<p>Let the chips fall where they may, it will be interesting to see how and if they try and blaim “assistants and aides” and if they in turn take the punishment they good little troopers or if they do the right thing and turn in the bosses</p>
<p>How many do you think are sleeping soundly in Washington DC tonight?</p>
<p>And, I am sure those that think the Repubs can do no wrong, well, can you defend Abramoff, Delay and the others now?</p>
<p>Be careful CGM.
Money and influence does not recognize political parties.</p>
<p>citygirlsmom…I loved your caption! But yes, it sounds like both Democrats and Republicans can get caught in this snare. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out.</p>
<p>Rep. Doolittle tried his best to fight an Casino in California, and then got a nice donation from Abramoff…did I mention that Doolittle’s wife was hired by Abramoff to so some catering.</p>
<p>Can’t wait to find out who the best politicians money can buy are.</p>
<p>so, itstoomuch, do you assume that I would like Democrats to act like crocked republicans and would not want them caught</p>
<p>are you saying I would rather not know the truth about all the bad guys and gals</p>
<p>my, but you assume alot</p>
<p>sure, some dems with get caught up, but its gonna be majority family value red state republicans and I can not wait</p>
<p>Nice to see people that are so worried about a fews gays loving each other enough to get married having a bad effect on the nation , while these disgusting people will take money for their votes</p>
<p>Can you defend Abramoff and Delay NOW?</p>
<p>Democrat-idiots have cannot afford to lose seats in Congress. Republican -idiots also cannot afford to lose seats in Congress. </p>
<p>However, the dems traditionally had have more problems in raising funds for campaigning and are from less wealthy backgrounds. The temptation is always present, perhaps even more so for the dems. </p>
<p>I defend no one. And thoroughly disgusted with both parties, administration, and religion. Just reminding everyone that we live in glass houses and there are plenty of stones. Now, I feel like Marvin, the robot, thankyou, CGM. </p>
<p>Do you think that Abramhoff has been doing for 10 years, doing for 10 years without the full knowledge of our leaders?</p>
<p>It looks like the Republican spin machine has worked so far when it comes to spinning the Abramoff scandal. Comments on this thread match up with recent poll results showing that voters think the scandal in Washington is spread equally between both parties: </p>
<p>“Two points are immediately apparent by looking at the three polls side-by-side. First, by a high single-digit margin voters believe that the Democratic Party is better equipped to deal with matters of ethics and corruption. Second, voters do not yet believe that GOP lawmakers are measurably more corrupt than their Democratic counterparts.”</p>
<p>Go here for a rundown of how the Abramoff scandal is primarily a REPUBLICAN corruption scandal. </p>
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<p>Abramoff was a Bush “Pioneer” which means he donated over $100,000 to his re-election campaign. White House spokespersons have said the money would be donated to charity. How about using the funds to pay for a special prosecutor?</p>
<p>I would expect that most top lobbyists give some money to both sides of the aisle. Usually donations are given to the minority leadership just to keep things friendly. I don’t remember every going to a political fund-raiser at the state capital without a pharmaceutical rep someplace in the room. Not all donations are going to indicate corruption. I am suspicious of the hiring of family members and the revolving door staff situation. Legislators and staff need to keep arms length distance from the lobbying industry.</p>
<p>Itstoomuch, are you saying that if you are not as welathly, you are more likely to break the law? So poor people break the law more, that is your logic, and do you not think that white collar crimes are jsut as bad, especially when you see how many more people are hurt by say, Enron?</p>
<p>Nice that people that aren’t born into money are somehow seen as more likely to do bad, while rich people are seen as less likely to do bad</p>
<p>what planet you from</p>
<h1>9. You are reading too much into my comment.</h1>
<p>To be more precise: Running for a political office and then staying in office is not cheap. It takes $. Delay is in trouble because of a paltry $160,000 divided up between 4 (?) ( republican candidates). Now, if these candidates had their $40,000 independently, Delay, Abramoff, Scanlon, and the Elephants wouldn’t be in a ethic problem. </p>
<p>Being poor or rich does not reflect your ethics. However, BEING in politics may endanger your ethics because you need money. Not having enough of the stuff may test a politician’s ethics. Unfortunately, they are after all, OUR elected politicians, not someone elses. </p>
<p>{Delay is in trouble because the ultimate crime is money laundering-very, very serious…} Which he allegedly did because his candidates needed, Money. </p>
<p>Third Rock from Sun, Northwestern USA state, kinda blueish but not by much, which supports medical pot and assisted suicide, on a hill, in city of capital, and likes to play in dirt. Thankyou for asking.
