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Wow, generous Sue!. 
(assuming that’s a typo but it gave me an ealy morning chuckle).</p>
<p>I think she meant a fully year, May 10 2010 - May 11 2011?</p>
<p>I would encourage you not to let him come home for the summer and do nothing. Here’s why: my brother graduated from an ivy. never worked at a paying job his entire college life (or high school). After college he volunteered for an overseas service program, then came home and lived at home for a while before attending graduate school. My parents paid for all of it, plus many expensive trips. </p>
<p>Fast forward two decades: he lives on his wife’s income and my parents’ generous annual checks to him. He has never had a 9-5 job, just a little part-time work selling his art. He does not want to teach art or work in a museum (simply does not want to work). He vacations all the time. My parents help pay for fulltime childcare even though he is home and could care for his kids. When he was a teenager, my parents used to say that it was more important for teens to have “experiences” like travel, than jobs.</p>
<p>I never bought into that and neither did my sister. My sister and I sought out jobs beginning when we were 14 (first jobs were scooping ice cream, making beds, camp counselor). We are also Ivy-educated like our brother but we chose to work our way through college. Never accepted a dime for spending money, books, etc. Did not come home during summers but rented off-campus apartments with friends and earned money all summer. We both have a work ethic and are raising teenagers who also have this. </p>
<p>My parents are now in their seventies and my dad is still working. He has an incredible work ethic, just did not pass it on to one of his kids. Looking back, I can see that my sister and I chose our path as teenagers, wanting the self-respect that comes from having a job and financial independence from parents. My brother’s path was evident from the time he was 14 or 15 and my parents never gave him the tough love he needed to get on his own feet. I wished my parents would have said to him years ago: stay in your college town for the summer, rent an apartment with friends, get a job or two, and pay for your own books and spending money during the school year. They would have done him a huge favor. He might have wobbled a bit at first. But he would not be a free-loading 45 year old decades later. It would seem harsh, but far easier than having that same conversation with a grown man who has a family.</p>
<p>You are not a bad parent. We just live in a very permissive society with parents who seem to be okay with kids living at home past age 22, 26, 28 and older. </p>
<p>The reason your son lazes on the couch is that he knows all your requirements about summer work have no consequences - no teeth. He will keep doing the same thing until a real world consequence hits and/or the parents–on a united front–actually ACT upon their limits.</p>
<p>Some day, some year, you will have to be the bad guy and boot the son out of the nest… you can do it now when it is easy and on a short summer break period to give him a taste of your REAL limits and expectations… or you can have this be a big blow up after he finishes college and comes to laze on your couch for a few years… and don’t think it won’t happen. For every anecdote of a miraculous happy ending of a son who finally got motivated right after he finished his college degree I suspect there are several more stories lurking of the son who continues to laze on the couch.</p>
<p>I think changing it up for the summer is an awesome idea. Even if he does mooch on some relative - realize it still won’t be as cushy as at home and the relative has free will in this matter (and would be faster to boot him out, too). </p>
<p>You are going to “look” like the bad guy and feel guilty - but I think it is a great idea to have him ship off somewhere else for the 3 months. My goodness - have our children become such hothouse flowers that we all think our sons would be damaged by being booted out of the house for 3 months? I just think that is silly beyond imagining. For those parents who want their kids that uber-close, fine. That works for you. But to automatically declare it makes another parent a “bad” parent (wow, doesn’t take much), then I simply disagree.</p>
<p>I appreciate that the economy is hitting some areas harder than others and that jobs may be harder to get than they are here. Also one thing which I wasn’t factoring in was that I was referring to high schoolers as far as jobs - they college kids who seem the most successful as far as finding work here during the summers are those who have worked at a place through high school and return to the same place during breaks. At DSs workplace they have a college student plan where if you commit to working X hours per year you maintain your seniority, pay scale etc. You’re virtually guaranteed a job during holiday breaks and summer, in fact if you don’t commit to working then you lose your status.</p>
<p>A bit too late for the OP, but I do think working some throughout the year during high school makes it much easier to continue on through the summer.</p>
<p>threecubs – it just goes to show that kids come with their own personalities. All of you had the same parents and you have such varying degrees of work ethics.</p>
<p>This thread contains a good message for parents whose kids are adults. We might not like what that we see them not working as hard as they could. But if they are living on their own without help from us then it really isn’t our place to say anything. The choices are theirs to make and the problem are theirs to solve and if they have to they’ll come up with a solution to whatever pickle they find themselves in.</p>
<p>^^^ Ditto to mafool. We live in Michigan, too, and the job market here is brutal for everyone, including hapless college students looking for summer employment. No lie, my daughter beat the pavement for 10 hours every day last week, applying everywhere she could think of, and nothing. She’s coming home from school this weekend to do the same. So mom4college, count your blessings that you live in Richmond!</p>
<p>At least my D is learning perseverance and determination, if nothing else.</p>
<p>I concede to the people pointing out how bad the job market is right now.</p>
<p>You know, the job market really is bad in many places. Makes summers and post grad really difficult for both students and parents. I think what most parents expect is effort. Perseverance. Not giving up. Going out and getting unpaid or volunteer work. Having some goals. Paid work is great…even needed by some families. But I tend to see the “lazy” kids being in families that don’t need cash. </p>
