Apology/ the purpose of CC

Parent Cafe
1

<p>Hi,
I’m posting a new thread because I don’t want to contaminate Marite’s good-bye thread any more than I already have and because some statements posted there have caused me to think about my own past posts. </p>

<p>As most of you know, I posted my son’s story. I got an amazing amount of incredible feedback on my ‘What went wrong?’ thread which has helped us to progress past our experience and look toward the next step. I also hope that the thread will be of use to others and to help them avoid our experience. </p>

<p>However, yesterday on Marite’s thread I read the following statement posted by xiggi: his first sentence is referring to last year’s cc board.

</p>

<p>I find this to be a rather hurtful comment. Not only is it insulting to me, but it makes me feel responsible for driving good people like Marite away.</p>

<p>If College Confidential is not the place to post such a story then I apologize and would appreciate suggestions as to what would be a more suitable topic or way to have sought help for our problem.</p>

<p>Another thing I’d like to clear up is the discussion about recruited athletes that got started by something I posted on the thread about avoiding application disasters. I’m sorry that I mentioned anything about that issue on that thread in particular because it diverted the topic of the thread in a negative way. I admit that it’s an isssue of frustration to me, but I also feel that either I didn’t make my point of view crystal clear enough or others misinterpreted my opinion. I was ONLY referring to the EXTREME cases of where accepted students were substantially underqualified. That said, during the discussion that followed, I feel that I actually learned a LOT from the responses, as angry as some of them were.</p>

<p>Basically I apologize for inadvertantly hijacking the disasters thread, apologize to anyone I may have hurt by my comments on athletics (I truly don’t dislike athletes- I’m athletic myself!!) and want to say that I believe there is a great value from discussions on this board when people disagree in a civil way. </p>

<p>I also think that there’s a place for fun and support including exclamation points, colors, word games etc. It’s a great way to release anxiety about college results, kids leaving home, problems kids are having in school, decisions to be made etc etc… Do others think this is inappropriate for such a forum?</p>

<p>I look forward to your opinions and comments…
andi</p>

2

<p>andi, in my opinion, I feel like you posted from your heart. Understandably, you have felt frustration and disappointment. I don’t envy all the emotions (anxiety, elation, frustration, happiness, sadness … the rollercoaster that is!) that parents of seniors and their children are currently experiencing. I will know that too soon as D is a junior. I believe this must be an extremely stressful time for many, and I am hoping that is why things seem a bit more tense than they did when I first found this place a few months ago. Unfortunately, sitting behind a keyboard does not allow us to totally convey our true feelings in a thorough manner. As someone mentioned on another thread, non-verbal communication is a big part of how something may be taken. Having said that, I will also say that I think hiding behind a keyboard makes it easier for some to be a bit more harsh than they would normally be in a face-to-face conversation. I think we all must come to the realization that we are different from everyone else in so many respects. I feel so fortunate to have found this site. Many of you have been so helpful in my education of the college process. In the end, I believe we are all here for the same purpose … to gain and to share information. Unfortunately, I am more of a “gainer” than a “sharer”, but I have learned much already and hope to be able to help parents of juniors when I am a senior mom next year. Really, andi, you shared your emotions and laid it all out there. Maybe that was uncomfortable for some people, but I like that you felt you could do that here. It obviously means you have developed friendships and bonds with people you felt you could trust to help you through this time. I hope we can all continue to share this board in a productive manner. Best wishes to your son!!!</p>

3

<p>Hi, Andi:</p>

<p>We’re still assaulting the gods of wait lists on behalf of you & your S…and having said that, your thread about “we’re picking up the pieces but what went wrong” was, to me, the best of what CC is all about…a place to go for reinforcement, validation, ideas, feedback, moral support as well as information…my view is that your thread is an example of what I like best about CC–not the events that caused your post (I hope that’s obvious!), but the fact that the CC community is here to offer support–by way of tangible ideas AND by way of emotional/moral support.</p>

<p>I don’t have an opinion about the various debates about recruited athletes or affirmative action–or, more accurately, I do have opinions but don’t feel they add anything to the debate so I’m staying out of those discussions. BUt I not only very much empathize with what you and most especially your son are living through right now, I find it’s this kind of thing (and its corollary–the acceptances that must be celebrated) that have caused my addiction to CC.</p>

<p>So, no apologies required for me…and PLEASE post the INSTANT you hear about your S’s WLs…I check two-three times each day looking for news on Andison (I forget who gave your S that nickname, but I love it!)…</p>

