Yet another thread against Affirmative Action (boo)

[FountainSiren]

<p>Greybeard wins the award for best rationalization of AA (post#14). </p>

<p>From the college administrator’s point of view it makes sense–the campus, like a crop, is diversified. However, it is less clear that it makes sense–across the board–for the student shoot or bulb who will bring diversity to the campus or crop–for some, of course it will, for others it seems like it offers little more than squeezing a cabbage plant into a corn field. It may make for a rich harvest but I am loath to take a position on the gerrymandering of AA; simply put, it has become too complicated.</p>

[UVADeanJ]

<p>I’m not going to share my opinion on this matter. However, you should be clear that you are addressing the use of race in college admission (unless you want to tackle Affirmative Action’s effects in other areas).</p>

<p>Interestingly, a colleague just sent [url=<a href=“Home - Center for the Education of Women | University of Michigan”>Home - Center for the Education of Women | University of Michigan]this</a> report<a href=“opens%20a%20PDF”>/url</a> to me today. It’s about Prop 209 (in CA) and the possible effects of similar legislation in Michigan. I found it very interesting.</p>

[ariesathena]

<p>FountainSiren: Correct. Please also note that the only rationalisation for AA that was accepted as being constitutional was the diversity of ideas/First Amendment argument - that schools have a First Amendment right to create a classroom with many viewpoints.</p>

<p>Other rationalisations (amelioration of past wrongs; creation of future doctors/lawyers/college grads who will be role models and providers in the minority community) were deemed to not pass constitutional muster. </p>

<p>Of course, that only applies to public schools - private schools are allowed to discriminate (although note the indirect conflict with Ruynon v. McCrary).</p>

[sybbie719]

<p>

i think depriving many “more qualified” white/asian kids from the top colleges is unfair.

</p>

<p>This statement sound more like a case of entitlement. Who said the college admissions process was fair? To piggyback on alterego’s statement, the playing field has never been level and the process has never been fair. </p>

<p>At the crux of the biggest AA rants are a handful of schools (ivies, elite Lacs and that ilk) that have been for the most part it has been part of an admissions system which for many years has mostly been dictated by race and money.</p>

<p>The 64,000 question is What consititues fair? is it just about grades and scores? And what about those grades and scores? How does one determine which kid got high scores by the sweat of their brow and which kids, have been extensively prepped for them. Lets keep in mind that test prep(kaplan, kumon, princeton review, the local mega academy or cram school) is raking in big bucks with no shortage of customers. which kid got perfect scores as a result of purchasing the 9.95 book and taking the test one time, vs. how many got great scores based on multiple sittings (single highest score), or best score from each section over multiple sittings? How many students have test prep right at thier high schools? </p>

<p>Want to see some real panic, let the test change to some arbitrary day in school where students have to walk in cold and take it like a pop quiz. The result would be anarchy. Or hey, let’s have everyone sign a sworn affidavit stating how they were prepped for the exam where you woudl be assessed in context of how much prep you were given. Again, total anarchy.</p>

<p>To piggyback on Aries’ post, discrimination does take place in many forms: You woudl be suprised at the amount of discrimination that takes place in housing and in hiring just based on seing an ethnic sounding name on paper.

A new study shows you don’t have to be African-American to face discrimination in the pursuit of rental housing, you just have to have a name that sounds as if you may be.</p>

<p>The study’s authors sent more than 1,100 identically worded e-mail inquiries to Los Angeles-area landlords asking about vacant apartments advertised online. The inquiries were signed randomly, with an equal number signed Patrick McDougall, Tyrell Jackson or Said Al-Rahman. The fictional McDougall received positive or encouraging replies from 89 percent of the landlords, while Al-Rahman was encouraged by 66 percent of the landlords.</p>

<p>Only 56 percent, however, responded positively to Jackson.</p>

<p>A “positive response” from a landlord was an e-mail saying that the apartment was still open, or an invitation to come view the property. A “negative” response was a reply that the apartment had already been rented or the lack of a reply at all.</p>

<p>Results of the research were published recently in the Journal of Applied Social Psychology.</p>

<p>“Los Angeles is one of the most diverse cities in the world, but it’s clear that housing discrimination exists and that it begins long before a landlord meets a prospective tenant,” said William E. Loges, an assistant professor of new media communications and sociology at Oregon State University and a co-author of the study.</p>

<p>The study’s lead author was Adrian G. Carpusor, a former student under Loges at the University of Southern California. Carpusor now conducts research for JD Power & Associates.</p>

<p>In their study, Carpusor and Loges hypothesized that Al-Rahman would have the most difficult time getting a response because of post-9-11 sentiments. In fact, the Iraq war broke out during the middle of the researchers’ 2003 data collection. But it didn’t really change the percentages, Loges pointed out.</p>

<p><a href=“Oregon State University”>Oregon State University;

<p>Journal of Applied Social Psychology
Volume 36 Page 934 - April 2006
doi:10.1111/j.0021-9029.2006.00050.x
Volume 36 Issue 4 </p>

<p>Rental Discrimination and Ethnicity in Names1
Adrian G. Carpusora2 and William E. Logesb
Laboratory studies have demonstrated the ability of names to prime stereotypes. To apply these theories and test the effect of name-based ethnic stereotypes on housing discrimination, 1,115 inquiry e-mail messages were sent to landlords advertising apartment vacancies in Los Angeles County over 10 weeks (6 weeks before the conflict with Iraq began in March 2003 and 4 weeks during the conflict). One of three names that implied either Arab, African American, or White ethnicity was randomly assigned to each of the messages sent. African American and Arab names received significantly fewer positive responses than the White name, and the African American name fared worst of all. This pattern held true in all rent categories, in corporate and privately owned apartment complexes, and before and during the war in Iraq.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I stepped away before I could post but got an opportuntity to look of the the report Dean J linked to regarding CA and Proposition 209 and a similar proposition to be voted on in michigan.</p>

<p>Bobert,
Keep in mind that the decision of the supreme court in both the Grutter v. Bollinger and Gratz v. Bollinger lawsuits against the University of Michigan, affirmed the validity of affirmative action in college admissions.</p>

<p>

During a holistic review of each applicant’s strengths and potential contributions to the class, the Court concluded, race/ethnicity could be considered as one factor among many others,
provided that this consideration is not done in a mechanistic way. The Court was persuaded to make this decision for a variety of reasons:</p>

<p>[ul]
[li] Students of all races who live and learn among diverse peers in both[/li]formal classroom and informal settings in which they are challenged to
absorb and respond to new points of view develop the capacity for more original and critical thinking. They also develop “democracy skills,”
including greater tolerance for differences as a normal part of life and the ability to negotiate both difference and commonality within and between groups. Years after graduating, students who have learned to effectively engage with members of other groups in college remain more likely to maintain cross-racial relationships.57 Such experience is particularly important because most students, particularly whites, grow up in segregated communities and experience diversity for the first time when they go to college.</p>

<p>[li] “Race unfortunately still matters”58 in American life, as evidenced by continuing disparities.</p>[/li]
<p>[li] “The path to leadership must be visibly open to talented and qualified individuals of every race and ethnicity.” [/ul]</p>[/li]
<p>

</p>