Yale [$70k] vs UVA Jefferson Scholarship [full ride]

College Search & Lists
,
1

Hey everyone! I find myself in an incredibly privileged situation and wanted to get some advice. I was accepted Yale REA and after fin aid we’re looking at about 70k a year. Bottom line-- we can realistically afford this, but not without some financial discomfort. Jefferson Scholars at UVA and Stamps Scholars at USC get a full ride plus perks.

Some additional info–

  • I want to go into law, politics, or finance (I will be paying for law school no matter what, no parental contribution)
  • My heart is dead set on Yale but the cost seems unjustifiable
  • One of my parents is retired and the other is going to retire soon so our fin aid at Yale should go up over four years

Would emailing Yale and asking them to reconsider their aid in light of these new scholarships be wise? I know they “match” (though they don’t like to call it that) offers from peer schools, but obviously UVA and USC aren’t that.

2

Would you be happy with Yale responding, “We wish you luck at UVA?”

They won’t match merit scholarships, so don’t even ask. If the need-based offer differed dramatically from the NPC, you’d have a valid reason for requesting a reevaluation.

For 70k a year difference, I’m hard pressed to find a valid reason to attend Yale.

10 Likes
3

I may be wrong about this, but I don’t believe Yale will match a merit aid award–just a financial aid award.

In terms of determining how much Yale FA will award once your parents are both retired, you should run the NPC and input projected income and assets during full retirement. The outcome will be in today’s dollars, but it will give you an idea of the amount of aid you will receive once both parents are retired.

2 Likes
4

Yale aid depends both on income and assets. If both parents are retiring and can still afford (albeit with difficulty) 200k+, it would seem that your aid package may face some headwinds. There is also a look back period as to assets if not income.

Yale all the way. Two objective reasons. Multiple studies have shown that the Yale brand will significantly enhance your likelihood of admission to a top professional school (MBA or JD). Second, you are being recognized as a top prospective student at UVA and USC. At Yale, you will probably not be the top. Better to be a medium fish in a big pond for your own development. By the time most students get to Yale, they’ve had a lifetime of being the big fish in their pond. Being just somebody is a unique opportunity for growth. What athlete wouldn’t want the chance to train with the Olympic team?

It’s hard to imagine a better college experience than Yale. Having close family and individual experience, it’s much, much better than Harvard’s and Princeton’s, Dartmouth’s and MIT’s undergrad life. Cohesive, interesting, occasionally off-the-charts brilliant people with a great sense of camaraderie. There is a real sense of community, even if you’re not Skull and Bones. Boola.

3 Likes
5

So your soph year FA is baked in already, it will be based on 2023 income (and other financials). 2024 will inform junior year aid, 2025 senior year.

Also income is only one part of Yale’s FA formula, assets also play an important role. I agree with ct1417…you can run Yale’s NPC using 2023, 2024, and 2025 financial estimates to understand how changes in your parents’ income may impact FA. Make sure to increase tuition and room and board costs by 5% each year too (the NPC won’t do that).

I also agree Yale won’t entertain matching merit offers. I am not sure what you mean when you say paying $70K would result in financial discomfort…that’s for you and your parents to decide what makes sense. I wouldn’t hesitate to take the UVA offer, you can achieve all of your goals from there.

It’s always easy for other people to tell you and your parents how to spend your money.

2 Likes
6

I would take a free ride to UVA over $70k to Yale in a heartbeat. I would prob do that for a school a lot less prestigious than UVA. In this case it’s an easy call.

9 Likes
7

You had me at financial discomfort.

If it wasn’t UVA but it was WVU and you want to end up in law school, I’d have the same answer.

Yes, Yale is not justifiable - think about how much easier your family’s life is going to be with an extra $300K - and perhaps they’ll use it to help you in law school or graduate business school - but that’s a lot of jack for retirement, etc.

Look at a school like Harvard - 147 colleges are represented in their law school - colleges like Brooklyn College, DePaul, Georgia State, Kansas State, South Dakota School of Mines, The College of NJ, UCF, U of Kansas, Mizzou, and the mentioned above WVU.