<p>As for other posters who don’t like the emotions and emotional back-and-forth on these boards…well, we’re all allowed to like and dislike different things…and, this being a society of free speech, I guess they’re allowed to say they don’t like it. But I do…I feel a strong “e-bond” to you and your family and I WANT to hear how you’re feeling and what you’re doing, and I’m rooting every day (several times a day) for a happy outcome!</p>

4

<p>Hi Andi! I thought your “what went wrong” thread was an amazingly helpful one for many CC’ers and lurkers. Everyone could see the story of you and your son, and realize that these things can happen to any student. The many people who posted on that thread gave much substance to the theme of “what went wrong”, most of which I found informative, supportive, and full of advice. There are always going to be people who post random comments, or change the idea of the thread to some extent–like taking it to the dogs…?? You were sincere in looking for some help and answers, and I am personally anxious to hear great news about your son!!!</p>

<p>Having been a lurker until about a month ago, I am awkward about posting things unless I think it might be helpful, and I’m sure I have already made some errors in judgement. I know that I have been offended by a couple of comments made after something I’ve posted–I’ve tried to chalk up most of the recent issues on CC as the aftereffects of a very long, tiring and in many cases humbling or disappointing year of college admissions. For most there are at least one or two disappointments (or devastations), but the support, information and advice I have found on CC has far outweighed the negative side people have noticed of late. CC has been such a good “friend” over these last few months, and sometimes “good friends” have bad days mixed in with the great days because the pressures and anxieties of the college process can give way to venting in a way that is not very constructive. A sense of humor has some people using the colors, etc. that you have described (which I have loved–though am too “challenged” to be successful at!), but not everyone sees it that way.</p>

<p>I hope the people who have been so helpful on CC (including Marite, Berurah, etc.–and you, andi) will continue to offer their words of wisdom and support, especially as the rising seniors start the process and need them.</p>

<p>Wishing only good things for your son–remember the “God opening a window” thought!!</p>

5

<p>andi, sweetie~
I have contacted you via email. I am not comfortable posting at the moment.
lots of love, ~berurah</p>

6

<p>andi-
I don’t think you have anything to apologize for. Your posts were genuine, and you were looking for genuine feedback and assistance. That is, in my mind, what CC is for. Most of us have felt so strongly for you. And your awful experience has been a real eye opener for those of us with kids still in the HS-to-college pipeline. Your posts are just as legit and appropriate, if not more, than the umpteen millionth “what are my chances” questions (like any of us REALLY knows).</p>

<p>I usually find myself in agreement with xiggi’s posts, but like Dig and our Super Moderator Roger Dooley said in that thread (<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=60553&page=5&pp=20see[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=60553&page=5&pp=20see&lt;/a&gt; Digmedia’s post #100, as I can’t find Roger’s original post–perhaps it was removed), I didn’t this time. I think people are trying to understand why the CC posters have been so snarly of late, and may be trying to get things back on track. I think that may have been Xiggi’s intent, but I personally think he was a little indelicate in his approach this time. But I forgive him. We all make mistakes. I don’t think you should blame yourself for anything. </p>

<p>We all have differenct opinions and will disagree about many things-- thats what makes horseraces, as they say (analogy chosen because its Kentucky Derby day). As I said-- I diasgree with xiggi on this one, and I think he could have been a little kindler and gentler in his words. I also, as frequently as I agree with Berurah and Yemaya, did find myself a little tired of the increasing colors and the fonts-- but that is entirely their right to do that if they enjoy it (unless it takes up too much bandwith and slows down CC. :eek: All of us were frustrated with how slow CC was around April 1st-- due to heavy traffic at the time).</p>

<p>I truly hope Marite will stay around. Her gentle demeanor and wisdom has been helpful. The response to her expressed departure has been powerful. But alas, many cc’ers, well-known and lurkers, have come and gone, and CC will go on. I have missed a lot of what has transpired over the past few days, as I have been reading fewer threads, but whatever caused the fracas, I hope the corner has been turned. (I would love to be a fly on the wall in the moderators private thread right now…).</p>

<p>Andi-- don’t you leave. Keep us posted. We are all pulling for you. And happy mothers day!</p>

7

<p>Andi, I wanted to reply to you because your post regarding your son’s trials and tribulations was not only moving it was very informative. Although I don’t post often, due to not knowing much, I don’t consider myself a lurker - more of an information seeker! I really appreciate the parents who have shared their joys, but I learn just as much from their losses. Your original post that you referred to was certainly not a “woe is me” type of post, but more of a “here’s what has happened to my son, and what can I do to help him.” Wow, what a mom, and how enlightening to us newbies!<br>
When I first started reading some of the posts in March, I couldn’t understand how so many “strangers” could show so much support and understanding of one another, but I have even found myself here on the sidelines thinking, “I wonder how Andi’s son is doing?” So, I’m beginning to get the connection. You guys started off the application process together, and you really are pulling to one another. Good for you!</p>

