While they may be present at many bigger schools, they may not be especially important to many students at many of those schools in that a relatively small percentage of students join (e.g. at Arizona State, 15% of women and 9% of men). However, a small percentage at a large school can fill a lot of houses, so the sororities and fraternities at a bigger school may be large in absolute numbers.
Soze, letâs say I engage with the girls in my dorm and I donât like them for whatever reason. Maybe I find them to be stuck up, or nerdy / geeky, or childish, or mouthy, or tacky, or any combination of the above. Iâm going to form these judgments based on our interactions - a dorm party, meeting, how they talk when we all sit down for dinner together, etc. Of course they are forming whatever impression they have of me at the same time. Whatâs the difference? The only difference I see is that rush is a structured process for forming these judgments.
Okay, should she be welcomed into the Young Republicans club then? Even if she turns up in her Vote-for-Bernie t-shirt?
Should she be required to invite the kid down the hall to join in the Friday-night Settlers of Catan game in the dorm lounge? Even though heâs only nice to them when he has nothing better to do?
âExactly. I just spent last weekend at the home of a sorority sister who lives in a different city. I would not have met her at all if I had just stuck to my dorm (a small one) or my major (even smaller).â
These anecdotes of how I made friends in the sorority and not in the dorm are just silly. 30 years later my best friends today are still the people I met freshman year in my dorm. I spend weekends with them and they also live in different cities. I would not have become as close with them if I had spent all of my time in a sorority house. Who Cares? We can all make friends in many ways!!
If the âYoung Republicans Clubâ is an organization that is recognized by the university and is using university facilities,etc. then yes.
Iâm quite sure if you asked a kid who was rejected, they would think there is a difference.
Anyway, soze. Where DO you get this weirdness that the moment someone is in a Greek org, they canât still be friends with (or start a friendship with) someone who isnât Greek? Do you not get that itâs not so âexclusiveâ like that? You like the guy in math class, invite him out for coffee. You hit it off with the girl in French class, you go out for pizza. My S dated a bunch of girls who were Greek and now is serious with a girl who isnât. Who would possibly care?
In our system, we were required to live in Junior year. I stayed for senior year because thatâs what worked best for me. One of my best friends decided she had enough of living in the house and roomed with 3 non-Greek friends in an off campus apt for senior year. So??? No one cared. Do you think she was excommunicated or something?
You have a very âoffâ, inaccurate view of the exclusivity.
No, because none of these things you described are activities that are sanctioned, sponsored or recognized by your university.
You donât take all comers. Thatâs the totality of my problem with exclusivity. Since you clearly donât take all comers, my view is actually 100% accurate.
No, I donât âtake all comersâ to be my friends. I didnât allow just any guy at the bar to go home with me either. Nothing to apologize for.
If the kid really wants to be in a GLO, then he can start one. Very few schools have every national organization on their campus. Approach one and offer to colonize a new chapter.
Every college tour I have been on has included a spiel about how easy it is to start an organization. âTakes 2 people and a formâ to be recognized. At my alma mater, they now have social organizations that include both sexes. At the school my S will attend, they have non-Greek fraternities that have been there for 40-50 years. I assume these organizations were started by those who didnât get into a GLO and still wanted the experience.
Answer the question - do you âtake all comersâ to your social events, parties, hanging together at your house, etc? How did you ever decide on a mate then if everyone was equally welcome to your attention and affections?
Very interesting line of argument as âI click with you, or I donâtâ is what many IME would consider a textbook definition of arbitrary selection.
However, there are some who find this form of arbitrary selection problematic when it is used by student organizations sanctioned by collegesâŠespecially if they use campus facilities and/or dominate campus social life.
Some colleges have banned organizations using such selective criteria when itâs not based solely specialized skills/talents or academic merit because that arbitrariness is felt to be antithetical to creating an inclusive campus community for all students.
Thereâs a major difference between holding events and selecting attendees at oneâs own residence and running a college-sanctioned student organization.
Especially one which recruits students and holds organizational events using campus facilities or heavily influences the social fabric of the campus even if the organizations themselves are based off-campus.
Your point would be much more valid if the fraternities, sororities, and other socially exclusive student organizations were not only completely off-campus, but also conducted all recruitment and social activities off-campus without relying on campus resources*.
- Including college provided computing resources such as email accounts or campus internet access as they are subjected to user conditions set by the college as well.
Itâs irreverent as the things you mentioned are not activities that are sanctioned, sponsored, supported and recognized by my university.
If Iâm good enough for my university, Iâm good enough for any organization that my university recognizes â again the only exception being those which require special skills or talents (sports teams, singing groups, etc.).
Exactly.
Should LGBT organizations necessarily accept all straight students who want to join? Even if their status as âalliesâ is not vouched for?
If they are a university-sanctioned organization, then yes.
And before you ask, Iâll pose the next question:
Should a Christian club be forced to admit non-Christians?
Again, if they are university-sanctioned, then yes. The school should not be allowing organizations to discriminate based on religion any more than they should be allowed to discriminate based on whoâs âcool enough.â
Pretty sure they have to, if they are student groups at a school like Oberlin where the student groups are only allowed to select based on academic achievement.
The Berkeley Student Co-op has a âLGBTQIA & Queer Theme house.â However, selection is purely by the BSCâs first come first served wait list process.
There is no real practical difference between
- me hanging with my sorority sisters in the house on a random Thursday night, ordering pizza, watching TV, joking around, etc and
- you doing the same with a bunch of friends in a dorm or apartment.
Either way youâre choosing who you want to hang around with based on shared interests and you âdonât accept all comers.â
@Pizzagirl
Big difference. The exclusion of other students who might want to participate in #1 but canât because you will not allow them to is being sanctioned by the university. #2 is not.