Adult Student Aiming for Ivy League

Applying to College
1

When I was in high school, I was a college-bound A-B average student until my mom (a single parent) got leukemia my junior year and passed away in my senior year. Understandably, I took a year off after graduation… which turned into another year since my 19-year-old self couldn’t build enough credit to get student loans on my own. In the meantime I had been dealing with depression, foreclosures, using the city bus to get to and from work, lack of health insurance, friendly faces extorting what little money I had out of me, and a ship load of other problems when I had planned to be dealing with study books and the FAFSA instead. In February I decided to hold off college for another year (3 total) so I could have a shot at better colleges, because all the ones in my area seem to lead nowhere - they accept everyone, almost half of them don’t even graduate, and half of the half that do don’t find non-entry level jobs, and those that do find a good job here are still stuck in a dangerous place with bad people all around.

So, to the facts:

  • I took my first SAT a month after graduation, and averaged 640s all around. Compared to my former classmates, I thought I did pretty well.
  • If I were to take it again now, I would probably score even lower than that because of everything I've forgotten over the years.
  • I am aiming for 740+, so during the tests I will have to aim for 800 to make room for error.
  • My current plan is to study the math section of the Kaplan Course Book, as well as other SAT math books, but I kind of just want to take practice tests over and over again until acing the SAT at the break of dawn becomes second nature to me.
  • I also need to take two SAT IIs... I don't know how these work, I've never heard of them before, I just know that I'd be unable to take any of these tests during the same month. This is quite stressing since I want to apply to most colleges in November, so I can make up for bad grades during my most important years in high school.
  • I'm holding down two jobs to pay for my rent so that takes up a lot of my time, and the rest of the time it seems like I am just struggling to cook and clean for myself rather than studying, drafting essays, or asking for recommendation letters.
  • I have never studied before. I always learned what was being taught in class and did the required homework, but I never learned to study or to teach myself anything.
  • Basically, consider me to be a sad monkey with two jobs and no support trying to get into Ivy League colleges. As crazy as it sounds, it HAS to be possible with dedication and good time utilization.

If anyone here was in a similar situation or knows how to help, I’d appreciate some advice. (Hooray for NTS sub-forum! I posted this in SAT section before, and I don’t know how to move posts…)

2

For some of the Ivies you can take the ACT instead of the SAT + two SAT II tests. Plus, some say she ACT is easier to prepare for (i.e., it’s more “studyable”). Have you looked at the School of General Studies at Columbia? It’s specifically for returning and non traditional students. Good luck to you!

3

Brown also has the RUE program (Resumed Undergraduate Education) for those who interrupted or delayed their undergraduate education.

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Why Ivies? You describe yourself as not academically inclined during the gap. Just because local colleges arent strong doesn’t mean there aren’t solid other choices. You say your record jr-sr year of hs wasn’t good. You haven’t mentioned what makes you a good match, in academic record, activities, or ability to keep up with the work at a tippy top. It would help you to know what they look for, which is more than test scores.

Applying early won’t change the strengths they want. We wish you the best in your education, but competition is tough and they’ll want to know you can succeed there.

5

Please build a list that includes schools at varying levels of selectivity, so that you will get in somewhere.

Do you know what you want to study? Where is your home state?

As far as the SATs go, there is free online practice at Khan Academy which can help.

I also recommend downloading the Compass Prep guide to testing: http://www.■■■■■■■■■■■■■■■/compass-guide/

It will cover which schools require subject tests and which school require the SAT essay. It’s a handy reference to make sure you cover all the tests you need for your school list.

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@lookingforward : My jr-sr years weren’t that good because I was busy caring for my mom. Besides that I was involved in theater, color guard, community service, and as many advanced classes as my school offered. I just need to have a good essay and great SAT scores, so that I can explain 4-5 years of low-to-none academic performance and prove my academic worth, respectively. But I don’t need to explain to you why Ivies should accept me, I only needed to explain what is blocking me from scoring well in order to get advice.

@AroundHere : I’m from Ohio and I’m looking into anything science-related, specifically biology. :slight_smile: I’ve been watching blogs from supertutortv for a bit, that’s where I found out I can’t take multiple SAT Subjects in a single month. Their advice is useful but it’s all directed towards current high school students… Also I’ve looked at Khan Academy before, would you say it’s better watching all the SAT Math videos or doing all the regular math problems, with that cute map-thingy? (Please tell me they still have the cute map-thingy.)

@Emsmom1 : Thanks for that info. Does anyone happen to know why ACTs would be accepted in place of 3 other tests? I know it includes a science portion but it’s basically just a science-related reading portion. If I recall I got a composite of 26 when I took it, and I would need at least a 32.