8

<p>Andi - I too agree with what you are saying, but didn’t want to mention it since I was afraid of causing more problems. I thought this was a forum where we could post about what we were going through & looking for advice at the same time. I too have maybe posted before I really looked at what I said (& I have edited and removed some) or maybe how someone else would look at it & I have apologized for something that I said or apologized because someone took something I said and (not that they twisted it) read it differently than I meant it to say. In any event, I humbly apologize for any posts I have made that may have contributed to this problem. I’m not sure at this point that I’m going to post anymore either (except under the actual school that my son will be attending) because I just don’t like it when people write down comments about people’s problems that are not helpful or seem to be helpful. </p>

<p>Good luck to you & your son, you have been very helpful to people on this board:)</p>

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<p>Andi -</p>

<p>No apology required for your initial post. None. It has been so useful to make concrete the otherwise vague “It’s a crapshot” realities. So sorry it is your son, but I promise you have done many people a service. </p>

<p>One point I do wish to make - cautiously. If we look back at the incendiary threads of the last several days, we will see that people respond OK to requests for support when the primary emotion is distress. But when the primary emotion for which the OP wishes support is anger - then people respond differently.</p>

<p>Here’s a simple pretend example.</p>

<p>I say “I am so sad, I spilled my milk.” Everyone supports me: maybe using too many colors but that’s another issue.:)</p>

<p>I say “I am so mad, my stupid milk glass is too slippery and made me spill my milk.” Now some people support me, but others come to the defense of the milk glass, and before we know it debate is raging and then someone accuses someone else of ignorance or insensitivity and then someone else accuses me of actually drinking Coke and then the debate blows up into a fight.</p>

<p>I think anger may incite anger. Just a thought.</p>

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<p>

Is this the quote to which you were referring? Here it is from the Rules of Decorum thread <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?p=798112#post798112[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?p=798112#post798112&lt;/a&gt;

</p>

<p>Whatever our current “issues,” some of the recent discussions clearly demonstrate how many people care deeply about this forum, and fervently hope that we will be able to move on together (to the sheets and bed risers threads!)
And Andi, I very much hope that you will have a joyful reason to be involved in the sheet shopping.</p>

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<p>From an objective viewpoint, the sociologist in me finds this all kind of fascinating. Why do people react this way? </p>

<p>Alumother, I think you have a very valid point about how it’s put out there in the first place: is it in an angry way or is it in an “I’m sad” way? Anger does incite anger e.g. a mob mentality.</p>

<p>I also think that timing plays a big part. As Roger said, this is a very emotional time of the year for parents: some elated, some sad, some worried, some scared and it would be easy, I imagine, for someone to say something out of their own emotions without truly thinking of the consequences of their comments (or maybe they just like to stir things up but I think, hey, it’s an internet board, if you want to say something go ahead. I’ll just skip your post and move on to the next!).</p>

<p>Back when I wrote about my daughter’s disastrous and sad experience with sorority rush, I got nothing but support and positive responses. And I know there are people who hate Greeks for just the reasons I wrote about and it would have been easy for them to get up on a high horse and rail about frats and sororities but everyone who posted and held that opinion did so in a very civilized manner than didn’t bother me at all. But that was back in February, when people were in a holding pattern and worry and concern were probably predominant feelings. So, it may have been easier to reach out to someone at that time. And I did put that thread out there from the standpoint of how sad I was for my daughter - not angry at the system (altho that was in there a little) but more for my daughter’s feelings.</p>

<p>Andi, I think that’s what you did in your thread and I also think you have NOTHING to apologize for. I liked your thread - although, obviously, not the reason for writing it in the first place. It’s helpful and that, to me, is the one of the primary purposes of this site. I also am one of those people who opens up CC and quickly glances through the thread topics deciding what to read. One of the first things I am always looking for is an update on your son. I really hope the news turns out good and we can celebrate with you.</p>

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<p>Andi,</p>

<p>I also hope you know that if the fates do not give you a good outcome with the WL, this board will still be extraordinarily supportive. My guess is should that happen, this would be the right place to come for wonderful, deep, unusual, creative ways for him to spend a gap year, suggestions that would in the end make that initial rage at the fates turn into one of those stories that start, “The best thing that ever happened to me.” So do not be a stranger.</p>

