Right and I think it is typically the electives that would be offered only on a semester or trimester basis…and those grades shouldn’t be in the GPA calc we are talking about, but if say macro or micro econ is a semester course, then have to adjust the uwGPA calculation. (and maybe some would even argue econ is an elective, but IMO it’s core.)
Our school has plenty of core subject electives that are a single term. In addition, depending on the year, English and History are two terms plus a separate (required) seminar term.
Unfortunately, I think there will be some flags raised with the 3.4 gpa if that is what it is, regardless of the reason. OP should be honest with the coach regarding health challenges but that will also affect the coaches calculation regarding recruitment. OP should make sure to have schools in the mix (strong D3s?) where they will be a true impact player. Having said that, OP should be aware that the academic bar for recruitment at a NESCAC or similar is often higher than Ivy.
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Yep, a double edged sword as it were, and difficult for a HSer to cover. I would recommend OP work with their HS counselor and/or an independent counselor to work thru what/what not to say.
IME (outside Trinity and Conn) NESCACs do have a higher academic bar in general than the Ivies (unless one is wanting Cornell engineering or Penn Wharton, which I doubt is the case for OP.)
Like I said, OP should cast a wide net. That might include D2 and D3 schools. There is so much we don’t know that is also important, like OP’s budget.
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Good input so far. I’ll just reemphasize that the coach will be the best source of info on this. Calculating the ai is all well and good but honestly only the coach and the athletic department really know what the puzzle they’re assembling looks like and what pieces will fit. It’s not a problem to discuss your chances at the pre-read with the coach.
If it helps, coaches generally don’t waste time or resources. So if you’re talking to an Ivy coach, they’ve seen your transcript and scores, and they’re still planning to submit for a preread…odds are that they at least think you have a good shot at passing. (Some coaches are limited in the # they can submit and even those who aren’t don’t like extra paperwork for no payoff).
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How is AI calculated? I thought I read that you get up to 80 points for test scores, and up to 80 for GPA. But that seems like it would make the high score 160. Obviously, if 210 or 217 or 235 are options, then my understanding is wrong.
The AI formula was first published in a book by Michelle Hernandez, “A is for Admission.”
It was based on 1/3 GPA (unweighted, core courses only), 1/3 SAT/ACT, 1/3 SAT II (subject tests, no longer available). Since there are no SAT IIs anymore, the formula is 2/3 SAT/ACT. I don’t know what schools were doing when they were test optional and the recruit doesn’t have a score/applies TO. I’ve had recruits go to the Ivies with no test score, or a low test score (around national average.)
I don’t have access to the Hernandez book, but I think this is accurate at least at that point.
What schools are using now could be different. Some Patriot league schools used to use AI as well, not sure where that stands or what formula they use.
Some websites also have an AI calculator, including top tier admissions and college vine.
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As I have said many times, Michele Hernandez has not set foot in an admissions office since my father was in HS.
What she writes may have been accurate and valid at the time, but while the rest of academia evolves at a glacial pace, the same can’t be said for admissions
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Yep, I agree. That’s why I wrote current calculations may be different. AFAIK, any of the online AI calculators are based on the Hernandez formula, so they may not be accurate either.
AFAIK, no Ivy has publicly published an updated AI calculator. There may be stories of “The coach told me…” But that doesn’t mean the statement is accurate and/or applies to other universities.
For the athletic recruit and their families, file under "it is what it is "
I recalculated it with the core classes and I am at a 3.32 uw recalculated with only core classes and a 4.05 w core. The original number I got for my uw core gpa was wrong because florida schools calculate gpa differently, after talking to my counselor we calculated what my core gpa would be for an ivy. I should be able to explain my conditions hopefully to recruitment though as I have flareups which are extremely painful causing me to miss school. Along with that, like I said earlier my medication lowers my immune system causing me to get sick more often. On top of that, I have severe asthma. I looked into how many absences I have and I have 31 absences for this school year. I should get a high 1500s SAT as I have been studying 3+ hours daily + taking practice tests sparingly.
I am slightly above average in performance in my sport if I am being generous. My coach has extremely strong connections to yale and strong connections to harvard, columbia (main coach for many years), brown, and cornell.
Do you think I will be okay for admissions into an ivy?
I will be blunt. However, I will admit that my view is somewhat stilted by my own personal academic experience, which might have been at schools that were even tougher than some Ivy League schools (I have a bachelor’s degree from MIT and a master’s degree from Stanford). Just take this as one stranger’s opinion.
Also, the extent to which what I am about to say applies to you is likely to depend upon how well controlled your medical condition is by the time that you get to university.
To be blunt: No, I do not think that you will get admitted to an Ivy League university. Also, I do not think that an Ivy League university would be the best fit for you.
Ivy league schools are not full of students who had a 3.32 unweighted high school GPA. They are full of students who had something very close to straight A’s for their entire life. These students still find highly ranked universities to be academically demanding.
From what you have said, it sounds like reoccurrence of your medical problem is possible. This leads me to at least two conclusions. One is that you are not going to be best served by attending a highly competitive highly stressful university. There are a huge number of very good colleges and universities in the US. The highest ranked universities in the US are not “better” than other universities. If they are any different at all, they are academically more demanding and more stressful. “More stress” does not sound to me like what you should be looking for.