So Yale meets need - and unless you can find $70K more of need, not worth trying.

Here’s the other thing - at Yale, you’d be one of everyone.

At UVA, you’d be not one of everyone - but one of a few and all that comes with a Jefferson Scholarship - will come with enrichment including funded study abroad.

Here’s the other thing - your heart should never be dead set in this regard - nowhere is perfect - everywhere has bad food, profs, roommates, etc. And there are likely many schools where you can have a great experience - and there’s hundreds of schools that can get you to a fantastic grad school.

And yet you have access to the top program at not just any school but arguably the top public in the country. And South Carolina is no slouch either.

A “it was my dream” - I get it - and it’s hard. But with $300K more in the families pocket and access to enrichment set aside for the superstars - especially with grad school in the offing - there’s no way Yale makes any sense - in my humble opinion. The minute you said financial discomfort - I was out :slight_smile: As a parent, we want to do for our kids but when you can get to the exact same place, why should we be strained? And it’s likely just not today - but in the future leading up all the way and into retirement.

Best of luck. And congrats - I mean, all three you mentioned - OUTSTANDING. You hard work has paid off and you have rewarded your family

8 Likes
8

I would choose UVA. Congrats!!!

1 Like
9

Yes, you should communicate with Yale admissions/financial aid officers and inform them of your situation and concerns.

Doubtful that any poster is authorized to speak on behalf of Yale University admissions & financial aid.

Congratulations on your outstanding offers from University of Virginia & from USC (South Carolina).

At Yale, the other students will be true peers–and this will create a vibrant learning environment while potentially making significant life-long connections.

USC Stamps/Honors College and U Virginia Jefferson Scholars will group you with Yale level students while also offering a more diverse community in many respects.

You need to consider carefully all of your options, but contact Yale admissions prior to making a final decision.

Were you accepted to other schools ? Rejected/wait-listed by any schools ?

10

Which is a significant advantage for you and your intellectual development.

11

70K will “cause some discomfort”. UVA will give you a free ride AND extras like international travel. If you’re already stretched at 70K, your non-tuition activities will cause even more of a strain. If you, rather than your parents, end up paying for them, that’s less money for law school. Also, anything can happen financially over the next few years. What if a parent has medical needs or an unexpected financial glitch?

I’d take UVA in a heartbeat. You won’t ever have to think about unexpected expenses for traveling, socializing, or career opportunities. S23 recently took a paid summer job that will put him on the fast track for career opportunities but will cost us about 8K to cover travel, storage, housing, and other incidentals that his low pay will not. He will also have to go a summer semester for a particular course which we did not figure into financials. It’s great to have enough wiggle room that you will not even think about the feasibility of choices like these.

UVA is a great program and you’ll also be part of a cohort of exceptional students who are given exceptional opportunities. Both of my kids ended up as honors students at state schools and I think the personalization, yet having all of the resources of a large school, are a spectacular combination. I love that they are in a program that challenges them intellectually but are also a part of a large community that mirrors the demographics of the society they will be living and working in after college.

9 Likes
12

Financial discomfort = you can’t realistically afford this.

4 Likes
13

Different families and students have different priorities. There is a serious anti-elite/go for cheap bias on this site. Not the way all families roll. Also had a kid get into Yale SCEA and had a merit scholarship at a public school’s honors program on par with UVA. Told my kid I’d split the difference in what he would save. He chose Yale, had a great 4 years and pulled in 6 figures in his first job after graduation. Maybe the same result if he went to the public, but the path would have been more difficult.