7

Getting in to Columbia is not the same for a returning student as it is for a first-time freshman student. From what I read on Princeton Review, the acceptance rate is around 33% for the School of General Studies. So, yes, make a list of schools with varying selectivity but don’t dismiss the ivies as unattainable.

8

However, some nontraditional students programs (like RUE at Brown) are need-aware and do not purport to meet 100% of financial need so you need to do some research.

9

But OP still needs to “match.” And he admitted: “I always learned what was being taught in class and did the required homework, but I never learned to study or to teach myself anything.” He hasn’t told us he continued learning, gained some comparable academic or intellectual experiences, etc.

The Ivies still need students who can make it there, keep up, and graduate. And who can show a sense of purpose that convinces adcoms. So I asked OP, “Why Ivies?”

And RUE says need-blind and “committed to meeting 100% of demonstrated financial need for undergraduates.” Yes, he needs to research.

10

Not sure where you learned that about SAT subject tests: if the ones you want are being offered that day, you can take up to three at a sitting. The SAT IIs are going to be a hurdle since you’ve been out of school for a while.

Khan Academy is an acquired taste. They are free and they have a relationship with the College Board so they have access to real problems so their SAT prep section is accurate. They were ahead of the other books/websites because of their deal with the College Board, but I’m guessing others are catching up now that the new test has been offered more. Whether you should focus on the full math map or just the SAT section would depend on how much math you’ve forgotten since you were in school. You’re going to have to judge whether you remember your basic math or not.

Ohio has a good state system academically, but sometimes the financial aid can be lacking. Ohio State would be a traditional college experience, and commuter schools like the University of Cincinnati would have more older students who are working and going to school where you might not feel like the old man among the teenagers. Look really hard at your state system because they start with the lowest price taxes and put a couple schools on your list.

If you happen to live around Cleveland, you might try talking to admissions at Case Western. Whatever they tell you to do to prove to them you are ready for a selective school in STEM would be a good start for the Ivies as well.

11

Hi everyone! In case anyone was curious (which I’m sure you haven’t even thought about this forum for the past month), here are some updates:

First off, I was wrong about my scores back in 2014, I actually averaged 540s all around. When I made this post I was going off a practice test I took that week, where I got 610s and thought “wow, just a bit of studying and I’m almost as good as I was in school.” Well it turns out losing my only family made me a much-worse-than-average student. No surprise there.

I have learned how to study on my own, and to like studying/learning. I have only done math so far, since I had forgotten nearly every concept and reading/writing portions are mostly about understanding how SAT makers think and how they trap test-takers. Good days are those where I can study for 15 hours and absorb the information quickly, bad ones are when I work for 12 hours and by the time I get home all I can think about is getting something to eat and how much pain I’m in.

A couple weeks ago I took another practice test with 690 Reading, 730 Writing, and 690 Math, and I only missed things in Math because of silly mistakes. It sure isn’t 750+ and I definitely need to hurry up, but it is nice to see such a visible effect from my work.

I talked to some admissions officers from UChicago about my situation and asked what I need to do to have a shot at acceptance at a good college. They don’t normally require SAT IIs and are much more lenient than other universities with their admission requirements, but they said that getting a great score on those and the SAT I are vital in my situation, and could even grant me a full ride at some top universities.

I know that many others are starting the studying years before their test date, and I only have one shot at these with such limited time, but the more I look into this the more apparent it is that this test could change my life. So please, if anyone has good study strategies that would apply to someone out of high school, feel free to share.

@AroundHere , my mom went to University or Cincinnati! Of course with her condition she had to take online courses… but I know how their class scheduling system works and there are a lot of holes and conflicts. There is also a small lack of support, and many of their students don’t graduate. One of the main reasons I want to go to a selective school with high retention and graduation rates is because I don’t want half of my friends to be gone within two years. I am also not that old so I doubt I would feel like an old lady compared to recent high school graduates. I also hear that Ohio State is a party school. While I’m aware that some Ivies have a prominent party atmosphere, I would rather go someplace where I am surrounded by intellectuals who want something better for their future, not people who equate alcohol with fun. I have used Khan Academy a bit and I’m a big fan of the exercises, not so much of the SAT videos. It doesn’t really give me a chance to do the problem myself. After reading multiple math books I can go to the map and pick out things that will pop up on the SAT to do drills on them.

