I traveled with our kids from the time they were 6 months old. They were never allowed nor tried to kick anyone’s seat and mostly enjoyed their flights which ranged from 5 or 6 hours to much longer.
Yes, I get that traveling with kids is no picnic but it is a generally a choice and it is my obligation as a parent to help my kids learn how to be pleasant (or at least not obnoxious) travel companions.
I have had to get other kids to return to their parents and seats as we were not running a daycare, tho our kids were well entertained on our many flights over the years.
Not defending the mother. Allowing your child to keep kicking the seat of the person in front of him (in my experience, it is usually a “him”) is wrong, regardless.
However, I also recognize that children have a very wide range of temperaments. When people say, "I would never allow . . . " I think they may not have experienced the full range of children’s “spiritedness,” among their own children. Friends of ours had a gentle and compliant first child. The dad remarked to me, "We thought, ‘This is easy!’ " The second child had a rather different temperament and was much more of a challenge. Running up and down the aisles in the movie theater sounds about like Child #2.
From the child’s viewpoint, the child is already effectively in “time out,” having to sit in an airplane seat for the duration of the flight. I can sympathize with the mother’s being at wit’s end, especially as a young widow.
Aside from that, there is something about airline seats that seems to invite kicking by toddlers. I get why the airlines can’t provide toddler foot rests, but maybe an ergonomics specialist could come up with a better design. The limited seat pitch these days is a problem. If people could afford to fly Comfort Economy, it might make the seat-back ahead harder for a toddler to reach. In the case in question, I didn’t quite get how the child’s legs were long enough to kick diagonally at the lady’s seat a row ahead, too, though. All the flights I have taken recently have been fully booked–no option to move anyone to first class.
We didn’t travel by air with QMP until she was 4 1/2 and was old enough to travel well by air. Even then, we took a direct flight as close as possible to our destination and then drove the rest of the way. Before that, we crossed the country by car [excellent, if you have the time] and by Amtrak [my husband loved it, I wouldn’t recommend it].
I think that it is a telling detail that she says they have flown over 30 times and that she USUALLY has to hold his feet for two hours!
Really? Doesn’t anyone think it odd that with all of those opportunities she has not managed to stop this behaviour? Sure, during some of those flights he was probably too young to get the message. But now he is three, old enough to listen to reason.
Oh, we had a seat kicker. The kid that’s in constant motion, tapping his foot, bouncing, whatever. Well into middle school. Actually he may be tapping his foot in his hooding ceremony. But we knew that about him, and someone was always assigned to sit with him on the airplane and intervene if he was kicking the seat in front of him. Couldn’t really do much about the foot tapping or bouncing. If you don’t have one of those it’s hard to appreciate how intractable the condition is. But we did talk to him about being considerate of other people, and we did our best to stay on top of it. It’s exhausting, like much of parenting can be.
@MomofJandL I have a great nephew who is like that, who sometimes stays with me. Trying to modify his behavior is a constant battle, and can indeed be exhausting. He’s in third grade, and it still hasn’t sunk in. Aieee!!! But in public situations, it just has to be done.
Many years ago, our family of 3 got 2 seats and 1 separated.
Wife asked a man traveling alone, sitting next to her and my son, to switch with me so the family could sit together. This of course would have allowed my wife and I to take turns parenting and preventing such drama.
Well the traveler refused to switch seats and then actually tried to befriend (maybe hit on) my wife…
in front of me. Clueless. Eventually the kid got cranky and disturbed this man. He then relented and agreed to move, at which point I told him “I’d rather not”…
I did move after a few minutes, just wanted to make him think long and hard about how he treated us.
Two way street folks. We have no young kids…but have not forgotten what it’s like.
I had compliant kids. They just came out that way. But I do have sympathy for the kinetic types, who really have trouble being still for a moment. It’s how they’re wired. What I don’t have sympathy for is parents who simply accept this without trying to teach empathy and social rules. What this mom is teaching her son is that his need to move takes precedence over another person’s need to sit in peace.
As a frequent traveler I have had my seatback kicked. I have sympathy for the parent who tries to correct the behavior. I do NOT have sympathy for the parent who sits there with a bloody mary thinking I deserve it.
Although in this case, my impression is that she doesn’t want to discipline her child because (1) he lost his father and/or (2) it’s just difficult. Either way is a disservice to the child.
^That just reminds me of the time I was again travelling alone with my two girls, who were probably about 4 and 6ish. I guess I was travelling SW because we had no assigned seats, and due to a tight connection, we were some of the last boarders on the plane. We walked all the way to the back of the plane without seeing three empty seats that were close enough together that I could be with my kids. So I just asked the group of passengers in the back if anyone would mind switching seats so that we could all sit together. I was met with blank stares. There were plenty of empty middle seats, but no one wanted to give up their comfort level so that I could be with my kids. I knew that my 4 year old would never sit through a flight next to complete strangers so I just stood there facing them and waited, and finally a couple of people decided to switch seats and we had an uneventful and pleasant flight. I’m positive it would have turned out similarly to blevine’s experience about 2 minutes into the flight if I couldn’t have gotten that cooperation.
