<p>Your parents should not pressure you or anyone else to attend their church. Making it clear that you are welcome to go with them–and that they would like it if you did so–is fine. It would be nice of you to go with them occasionally in order to make them happy. I understand that this has become such a point of conflict between you that it is difficult for you to compromise, but twice a year would not kill you.</p>
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What a great attitude. It should serve you well through life. </p>
<p>I’ve viewed lots of the parent/child continuum as a sliding scale, introducing increasing elements of gray from D’s very early age. The idea was to make her independent in her decision making and self-sufficient thereto by the time she want off to college. The reality didn’t completely map that way because life is complicated and as long as significant finances are involved, we retain some voice. <em>Some</em>. </p>
<p>But as it is, she’s gotten a lot more open about <em>asking</em> for our advice as the strings have been loosened. I’m waiting to see what our relationship is like when she’s 30, assuming I’m still around.</p>
<p>I really don’t think anyone should feel forced into complying with religious beliefs of other people, even one’s parents. I don’t like the guilt tripping that accompanies these types of discussions, either. There is so much guilt attached to religion as it is…parental guilt just adds to it.</p>
<p>I guess I would try to go with your parents, twice a year, but not because you have felt guilted into it, or shamed, or what have you. I would go because it is meaningful to your parents, and it isn’t that much time out of your life to do something for them. </p>
<p>But attendance doesn’t mean compliance of beliefs, and it shouldn’t be all that hard to keep those two separate.</p>
<p>Well, JHS, if you’re going to “CC adopt” Corranged, can I have Blahdeblah? Because personally I like a young person who’s not afraid to speak their mind. I suppose seeking family “peace at all costs” is a practical necessity in some families, but if there’s a fundamental respect and love between family members, they should be able to acknowledge and respect each other’s beliefs, even when they disagree with them. Neither side - young or old - should feel obligated to paper over their actual beliefs just to create a false veneer of unity in all things. If Blahdeblah’s mom has a problem with Blahdeblah’s current religious leanings, maybe it’s Mom’s problem, not Blahdeblah’s, to deal with. After all, Blahdeblah isn’t trying to make her mom go to… well, wherever atheists go to to do whatever atheists do. Mom is the one pushing the issue.</p>
<p>I like that atttude all music</p>
<p>Recently I attended a lengthy program where my niece spoke before she went off on her mission and while there were several other speakers as well and I had to force myself not to raise my eyebrows every two minutes, it was still my choice and I did it to show that I was supporting * her* not that I agreed with what she was saying. ( I smiled and nodded a lot that day particulary when my niece would make reference to those in her family that she prayed for because they weren’t as “enlightened”)</p>
<p>But I also feel, that those who are forced to sublimate their own impulses and opinions in order to acquiesce to those who have power over them, may eventually bury them so deep they can’t be accessed.
I also think that raising your children, to mimic your wishes, without allowing them to speak their own “truth” for want of a better word, may set them up for either a huge rebellion once they are 18 or what is worse, set them up for someone else to decide for them what they want and need.</p>
<p>I think I would prefer it if what * my mother* wanted was to go to church, but what she wants is for me to spend time at family dinners at my brothers- which he seems to have quite often- which I would really rather not do at all</p>
<p>But church a couple times a year- think of it as Lent ;)</p>
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<p>I am pointing out that that’s what they used to do, because I feel like the entire situation could be seen in a completely different light if that is left out. I think my dad’s been quiet about it because he basically decided that forcing me to go to church is not going to change my mind, so there’s no point. Despite what she says, I do not believe my mother’s primary goal is family solidarity, or whatever you’d want to call it. I think she thinks that the more often she can get me in a church, the more likely it is that I’ll start following the religion again.</p>
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<p>And if they ask me why I do not want to go to church ever again, what am I supposed to say? I hesitated for years to tell them that the real reason was because I did not believe, instead I tried to construct arguments that I thought you could still be a ‘good Christian’ without going to church every single week, that I could pray to God on my own time, etc. I pretended I still believed for years so as not to evoke (as much of) their anger, but that did not work. When my mother flat-out asked me if I believed in God, it took a h*ll of a lot of courage for me to say “no” because I knew what was coming next. I do not think it’s appropriate to lie in such situations just to “keep the peace”, nor do I think that growing up and realizing my beliefs are different from my parents is “rude”.</p>
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<p>Yes, well, perhaps I resent being treated like a small child even at the age of 18 and beyond. When I asked them (politely, and many, many times) what logical reasons they had to make me go to church every single week, they failed to provide any, which makes me believe that they never had any to begin. “Because I said so” is not a logical reason. They have no respect for my beliefs, which makes me lose respect for them.</p>
