

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I honestly don’t even notice whether people are drinking alcohol. It’s weird to me that others would judge someone harshly who doesn’t drink.

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I’ve noticed that only problem drinkers comment or question non drinkers on their choice. No one else cares one way or the other.

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This topic is something I’m uniquely qualified to give insights on.

People in the U.S. aren’t exactly drinking less, but there are certainly headwinds for the alcohol industry in general. Beer is flat, to down slightly, because the craft category is headed towards a correction, domestic light beer is struggling and the seltzer category is contracting. Certain imports, on the other hand, are doing quite well(Modelo, Guinness).

Ready to drink beverages(RTDs), think High Noon, have been industry disruptors that grew exponentially at the expense of traditional malt beverages like seltzer and PABs like Smirnoff Ice and Mike’s Lemonade.

Legalized marijuana has also replaced alcohol for some consumers. Segments of the drinking public have also transitioned towards spirits. Wine, on the other hand, is down more than most people realize.

Another unconventional drag on alcohol consumption is the popularity of online gambling apps. Young men specifically are more likely to sit at home and gamble on live sports rather than head to a sports bar with friends to watch the action.

I can tell you that my company is up slightly for the year in volume, but we’re doing even better in terms of GP. High end products still continue to do well despite the economy. We’re also more heavily skewed towards the on-premise(bars & restaurants) which translates to higher margins and increased profitability.

The trend towards non-alcoholic beers has been surprising, but we sell some of the market leaders so we’re well positioned to weather the storm.

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Ah, I quit drinking earlier this year to help with my sleep! It was easier for me to quit completely than to drink only socially.

Replying to original comment in this thread @vpa2019

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My husband listened to a podcast and gave up drinking completely. He thinks he feels better and has enjoyed exploring non-alcoholic cocktails. I tried not drinking for a couple of months, but I really like the way wine tastes. I’ve been recording sleep for the last year and as far as I can tell a glass of whatever has no effect on quantity or quality of sleep. I drink one glass of wine on weekend nights at home, or one cocktail at a restaurant at a party I’ll have a little more over the course of a long evening.

We know lots of people who don’t drink any more.

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I know of just a few friends who have completely quit drinking. I haven’t observed anyone giving them a hard time.

This article sounds like nonsense. I’ve also read that the pandemic saw an increase in alcohol consumption that has not diminished. I’ve read that doctors are seeing more and more (and younger) patitents with liver disease, although it’s possible that the increase may be associated with the rising rates of obesity and non alcoholic fatty liver disease.

At any rate, I’m not buying that “everyone” is “sober-ish”, and the person who takes someone declining a glass of wine as a personal insult needs to get a life.

I struggle with insomnia, and in the middle of the night watch lots of YouTube videos. With the easy availability of police dash cams and body cams nowadays, there are entire channels devoted to showing what cops have to put up with in terms of dealing with drunk and disorderly individuals. It’s mind boggling to see how obnoxious and awful people behave who are under the influence of alcohol. I have never seen anyone in person ever act like many of these people, but it has been eye opening to see just how awful some people can become when they’ve had far too much to drink. I could never muster the patience that these officers display in the face of such disgusting behavior.

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This is 100% me. And also nowadays I’d rather eat my calories than drink them and it’s soooooooo much cheaper!

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I was a beer drinker in college and afterwards - mixed drinks were to expensive for my young self and I never got into them. (I don’t even know if “mixed drinks” is the right term - LOL.)

I was never a heavy drinker but as I got older I found drinking beer made me hot (and not the good, “you look hot” kind either!) I occasionally have one - usually splitting it with one of my kids.

One of my mid-twenties kids does not drink. They have tried things on occasion but it is just not their thing. And I tell them that they aren’t missing anything
except a very large bar bill. LOL

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I didn’t see it covered in the article, but I would guess that one contributing factor to a rise in sober-ish people (or a rise in their noticeability) is the concurrent rise in non-AA based “quitting” or nondrinking programs.

It used to be that AA was the one and only gold standard for quitting alcohol, and it came with a lot of steps and actions and processes. I’ve had people tell me that it felt sometimes too focused on shame and the concept of “rock bottom”.

There’s a new genre of literature (and many podcasts) that simply focus on the the health benefits of quitting or reducing alcohol, and not so much on the embarrassing behavior that can accompany drinking. And it feels easier to talk about when we say “oh I stopped drinking because it was interfering with my sleep,” (Which semi-applies to me too!!) rather than “I’m not drinking because I’m an alcoholic and make bad decisions when I drink”.

The “quit lit” I’m talking about first started appearing around 10 years ago and was mostly geared towards women - books like Quit Like a Woman for instance. Now I see that there are popular male podcasters like Huberman who are relating more or less the same message, which is that reducing alcohol intake is a health decision and doesn’t need to be wrapped up in behavioral/societal complications.

Another factor may be that the rise in phone/screen use over the last 10-15 yrs has interfered with sleep for so many people that many of us have had to really work hard to regain sovereignty over our sleep hygiene :grimacing:

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