Which Rock are you from?</p>
<p>_Rep. Ney: Abramoff’s admissions Tuesday focused on an unnamed member of the House of Representatives, identified elsewhere as Rep. Bob Ney (news, bio, voting record), R-Ohio, chairman of the powerful House Administration Committee. Rep. Ney received a “lavish trip to Scotland to play golf on world-famous courses” along with other golf outings; trips to the Northern Mariana islands and the 2001 Super Bowl; tickets to concerts and sports events; fundraisers in box suites at sports and concert venues and at Abramoff’s upscale restaurant; and $14,000 in contributions to Ney or on his behalf. Abramoff said Ney backed legislation, placed statements in the Congressional Record, tried to influence executive branch officials for Abramoff’s clients and tried to deliver a House wireless phone contract to one. Ney has denied wrongdoing</p>
<p>As well, Delay used his money to change the political landscpae of Texas, which, gee, the Supreme Court is looking at, and I gotsa say, there are more unethical repoublicans than democratic, just look at the resent case all over the country</p>
<p>It is like, well, who is gonna come after us, we are in charge, whoo hoo</p>
<p>And Bill Clinton sold pardons to some pretty bad characters. Rosty went to jail. Both parties have been guilty over the recent years. Money is an equal opportunity corrupter.</p>
<p>Let’s make no mistake here: the K-Street strategy was a Republican strategy, organized and funded to promote an ongoing Republican agenda. It is true that sometimes Democratic votes are necessary (or thought to be necessary) to see that strategy through. But the former national head of College Republicans and his Republican colleagues and workers, members of Bush’s high-rolling political support network, wasn’t out there promoting “Democratic” values (if there even could be said to be any.) </p>
<p>Money is an “equal opportunity corrupter”, in the same way that “guns (not people) kill people”. There are real live bodies with real live agendas behind that money, and organizing the money flow, and it ain’t Democrats.</p>
<p>(But it likely will be - next time around. ;))</p>
<p>
Well, that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. It would appear that the justice department is coming after them, doesn’t it? Not like the days when the Clinton team was in charge and all the campaign scandals associated with the Chinese were not pursued by the Reno justice department. But… my bad… it’s against the rules here to point out hypocrisy if it involves using the Clinton name.</p>
<p>Clinton, AGAIN? (Gosh, I think you need a bigger hard drive. ;))</p>
<p>Well he was the only Democrat president in recent (25 yrs) memory.</p>
<p>Fundingfather, puh-lease! At the risk of repeating myself:
— Between 1997 and 2002, the government reform panel issued 1,052 subpoenas related to investigations of the Clinton administration and the Democratic National Committee, but only 11 subpoenas related to allegations of Republican abuse.
— The House took 140 hours of sworn testimony into whether Clinton had used the White House Christmas card list to identify potential Democratic donors in the 1990’s, but only 12 hours of sworn testimony about the abuse of prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison.</p>
<p>Abramoff simply got too obvious to ignore. The press was playing it up, and more to the point, he ticked off the other lobbyists, who have ways and means of their own (the last two points may well be linked.) Your obsession with trying to find a way to vent your spleen over Clinton is getting embarrassing.</p>
<p>Kluge, come on … certainly you know the difference between “government reform panels” and federal prosecutors. Where was the Reno justice department when all of this investigation was occuring? How many were indicted?</p>
<p>Yes, FF, I do know the difference - the “Government reform panels” in question are composed of, and run by, Republican Congressmen, who don’t have to actually prove their case, just blow smoke. The DOJ has the pesky issue of having to prosecute actual crimes in actual courts. </p>
<p>Maybe the lack of indictments was a product of the lack of actual evidence in support of the conspiracies fervently believed in by your “tinfoil hat” blog buddies.</p>
<p>“The DOJ has the pesky issue of having to prosecute actual crimes in actual courts. Maybe the lack of indictments was a product of the lack of actual evidence in support of the conspiracies fervently believed in by your “tinfoil hat” blog buddies.”</p>
<p>Kluge, on the other hand, it is hard to deny that the DOJ and State prosecutors have been a LOT more active in the past 6 years than they were under the previous administrations. People on this board love to bring up Enron, Tyco, or WorldCom scandals without much of a thought under whose guard the corruption and fraud was allowed to blossom and how easy it was for the crooks to operate in an aura of laissez-faire.</p>
<p>As far as the attempt to color corruption with the that hackneyed red versus blue states argument, it is simply pathetic. Go back in history, and you are bound to find a very different pattern of political allegiance. Crooks and thieves come from both sides of the political world. Do we need to spend the time to poll our prisons to find out the political affiliations of the criminals? Betcha that would be a statistic that CGM would not bring up. </p>
<p>Finding examples of corruption among the democrats or liberal ranks is one of the easiest exercises ever. Just research unions and public school officials for starters. Are there any organizations more known for their corrupt and thieving practices than those two liberal-infested and putrid bastions of leftist power? </p>
<p>Nuff said!</p>