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<p>It is a big deal to me, obviously, or I would not have posted this thread. I grew up thinking that no one actually wanted to go to church, and that the only reason they did is that their parents had taught them they were “being bad” if they didn’t. It’s about the fact that they refused to believe me and listen to me, and I suspect that they still don’t believe me. </p>
<p>They don’t “request” that I go to church on Christmas and Easter, they have never requested that I go to church at any time. They demand and they expect, they do not ask. If they had said to me, we understand that your beliefs are different than ours but we would like it if you would attend church with us on holidays anyway, that would be different. Perhaps I would have said yes…I don’t know. They have never done that and they will never do that. </p>
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<p>I happen to think that the ability to be free to choose my own beliefs, and not either have them be dictated by my parents or have my parents argue with me constantly about them, solely because they are different, is very important in my life. I guess you don’t feel the same is important in your own life. Different people, different priorities.</p>
<p>farawayplaces:
It’s nice to see some understanding words. I did actually make somewhat of a ‘deal’ with my parents, though not in writing, that I would go to church on Christmas Eve, but not on Easter. My mother agreed to it at the time, but she still tries to guilt-trip me on Easter anyway. I’m thinking now that she only said that to get me to be quiet, not that she actually agreed to it, which is why it continues to be an issue.</p>
<p>I do understand the point of people attending church at holidays, regardless of their beliefs, just as a family activity, and I don’t think it’s horribly unreasonable to ask that of nonbelievers once or twice a year. I just wanted to clarify that in case people thought otherwise. I could see myself doing that when I am, say, 30 and visiting with my parents for a long holiday weekend, or something.</p>
<p>I just think that, in such a case, it really should be completely about “family time”, free of guilt-tripping and conversion attempts, and that is simply not what’s going on with my parents in this situation. It’s more like a battle to get me to submit to their will and be molded to their beliefs that’s been going on for years. It hasn’t got anything to do with the actual act of sitting in a church pew for an hour and a half at this point.</p>
<p>Look, your parents aren’t perfect. Neither are you. You can either continue to fight about this until your mother gives in (hopefully she would; the alternative is very bad) because this is something extraordinarily important to you, important enough to deal with the constant bickering and tension and possible loss of a relationship, or you can go to Church on Easter. I would do the latter because I value my family more than I detest a two hour hoax, and I realise that since I can’t control my mother, what happens is up to me. You want to do the former. That’s fine, but if you already had your mind made up about this, why did you even post this thread? I was under the impression that you were open to hearing our views and experiences to get outside opinions that aren’t tainted by resentment or anger. Since this is apparently not the case, and you are not looking to change, then our replies are all a waste of time. I really wish you stated up front that you were only looking for support. I wouldn’t have wasted my time.</p>
<p>I didn’t post the thread about help with the specific decision of attending church next week, I have already made that decision. I posted it because I was curious about other parents’ opinions on the situation…whether they thought either party was being unreasonable, whether they would do the same, whether they think this sort of thing is common, etc. I was also hoping to get some ideas on how to deal with it in the future as an ongoing problem (which it is), not as a specific issue on one single day, since it’s not even about that in the first place. Maybe I did not make that clear enough in the original post, I did feel like you were missing the point a little bit.</p>
<p>I haven’t read each of these posts closey–but I think I’ve changed my mind from my post of this morning-- how old are you, BlahDeBlah?</p>
<p>My college-aged son does not attend mass at his school. When he is home for Christmas and Easter, he accompanies the family. This is simply out of respect for our family traditions.</p>
<p>He is now 21. What he believes or does not believe is his business–I don’t even inquire, other than occasionally pointing out that I happen to believe that people who do believe in God are happier overall, (:)) nor does he mention it.</p>
<p>When you’re in college and especially when you turn 21 your life is your own. I think there’s a bit of immaturity on your part involved here.</p>
<p>I’m 22. Obviously my parents disagree that my life should be “my own” by college, or the age of 21.</p>
<p>OK, as a parent, it’s extremely painful that something as important as a religion, that you cherish, is not embraced by your child. The child that you raised to the best of your ability. The child that, if you are of certain faiths, was baptised or confirmed or bar mitzvahed or whatever…and on those days you celebrated and cried in happiness. It’s gotta be hard on your mom and dad. You are still young. In their eyes you are still their child. They haven’t given up yet. They love you.</p>
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<p>OK, bottom line - yes, you are being unreasonable. When you grow up you will realize that you can be true to yourself and still do things to make your mother happy, if for no other reason than out of respect for her. When you grow up (and I don’t care how old you are, you haven’t grown up), you will learn to choose your battles. This is not one of them.</p>
<p>It is an ongoing problem for you only because you choose to make it one. Once you no longer live at home with them, what you do on all the Sundays you are at your own home is your own business. What you believe is also your own business. When you are at their house, you follow their rules. That means going to church. Period.</p>