13

<p>Andi, there’s no need for you to apologize. Your post was very helpful to the many lurkers and parents of juniors. You were (are) experiencing a nightmare that we all knew could happen. The posts that followed will be very helpful to those that join now for next year. Your post is one of the reasons for a website like this.</p>

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<p>Andi, you don’t need to apologize. CC IS for sharing experiences, the good and the bad. I think the outpouring of support that you got with your disappointments has been wonderful and I have witnessed the same when I have had down times. The support is great. Also, I want to clarify since I did post on Marite’s Goodbye thread about bringing in the “personal” here. I definitely want folks to share personal experiences and come here for a shoulder to lean on. Your post about your son was approrpriate in that way. So, I hope the forum does keep sharing personal things. </p>

<p>I more meant (and definitely was not thinking of you in this case), that sometimes the threads lately got personal between people a bit. I like Alumother’s post above. I think sometimes people posted about personal experiences and rather than said, “help me deal with this”, they also were angry at whatever it was in the “system” and then asked for advice/support and sometimes had trouble dealing with the responses that were not always in “agreement” with the sentiments, so to speak. Then it gets bogged down in people almost taking sides or arguing and sometimes people brought in their personal aspects like almost against people, rather than the messages at hand. I am talking in general here, NOT about you at all. It is just that there seems lately to be some posts/threads where the discussion got personal BETWEEN folks. But I do like posts that deal with personal issues that are looking for support/help. </p>

<p>I, along with many others, are hoping the best for your son. You already know that I have tried to help you off the forum with your son’s situation. </p>

<p>I think if all posters keep it to what Alumother said, sharing their disappointments and concerns, as well as the positive stuff, and then openly welcoming responses, rather than bringing in the anger, it might help. Alumother, that was a really good point that I had not thought about but it really does work. If we keep it to empathy and support and those reaching out also keep it to “help me deal” as opposed to anger at the situation and then people “take sides”, it might swing back to the original thing we all love about this place. We all do care. </p>

<p>Andi, don’t worry so much. Perhaps one or two posters responded in a harsh tone but overall, people do support you. Some might think you might have done this or that differently but it doesn’t matter because the bottom line is that nobody would wish this situation on any kid. So, you ARE supported in this current situation, believe me…
Susan</p>

15

<p>JEM-
Yes, thank you, that was the post to which I was referring. Somehow, I thought I’d seen it somewhere in Marite’s thread, but I was incorrect. I also inadvertently referred to our Admin. as a Super Moderator. Oops again.
At any rate, I think whatever it is that happened over the past few days (could anyone, perhaps the mods, do a cliffnotes summary?? I do not want it rehashed-- I am just feeling, like many, a little in the dark, and it would be helpful to know what we are talking about…) has caused the CC community posters to take a step back and a good look at ourselves. This is a good thing. Seems like at this point we are becoming a kindler, gentler community.</p>

<p>Fredo’s observations are very accurate. Timing is very important. As the seniors, and the parents of seniors are dealing with transition, separation and closure, so too that may happen here on CC. After all, this community, like all commuities, will model what happens in the “real world”. And as fredo said

Please know that we are all hoping for the best for you. Please keep us posted</p>

16

<p>No apology necessary, Andi. None at all. I think the thread on your S’s situation was appropriate and will be helpful to generations of CCers to come.</p>

<p>Someone posted that perhaps in our efforts to emphasize that there are fine schools beyond HYPS and the top LACs, that perhaps we didn’t congratulate Marite’s S. I do not think Marite would leave for such a reason, and the fact is, we did. I remember a thread entitled “We’re Done” or something like that, when she told us that her S got into H as an ED applicant. Everyone was thrilled and posted as such.</p>

<p>I have read the forum a lot lately, but posted very little, because frankly I am reluctant to get caught up in the fray. But in hopes this thread will remain congenial and ultimately help shape CC into a more useful and collegial forum, I will post my opinion here.</p>

<p>For me, CC is most useful when it is information rich - I understand the posts that say nothing more than “Oh, how terrible, I support you!!!” or “Congratulations!!!” - indeed I’ve posted a few like that myself - but I would enjoy and benefit from the forum more if people did that in a PM or an email. I have no trouble with posts that start that way, and go on to include a constructive comment, potential solution, alternative way to look at the issue, related data from an article or study, etc. </p>