<p>Someone posted a good article in another thread about the impact of joblessness. A great read. </p>
<p>For the OP, I still think it makes sense to give it one more try during the summer, with some clear rules. And the money spigot turned off. If the rules aren’t followed, well then, he knows his deal for next summer. Sometimes, our kids need a kick in the you know what.</p>
<p>yes, I meant a YEAR, not 2 days. My son does work, but is basically LAZY. He wouldn’t work if he didn’t have to. He makes up stories about doing volunteer work (that I know aren’t true). In fact he wrote to a professor yesterday saying he couldn’t come to class because he had to cook Passover seder. I can’t prove it, but I suspect that is a lie.</p>
<p>I don’t care that his GPA is 3.7</p>
<p>I know the truth about his lazy, narcissist personality. I really would like him to join the military so at the least, he has 3 hots and a cot and MAYBE then he will appreciate what opportunities he DID NOT utilize during his 4 years at college. I’ll be sure to let you all know next May what happens.</p>
<p>I think it is interesting that our poster is “Threecubs.” We all know the nature of a “mama bear” when it comes to protecting little cubs – but, guess what? There comes a time when mama bear chases off her offspring. Many creatures do this. When young stallions start cutting up, the dominant stallion chases them off with teeth, hooves and brutality. There’s no question as to who is in charge. </p>
<p>Colleges don’t teach job finding. They don’t. They help with independance skills but only some of them. We parents are back at the dirty diaper stage: there are some ugly tasks at hand and no one else is volunteering to deal with this stinky job. </p>
<p>I am realizing that there are some advantages to being of a very modest income. My kids know that we simply can NOT support them. We can’t. It is simply not possible. They seem to be hearing that . . . and it is still hard to move them toward independance.</p>
<p>Hey sueinphilly! It sounds as if you have some real issues with your kid not being honest with you, but my gosh: The kids has a 3.7, which even if he attends Grade Inflation U, still means that he goes to class, takes all his exams, does all his homework and hands things in on time. He also works a menial, low paying job to make ends meet while maintaining this 3.7. A lot of parents who see kids floundering in college would be pretty pleased if their kids were following in his footsteps! He might not be utilizing all of the opportunites that have been made available to him, but he sounds pretty responsible and well-organized. And come next May, he might surprise you.</p>
<p>I think that the attitude bothers her. You are right though, 3.7 including a job is very good.</p>
<p>On Colleges don’t teach job finding: some colleges offer a lot but you have to take it. My son’s school offers counseling, mock interviews, a database of jobs, help from alumni, formal dining training, and resume help. But students have to go and get the services. I imagine a lot of colleges provide these services.</p>
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<p>Is it just me- or am I only only one who sees mixed messages?</p>
<p>^^^ These days, college should offer job hunting courses as a required…or at least optional courses. I don’t know about most, but my kid doesn’t take too well to parental coaching on this topic. It comes across as “interfering” I think. And I think that many get paralyzed when they don’t know what to do. Certain personalities just don’t mesh well with hard times…</p>
<p>Encourage him to get a girlfriend – he’ll learn about the need for money FAST!</p>
<p>When I ranted about job prospects it was definitely NOT to condone aimlessness and laziness. </p>
<p>In the absence of paying work, there are so many things a young person can do to be USEFUL. Volunteer for grunt work at a nursing home. Volunteer at the Library. Take over the yard work and the housework while home so Mom and Dad can have some free time for a change. Paint that bedroom that never seems to get painted. Cook.</p>
<p>Basically get off the couch/bed and do something that is helpful or useful to someone else.</p>
<p>I have a friend whose daughter acts a lot like the OP’s son. I’ve been listening to her kvetch about her daughter for four years now. My friend keeps demanding her daughter get summer jobs or volunteer work, but when her daughter doesn’t look for one and therefore doesn’t get one, nothing happens. The message to the daughter is: Mom yells at me, I do nothing, but there are no consequences. So she’s become very good at tuning mom out.</p>
<p>If you want your kid to work or volunteer during the summer, and they don’t, then you have to do something more than just tell them to. Withhold spending money, take away privileges, whatever. </p>
<p>In this job market, how well is a college graduate who has never held a job or volunteer position going to do? How many employers are going to look at that (very skimpy) resume and want to hire them? This kid will have no references who can confirm that he can hold down a 40-hour/week job – as an employer, I would throw that resume away.</p>
<p>my son made over 20K total in 2008 and 2009. He also managed to run up 4500 in cc debt. I was paying for ALL HIS books and food (except during the summer). This is a kid who thinks he deserves a coat that costs over 300 and jeans that cost nearly 200.</p>
<p>he goes to NYU. Yes, he is very book smart, and an excellent writer. doesn’t stop him from being a narcissist.</p>
<p>Sass, I still think you have not given him any real incentive. Why should you cover car expenses (maintenance, insurance, gas), a cell phone, or any travel expenses (beyond flights to and from school)? He is doing this because… he can. And you are letting him, and clearly have been letting him for many years… Other than a crabby family (which does not seem to bother him), doesn’t seem like he has any incentive to change. I’d give him one more summer at home with NO supplemental expense coverage by you; no improvement, tell him (in the fall) that he needs to make his own arrangements (at his own expense) for the next summer.</p>
<p>And if you feel strongly enough to kick him out, make some rules on it. If it bugs you if he stays out all night and doesn’t call, make it clear that it is an infraction that will end his free room & board deal for the summer, and he can find somewhere else to live. I don’t think your expectations are unreasonable (I have seen parents out here that I thought WERE unreasonable, I don’t think you are). But you gotta grow a backbone. If you do what you have always done, you will get what you have always gotten.</p>