Also, if you need to take a bit of time off, this can lead to falling a bit behind in your work. At an academically more demanding university catching up might then be tough.
Just to give you one example, I took several courses in stochastic processes in graduate school. In the last of these courses that I took, I was doing very well and was quite close to the top student in a very tough and demanding class. About 10 days before the end of the semester I needed to skip one single class to attend a job interview. In the next class I was lost. I ended up being lost for the rest of the semester. The class was so demanding that missing just one class made it really, really difficult to catch up even for a student who had been at the top of this one particular class. This problem might be possible at any school, but is more likely at a university that is among the academically most demanding schools.
You should look for a college or university that is a good fit for you. I do not know you at all, but from what I have read I am doubtful that Harvard, Columbia, Yale, or Cornell would be the best fit for you. Brown I do not know as well, and I am not sure whether or not they would be able to make appropriate accommodations, but I am still dubious.
However you might want to see whether your doctor has a different view on the subject. He understands your medical situation and I don’t.
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You think college at an ivy would be more rigorous than 11 APs and 8 AICE classes over 3 years of high school? This is along with 3-4 hours a day of practicing for my sport. I would have thought the rigor for an ivy would be around the same or maybe even easier, as most applicants who are accepted to ivies fall into the 8-12 range of APs taken and usually no AICE classes taken as it is only in Florida. I might be wrong on this though. I am also doing this for recruitment for a sport where I am above the standards needed by all of the ivies by a longshot.
Have you been in touch with any Ivy coaches?
From what I can tell, they are pretty transparent with what their academic thresholds are. Some may have more leeway than others, depending on the stats of the rest of the recruitment class.
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That is a lot of APs.
This is hard to say and might depend upon which Ivy, and possibly which major. I will admit that I do not know what AICE is and I am not from Florida (nor from anywhere even remotely close to Florida).
Wouldn’t this still be true if you continue your sport in university?
One daughter very briefly did varsity crew in university, but gave it up as it was just too much along with academics (she wisely decided to focus on academics and having a life).
I think that MIT and Stanford were more rigorous than the vast majority of high schools. When I knew people at Cornell it did not seem all that different compared to MIT.
This might be a question for the coaches. They for example might know how common it is for a student to give up their sport to focus on academics.
Regardless I think that you should also be looking at colleges or universities where admissions is way more likely.
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Yes, it will be more rigorous.
Unless you can somehow find a way to spend 4 years taking only introductory courses (big lectures, a midterm and a final) and still graduate, by sophomore year you will likely have 1,000 pages of reading per week, one or two significant papers to write which include primary sources, appendices and index; lab work for anything in the sciences which doesn’t get you “extra credit”- it’s required. And by junior year, you will be buried.
That’s a good thing. That’s how you learn-- by being stretched significantly. But what you did in a year in an AP class might represent the first 6 weeks of the semester. And then- wow. Compressed, fast paced, you miss two lectures and you are WAY behind.
Your health comes first. Your sport may or may not end up in the top three considerations for you as you pick a college, but I would not assume that Harvard or Yale will be the cakewalk you are anticipating.
And absences REALLY impact your performance. One withdrawal for a medical condition- that’s smart if you really missed a lot. Two withdrawals- hey, your health comes first. But by the time you’re looking at a stack of incompletes, withdrawals, etc. you and your family are stuck paying an extra year.
I went to Brown (back in the dark ages). Just for perspective- I was the top student in French in my HS. There were over 1,000 students in my graduating class. I got an 800 on the French achievement test (they are no longer administered, but it was a big deal since it was not a heritage language for me) and a 5 on the AP.
By October of Freshman year I had to drop down a section in French. I went from being the top French student at a huge HS to getting C’s and “no credit” on the weekly essays we were required to write. And these weren’t “I went to the park with my friend and we got ice cream” essays. These were comparisons of Voltaire’s concept of free will to Rousseau’s-- with citations, 8-10 pages per essay. And the next week we were done with Voltaire and Rousseau and were reading Sartre and writing about nihilism and whether he was an anarchist or was just rebelling against society and culture.
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The gpa seems low to me but you really need to ask the coaches. What are they saying?
As for APs vs college rigor, yes a typical Ivy schedule will be more rigorous than a typical full AP HS schedule.
With your medical issues it sounds like you need to give a bit more consideration to what challenges you might face balancing college athletics and travel with the academic load (not to mention time required for career development and job recruiting). If these are ongoing issues I suspect they might be red flags for coaches which, when combined with the GPA, might lead some to prioritize other recruits. But you should be able to get a sense of that based on their communication with you.
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If this is a timed/measured sport and you’d be among the top recruits, then coaches should be responding fairly quickly to your emails and likely texting or calling you. These initial conversations almost always include discussions of academic preparation. Is this happening in your case?
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Yes this is happening
Thank you for your reply this was very informative
Yes I have been in touch but I was curious what everyone’s thoughts were on the topic