And again, speaking to the intolerance of people who think that kids shouldn’t be travelling, I’m positive my kids benefited from our extensive travels. We began taking our kids on international trips when they were 3 and 4. Like I mentioned before, my kids were adopted, and I think the trips and various experiences really helped our girls bond to us - because they learned they could depend on us to keep them safe in all kinds of new and unfamiliar situations. I don’t think keeping them sheltered at home would have had the same positive results.
It also helped them academically. We were told by our kids’ ES teachers several times that our girls were “more knowledgeable” than their peers and they thought it was due to their travel experiences. They certainly learned a lot about different cultures, historic places and events, but we are nature nerds so they also learned a lot about science during our many visits to national parks and wildlife preserves, etc.
And finally, our youngest just blossomed socially after we took her and her sister on a 6 week trip to China when they were 4 and 6. I took them with me to volunteer at a privately run orphanage for a month (a Chinese nanny cared for them while I worked), and then my husband came for the final two weeks and we took a family tour of China. Our youngest is very quiet and shy and was mostly withdrawn and solitary at her preschool before that trip. When we got back, her teacher pulled me aside after we’d been home a few days and told me that my daughter had morphed into a completely different little girl. She said my daughter couldn’t stop talking about all the things she’d done on the trip and was so much more outgoing and social.
So to those who say “stay home unless it is absolutely necessary” - I say “phooey!”
A friend of mine had an experience at the theater. There was a girl, about 6 or 7, who had her foot on some structural piece that ran under the seats and she was shaking her foot. Probably didn’t even realize it. My friend very gently asked her to stop during the intermission because it could be felt all down the row of seats. It didn’t seem controversial but the girl’s mother was livid. Grabbed my friend’s arm and said to her, “you DON’T speak to my child, you speak to ME” and other belligerent things. The girl was right there. What a horrible lesson for her.
Isn’t it “stay home unless it is absolutely necessary if you can’t or won’t prevent your child from abusing others?”
Not just flying, but everywhere.
I take an express bus that’s usually 1 1/2 to 2 1/4 hours each way. I commute with some small kids and they are champs. I wouldn’t be pleased to have my seat kicked for hours on the bus, either.
My kids were sometimes brats, but by the time they were toddlers they understood that it was not ok to touch other people’s bodies, and kicking the seat is doing that.
If I had been the person sitting right behind that mother and heard of the gentleman’s dilemma, I think I might have started kicking her seat. I wonder what she would have said?
In general, you will have a better chance of success at a seat trade request if you offer your more desirable seat to someone currently in a less desirable seat.
For example, suppose you have 14C (aisle) and 29B (middle) but want to sit together. Offering 14C to the passengers in 29A and 29C may be more likely to be accepted than offering 29B to the passengers in 14B and 14D.
Obviously, this becomes more difficult if all you have are less desirable seats (e.g. all scattered back middle seats).
Why do people argue against what hasn’t been stated?
No one said that everyone with young children should avoid flying with them. What was said is if you can’t keep them from kicking someone, then you should avoid flying with them.
So if your kids weren’t kicking the person in front of you, the message was not meant for you.
You know what’s funny? The mom in the original piece said “The second mistake you made was bringing too much attention to the situation. You have poked the bear…” and “The third mistake you made was pissing ME off …”
And she’s done exactly those two things herself. She’s publicized this, thus poking the bear of public opinion, which now wants nothing more than to irk her. She’s pissed off anyone who’d sit in front of her. And she doesn’t seem to realize that she’s done exactly the same things that she’s complaining about others doing to her.
She has a new article up saying she was misunderstood, that people didn’t know the real story, that her words were changed, that the guy was complaining even before the flight took off, that her son is very well behaved and of course she would discipline him if he kicked someone’s seat, blah blah blah. “My point in writing this story was to point out how stressful travel can be and that all parents need a little break. That is all.”
She’s still not getting it. It’s still focused on her, on how everyone reacts to her and to her son. No wonder she’s not inspiring much sympathy.
DH and I went out to a wine cheese bar last night, not really a family type place. There was a family with two young children maybe 4 and 6 years old? Those kids were so well behaved for so long (they arrive well before us and the parents lingered over after an after dinner drink), after reading this thread I felt compelled to complement the parent’s on their children’s behavior. Those two kids can sit behind me on an airplane any time!
I will say that some airlines have crammed in seats with so little leg room that I can hardly keep from kicking seats in front of me. I can’t even cross my legs.
But in public situations, it just has to be done.