<p>But when posts are strictly to empathize/congratulate/support the anger and the like, I think they are more appropriate for a PM. I realize that some long-time members have been following the stories of some applicants for months or longer, but still, it seems more appropriate for a PM or an email. </p>

<p>As for actual decisions - who was accepted where, who is going where - I would prefer if people posted their kid’s decisions/acceptances on a general thread, along with everyone else’s, not a thread for just their kid, and was a little embarrassed when someone started a thread on my kid’s behalf. (Ironically I feel sure the motive was admirable and done out of friendship and sincere good wishes, in an effort to be sure to acknowledge and celebrate a non-HYPS decision.) But if we all use the general threads, members who feel they want to could PM or email individual posters and it would seem less like a clique or that the kudos just go to the HYPS folks. </p>

<p>And if we use PMs/emails that way, there is really no need to post “So-and- so, I sent you a PM” unless a mailbox is full. If indeed it is a private message, no need to broadcast it. To my mind such posts just clutter up the thread. </p>

<p>Just my two cents.</p>

17

<p>I think Alumother is on to something here. If you post out of distress and a need for help, pretty much everyone here will symapthetically jump to your aid and support. But if you post out of a need to “vent”, you will likely create an argument.</p>

<p>I would further caution against any of us becoming too emotionally involved with the comments of strangers on an internet discussion board. If in the course of one of these discussions you find yourself loving those wise and caring people who agreed with you and hating those cruel idiots who didn’t, you are probably on the wrong path.</p>

18

<p>I very much appreciate that you have shared your son’s admissions’ saga, Andi, and I feel you need not apologize. The threads about your son’s sad dilemma are compelling and highly instructive, and I, too, am rooting for him to hear some good news soon. </p>

<p>I try to keep my participation here minimal because I wish to maintain the privacy of my daughter and family and to keep us unidentifiable in real life, but I know that this is at the “cost” of not getting as much specific feedback and advice from folks here. But kudos and thanks to those of you who openly share the stories of your families through the admissions maze, highs and lows, emotions and all.</p>

<p>I believe that one of the great things about an internet “community” like CC is that people who ordinarily might not meet or interact, from different backgrounds and with different viewpoints, engage in discussion here. Admittedly the people on CC are motivated and intelligent and that’s one of the pleasures of the site, but I like the diversity of opinion. Generally I think the discussions on CC are fairly civil and often are full of humor and sympathy as well as useful information fleshed out with anecdotes.</p>

<p>However, what always surprises me about internet discussion boards is that inevitably it seems some members wish to dictate to the others the nature or style of their participation. I appreciate the moderators’ judicious use of their powers to keep things from overwhelming their servers or from becoming slanderous or deeply offensive, but otherwise I think principles of free speech should reign. I also believe that the CC “community” will always be changing and shifting as participants flow in and out and to try to define its character or the course of its river too much is deadening and ultimately futile.</p>

19

<p>Andi:</p>

<p>You’re doing the best you can, girl. Your post about what went wrong was incredibly helpful and I wish I had seen one just like it four years ago! The learning curve to go from “the system is screwing me and others like me (fill in any number of workable situations)” to “well, the system is sure imperfect, let’s figure out how to work best within it” is arduous and can be somewhat painful…I felt a bit like the former with my first D and was fully realistic with my 2nd D, especially when I could see the differences in their lists and know the exact differences between them.</p>

<p>Many posters have been here for years, diligently reading and postin, and they see everything posted in that large context. Others have been around long enough to learn, but are lurkers (I 1st saw this in 2000!) and not a real known entitiy when posting. Still others are brand new and have not yet had their “admissions system epiphany!”</p>

<p>We all would be better served to try to believe people did not mean things as harshly as they have sometimes come across, to realise that not all posters are eloquent at expressing themsleves- they didn’t mean it like it sounded!, that newbies will have a painful day when they learn the truth. Many of us are not bitter, but accepting, and yet, there are many inequities in the system. If we fix them, there will be new ones. Oh well, that’s life, but it isn’t easy to learn those life lessons when it affects your BWRK:)</p>

<p>Alumother is right about the posting “feel” and the reactions to anger, but also, it is probably true that many, many of us felt that anger, even if only briefly, we jsut didn’t all post it raw on the forum (or maybe we did, but it was long ago and we’ve been forgiven our naivete)</p>

<p>Let us know how the waitlist works out!</p>

20

<p>Andi:</p>

<p>You can add me to your list of admirers. You have been courageous and gracious in dealing with the ultimate college admissions nightmare. And like everyone else, I am pulling as hard as I can for your son.</p>