@lookingforward Again… I don’t see why I have to convince you that I might fit in an Ivy-School setting. You and I both know that they only accept people with great test scores, and I’m sure you also know that while they don’t give free passes to everyone that has had a hard time, they do consider extenuating circumstances when they look at grades, scores, activities, etc. I can’t fix my grades from 3 years ago, I can’t go back in time and get more involved with school activities, and what happened to cause the slip in my academics was unpreventable - if your mother dies you can’t just go about your week and continue to ace all your AP courses like nothing happened, and if you lose your house and become homeless you can’t “continue learning, gain some comparable academic or intellectual experiences, etc.” and admissions officers know that, too. What I CAN do is retake my SATs to show that I am currently on the same academic level as any other potential student. So PLEASE, stop focusing on tearing people down and try to give some advice instead.

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I know extenuating circumstances aren’t a reason to overlook actual academic prep. Where struggles are put into perspective is when the kid subsequently triumphs, rebounds from a slipped record, comes back. Not when little has changed.

No you can’ct go back in time. But you can show them how you have since gotten back on the academic path and mastered it. As well as with ECs. Ivies want you to be prepared to succeed in an environment that is highly competitive (not just admissions, but the work once there.) And among peers who are highly prepped.

I’m sympathetic. But you have to show them. It’s more than SAT scores. I asked Why an Ivy. Why not a more accessible program at another college?

13

Are you using old SAT prep materials from 2014? The current SAT only has two section scores, not three. You can download free practice tests at satpractice.org.

Getting your test scores up is the bare minimum as far as elite schools concerned. If you truly want to go to college, you will build a list of affordable safety, match, and reach schools.

14

It is so much more than SAT scores. I think you are going to be disappointed if you don’t apply to a range of schools. There are hundreds of colleges you could reasonably attend. There is no good reason except prestige hounding to insist that you must attend one of these 8 schools. It isn’t that unusual to see a student who didn’t do very well in HS suddenly get the Ivy bug and think they can leapfrog students who were more academically inclined their whole HS careers. But realistically, it almost never happens. You can definitely go to college. But “Ivy or bust” is silly for ANYONE, even students with great GPA, great test scores, great ECs, and no interruptions in their education.

15

Hm, I didn’t think anyone would be around to see my reply, or I would’ve posted that back in May.

So when I first posted this in April, I honestly didn’t know what an Ivy school is - someone had to explain that there were only 8 and weren’t just the “top 50 colleges”. My point was just that I wanted to go to a reach school, like UChicago, Harvard, MIT, etc. and that any of them would have a very high standard of incoming students. I can’t go back in time so I can’t do anything but change my SAT scores, talk to people, and give well-written explanations of what I’ve been dealing with for the past 3 years. Why Ivy-I-mean-Reach? High standards against me mean high standards against everyone, so my classmates will be more intelligent than if I were to go to a community college, more resources can be allocated to each student because they’re not just “letting anyone in,” and there would be better opportunities after college. My goal of this thread was to find a study plan to get at least 700s on SATs because otherwise, none of these schools will even read my essays or recommendations unless I’m their best pal or something.

@AroundHere, Unfortunately yes, I’m using old prep materials because there are a lot more books from 2007 and 2014 than there are for the new SAT. I’m planning on burning through all the new practice tests on collegeboard during the last week of prep to try and get used to the new format (which started yesterday, got 1500!).

@lookingforward, Sorry for lashing out rather than giving real explanations. Like I said I wrote that response back in May, I just posted it because I’m tired of seeing drafts everywhere. I’ve been spending the last few months trying to network with colleges and my HS counselor, building essays, filling out something called Questbridge (which is like the common application exclusively for poor students and reach colleges), and trying to audit some classes at Northwestern U. I said I took another year off to have a better shot at good places, so that’s what I’ve been doing.

16

If you have a GPA of 3.5, try connecting with http://collegepoint.info after you get your SAT score.

Questbridge is great if you can get it, but is highly competitive. Collegepoint will help you build a list of reach, match, and safety schools that all support low income students.

Just as you had some things to learn about what Ivy means, you have some things to learn about the rest of the college landscape. You can get a good education at colleges that accept a high percentage of applicants. Your fear that you will be “missing out” if you don’t go to a “top” school is misplaced.

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Heh, just shy of 3.5. Those senior year AP classes did not help too much. Do you know if any of the listed safety and match schools provide full financial aid though? It seems like it would be counter-intuitive on their part.

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Agree that you are overestimating the value of a top college if YOU are motivated and get the most out of whatever school you attend.

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The purpose of the program is to match promising low income students with good schools they can afford. Why would it be counterintuitive to include meets full need schools?