I am also with @HNH that undergrad does matter in law school admissions. People like to point to how many schools are represented at HLS, but they don’t tell you what the concentration is from students from HYPS and other T20’s. Then there always arises the causation vs correlation arguments, e.g. HYPS/T20’s grads have proven themselves to be better test takers. I linked a NYT article that examined where SCOTUS clerks graduated from and part of that study looked into which undergrads made up the HLS classes apart from clerkships. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/06/us/supreme-court-ivy-league-harvard-yale.html?unlocked_article_code=1.dE0.klze.uKoprMrcDhQs&smid=url-share In pertinent part:

" The study, which considered 22,475 Harvard Law graduates, took account of three data points: where they went to college, whether they qualified for academic honors in law school (graduating cum laude, magna cum laude or summa cum laude) and whether they obtained a Supreme Court clerkship.

"About half of the graduates had attended one of 22 selective undergraduate institutions, and more than a fifth of the graduates had gone to college at Harvard, Yale or Princeton."

So while HLS may have representatives from “147” undergrad institutions, more than 20% come from HYP and about 50% come from 22 elites. To me this significant overrepresentation means that law school AO’s definitely consider undergrad, not just GPA and LSAT, as many try to push on this site.

11 Likes
14

I agree with the above. Some threads are too much of an echo chamber.

5 Likes
15

That is Harvard Law today- not historically.

147 schools are represented - 2023/24- not over years and 22K grads. And it’s the 1L class - so 561 enrollees - so there can’t be “that much” concentration.

Yes - there will be a higher concentration of kids from certain schools at Harvard Law than others - so to your point maybe there’s one from Kansas and 20 from Yale.

But that’s the same reason the kid went to Yale to begin with - statistically, he was higher overall and could get in. Most, but not all kids, that go to Yale wouldn’t choose Kansas over it. But that kid who did - if they were elite when they went to Kanas, will likely still be elite when applying to Law School. Studs remain studs and there are studs everywhere!!

And we are not talking about any schools - but I will stick with my argument - we are talking about the Jeff Scholarship at UVA and frankly, we aren’t talking about the Stamps at U of SC - but it (and all Stamps scholarships) is also prestigious.

Thanks

1 Like
16

Well 561 kids are represented by 147 institutions - there’s variance - no one is shut out just because they don’t go elite…that’s the point.

But again - the student is going elite - no one will argue UVA isn’t elite - and UVA Jefferson - is off the charts elite.

4 Likes
17

We are in a similar situation where my son basically has a free ride to one school with honors program and paid travel abroad and accepted to another top 20 school. We talked it through and we decided that the scholarship and honors program is just too good to pass up so we are going to that school. It really is how driven and hardworking the person is that makes the difference not the college and there’s something to be said in graduating without any loan debt over your head. Also being in special program makes you a big fish which translates into lots of opportunities.

18

I would rather my kid be part of a special program at UVA where I know he/she will be treated especially well and taken care of, then just another kid at Yale. UVA is not a normal public- it is elite in and of itself. this is UVA we are talking about- that name carries clout.

and sure, you can come out of Yale and make a killer salary if that’s your goal- and sadly that’s probably what most Yale and Harvard grads do with their advantages, follow the $.

but imagine the freedom and flexibility of graduating with all that money saved and being able to choose your career based on love and passion and not be worried about the financial part? I would want that for my kid (and would have loved that for myself).

9 Likes
19

UVA may sound great to the college confidential cognoscenti, but how many people on the street would speak UVA (any program) in the same breath as Yale? That also includes a lifetime of prospective employers, not all of whom have the time I apparently do to scroll these boards.

Think about this - An elite student finds an amazing girlfriend junior year and their GPA drops from 3.8 to 3.2. Would you rather enter the workforce with a 3.2 GPA from UVA or a 3.2 GPA from Yale? It happens, and I know who I’d rather be.

4 Likes
20

The data in this study covered 30 years, going back all the way to 1980. Law school admissions have changed a bit over the past three and a half decades as law schools, like undergrad, seek more diversity, including in undergraduate schools.

Being a Jefferson scholar will be a separate line item on your cv and it is extremely prestigious. And then there are the perks. There was a student at my son’s school that turned down Harvard for the Morehouse at UNC.

If there were more of a prestige gap between your options, I might advise differently, but I would strongly encourage UVA.

2 Likes