<p>(BTW, I don’t believe for a second that you are athiest. Most athiests have no problem attending religious services; they go as observers. You have way too much anger in you to be an athiest. You may not realize it, but you’re angry at God - that means you believe in Her.)</p>
<p>Putting this tempest in a teapot in perspective:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=319457[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=319457</a></p>
<p>BDB,</p>
<p>I’m on your side on this one. Religious beliefs and practices are the most personal of all, and should never be forced on ANYONE - even between parent and child.</p>
<p>I have heard others propound the idea that parents raising their children in a particular religion is tantamount to child abuse. I do not go this far, but I think religious people may not realize how strongly non-religious people feel about the hypocrisy of engaging in any religious rituals, even if it is just to “appease” their parents.</p>
<p>Especially at your age of 22, I think it is your parents who have the problem and not you.</p>
<p>Funny, I read through the soldier’s post thread and though, well as long as we are applying this principle to relatively minor things and not trying to belittle every single personal problem everywhere, we’re good. Not gonna happen, I guess. I need to be happy, happy, happy, bouncing off the walls, no right to complain about anything ever in my life because there’s always someone in the world in a “worse” situation, right? Happy, happy, happy, fake smile, whoohoo, skip around the room, no problems allowed. D’you think if I go say to my mother, you shouldn’t keep arguing with me about this because we could all be starving children in Africa instead, she’d stop? Yeah, I don’t think so either.</p>
<p>Chedva, I’m glad that you shared that you think I’m a liar as well. No really. Gives me warm fuzzy feelings inside to know that everyone else knows the contents of my own mind better than me. When it comes to this issue, I have little respect for what will “please” my mother, because she has little respect for my own beliefs, and I think that respect (or lack thereof) should be mutual. I have tried to be the good daughter for many years now and the only thing it got me was a sense of disgust with myself for not saying anything sooner.</p>
<p>Okay, my Ds started out Catholic and now are both athiests, I am that way now as well, and my mom was a buddhist, my kids go to a Jesuit HS.</p>
<p>My H is a sidewalk catholic, but likes to do the Christmas stuff.</p>
<p>When we visit family in Ireland, we go to Mass with Grandma. My mom who has “issues” with the Church goes to certain events becuase it is a family type of thing… our larger communty has confirmations, bar mitzvahs, etc all the time, we go to support the families, not because we are members of that church</p>
<p>THere is a way to strike a balance as a family member. As part of a family, we have to do stuff that makes us bonkers, we sit through bad recitals, we attend events for our community I fall asleep at</p>
<p>I think you should attend Easter and Christmas with your family, or something like that, and think of it as showing respect for your parents, who are probablly feeling sad…</p>
<p>It is not hypocritical to spend time with your parents doing something they love a couple of times a year.</p>
<p>If communion is involved, of course you don’t have to do it…</p>
<p>Part of being in a community is socializing at events that are annoying, and maybe mom wants to show you off a bit</p>
<p>Give and take, that’s part of being an adult…and its not hypocritical to go to church if you don’t believe, use that time to meditate, contemplate your navel, or make a shopping list, if your parents are kind, and now understand where you are coming from, it isn’t too much to ask </p>
<p>th other option is to take them out to dinner the week before, to a show, or a museum and spend that time with them all dressed up</p>
<p>I bet you’d bend over backwards to respect the traditions of another culture, wouldn’t you bdh? If you were visiting a family of another religious belief and they invited you to join them, I bet you wouldn’t even consider declining. Am I wrong?</p>
<p>I would bet if you did some other events with mom and dad, the pressure would be off about church…</p>
<p>I was going to ignore your past post to me, but your most recent one really touched a nerve.</p>
<p>First of all, you did not post just because you were “curious about other parents’ opinions” and wanted to know how everyone handles religion for the sake of curiosity. If so, you wouldn’t have begun your post with a complete background of your situation (‘because the background is necessary’ – if you were looking for general thoughts, a background isn’t necessary) or said that you had a “question for the parents of CC” because you “can’t discuss it” with your own parents. That and your questions at the end of your post all point toward requests for advice about the situation. </p>
<p>I do not think that you are being honest with your idealism in the first place. You said that you don’t mind the Christmas Mass because it is pretty and you like the music. I doubt your commitment to your beliefs would take a break for pretty candles and music, so I am left to assume that either you detest the Christmas Mass as much as the Easter one, which doesn’t appear to be the case, or objecting to the Easter Mass is more about making your mother angry than standing up for your beliefs. Given everything, the latter seems most likely, in which case you need to deal with the root of the problem. </p>
<p>Honestly, your last post has disgusted me. You seem to have so little value for your family that you would sacrifice it on this. If your mother doesn’t respect you, then that’s her problem. Not respecting her as some kind of pay back is unnecessary and childish. It doesn’t sound as if you have ever tried to placate your mother on this issue, and it’s such an easy thing to do. Is family worth so little to you?</p>