Drinking per se is not the problem. It is drinking to the point of incoherence that is contributing to the issues we now have on campuses. You have to distinguish between the two.
If only. If only rape happened only when alcohol was involved. If only she didn’t wear a short skirt, huh? If only she didn’t go to that party. How about “if only the guy could stop himself?”
"How about “if only the guy could stop himself?”
Well, that would be nice but I’m not holding my breath since some of these cases are committed by crazy criminal predators. See Vanderbilt. Others are not so clear. See Duke. Missing the distinctions is not going to help anything.
@TV4Caster - “But, in all seriousness, plenty of good can come with engaging with a woman who is drunk. It totally depends on the circumstances.”
What are you saying here TV, cause I kinda liked most of your previous posts. 
The schools will be empty.
Well… I would have been ok. I don’t drink. I would have had a lot of one on one time. 
5065 [quote] And the** women I know completely do not agree** with the victim-blaming mindset;** do not believe** that they are devoid of personal responsibility when they drink; **do not believe** that others are somehow automatically responsible for them if they voluntarily decide to get silly drunk;** do not understand** females who get naked and into bed with a guy and then wonders why sex might be expected to happened; do not understand this meme of not reporting actual rape to the police; and would have no issue literally blowing off (no pun intended) a guy's manhood if he did try to rape her. I get these women. Women who walk around with matresses as a protest after a questionable encounter and then not getting your way in some proceeding, I do not get.
[/quote]
You are correct women have many voices. However, you are not saying “this is what women I know told me” or “this is what I think women I know believe.” Instead, you are speaking for them. imho. I don’t know if you are speaking what they believe or not. Of course, if you phrased it differently, I still wouldn’t know. Men who speak for women, instead of “allowing” them speak for themselves, make me uncomfortable. Perhaps this is too picky for this thread. Perhaps not.
I will have to read back through and see if I am denying men their voice.
What I was saying was that there are plenty of instances where “something good” can come out of engaging with a woman who has been drinking. My wife, for example, (as I said in the post) is much more relaxed after a few drinks when she comes home from a crazy day at work. I would say our dates (engagements) are often better than the times when she hasn’t been drinking.
I was simply trying to point out that you can’t use generalizations like “don’t engage with drinking women” without making distinctions (like for long term partners etc).
HighSchoolDad2, No. I don’t drink but almost everybody else I knew in college did drink.
I think we have to be realistic.
@HighSchoolDad2 - well if you really want to make sure that the rape issue is addressed why not just ban all sex on campus? That is about as realistic as what you propose in #5091.
College kids drink; some responsibly and other have to get blasted at every opportunity. But more importantly, colleges have refused to get involved with monitoring alcohol on campuses despite what their written policies dictate. You are hoping for a “savior” who simply does not want to be one. Bottom line is colleges do not want this responsibility so we are left with the dysfunction that such unsupervised drinking creates. Thats the reality. All the wishing in the world will not change that.
Everyone agrees that alcohol is a big part of the problem. Finding a way to solve that is just not as easy as your post makes it out to be. Perhaps you should take the time to read through the 339 pages of this thread.
Skirts and partying may not be “illegal,” but people use them as reasons she got what she ‘really wanted.’ I have no problem with the idea a guy is turned on- and controls himself. Both parties get wiser.
Maybe any focused suggestion of expelling for drinking needs its own thread. You’ll draw attention from folks who won’t touch this one.
No. It isn’t the same. Sorry.
My first post ever on CC I asked about schools where drinking wasn’t prevalent on campus.
The root cause of rape is men treating women like they are pieces of meat. (Or men treating men that way).
I am all for cutting back the drinking on college campuses. Go for it.
They are not encouraging it, they are ignoring it because the current craze is the rape epidemic and we cannot complicate these things with obvious causal factors. The answer is always going to be it’s still not her fault even though no-one said it was her fault since most people discussing that angle are talking about something that has not yet happened. But yeah, it’s frustrating.
Have a nice weekend too. If what you said was true, we would have quite a few more rapes.
Post 5070 doesn’t sound like rape to me.
“men treating women like they are pieces of meat.”
These perps: like, they have a gun, it’s loaded, and by gummy, you’re their target. Can’t stop! Gun got my brain!
Well, that sounds odd. Feel free to roll your eyes. But my point is (and has been) that drunk or not, cute or not, however she’s dressed, whether she’s in the wrong place, flirty, says something or other, kissed him, touched him, let him grind her on the dance floor…what you may call ritualized mating behaviors…he can still look for clear, valid consent. Many of us believe he can still stop himself from going further. He can still choose not to take her upstairs. Nor to agree, if she suggests it. “Later, babe, we’ve been drinking.” I don’t disagree drinking is an issue. What bugs me more is this idea ‘guy’s gotta have it’ or ‘gun got my brain.’
@HighSchoolDad2 “Pass a Federal law that if one kid is found drunk on a college campus the college will lose all Federal and State funding, and see what happens.”
O.K. so get that petition going and then come back and tell me how thats going for you.
P.S. hope you have you have your hiking shoes on because that is going to be a steep mountain to climb. (Think tax revenue from the sale of alcohol.)
What bugs me more is this idea ‘guy’s gotta have it’ or ‘gun got my brain.’
I don’t know what you are referring to except perhaps the Vanderbilt case where that was sort of his defense. But, he lost to the surprise of no-one. So, I’m obviously not understanding something again.
Edit to add. - Well, his dad was apparently surprised, but no-one else.