Appropriate Expectations 4 Kids: Do You Have Any?

ACCecil · October 28, 2010, 1:25pm

I’m wondering, from starting and reading the thread about my son’s GF, if there are a few parents left that are “old school” when it comes to seeting appropriate and healthy expectations for their kids.

I’m particularly interested in hearing from parents who have high expecations for their kids. How do you set and enforce those expectations? I do not define “old school” as beating one’s kids if they get less than a 4.0 GPA.

I realize some parents go too far and when the parents go too far the kids get hurt one way or the other. I get that. I also understand that we have more slackers in the USA than we really need.

It occurs to me that if you are one of these proud hands off parents that are afraid to in any way encourage your kids to grow and develop and you basically interfere in nothing they do (OMG I don’t want to be controlling) and you provide whatever it is they need and make sure they work and/or earn nothing you are pretty much producing a slacker. I define slacker as a guy or girl who is great at surfing or playing video games or texting but – what a shock – the minute mom and dad isn’t there to enable them and finance them they are pretty much helpless.

My son/daughter quit.

My son/daugther is on the way home.

My S/D can’t handle the pressure.

Well, what did you expect hands off parents? How did you in any way shape or form prepare them for the Real World? Or was that someone’s else’s job?

Seriously. Any parents here with high expectations? I hear an echo.

Youdon_tsay · October 28, 2010, 1:41pm

I have high expectations for my kids. I feel that parents with low expectations are seldom disappointed. ;)

But don’t fool yourself that high expectations in appropriate areas (grades) is the same thing as taking cheap shots at your ds’s dates. I haven’t posted on the other thread, but while I’m here let me say that I think you’re manufacturing reasons to not like this girl and trying to break them up for fear that you’ll lose some control over your ds.

ACCecil · October 28, 2010, 1:49pm

Okay, fair enough.

I do not have any fear of losing control over my sons. I don’t control my sons but I do guide and help them in life (a form of control but it is called love in any other context).

Since I do not fear losing control over my sons that kind of shoots some holes in your theory as to why I don’t like his GF but thanks for sharing it.

If I may ask…how do you set expectations for your kids? What happens if they don’t meet those expectations? Do you get tough or just shrug?

emeraldkity4 · October 28, 2010, 1:53pm

Both my kids are first gen college & I do not take credit for their accomplishments.

My oldest is currently in grad school ( which she found scholarships for apparently) & very happy.
She graduated from a top LAC in 2006 and has been living on her own since then.
Youngest is a sophomore in a great university & is very active in her school and the community. Really an amazing young woman.
Both making their mark on the world.

I also don’t view taking time out or realizing changes need to be made as " failing".
Keeping your eye on a goal despite other things that may be more important is not success- but stubbornness.

We learn more from our mistakes than we do from our successes- just ask Albert Einstein.

Youdon_tsay · October 28, 2010, 1:57pm

The amazing thing about control freaks is that they don’t realize they are control freaks.

Sometimes I get tough, sometimes I let them suffer consequences. No blanket answer to your question.

ACCecil · October 28, 2010, 1:59pm

kity4,

Thanks for the replies (on this and the other thread).

Are you saying, basically, that you didn’t do much and let them find their way? That you only interveined when you had to but otherwise stood on the side and whispered in their ears as needed.

A river eventually finds a way back to the ocean kind of thing?

You aren’t tough enough :-)? Hopefully the proud parents of a true slacker will participate in this thread soon. Lord knows there are plenty of them here – probably hiding.

If teaching one’s kids to text, sext and play video games all day is good parenting then I am a truely bad parent so far. I know you are out there afraid to say anything unless it is nice parents. If S/D doesn’t get off the couch then what?

Just walk away because if you correct them they might hate you later in life? Well, wake up folks.

ACCecil · October 28, 2010, 2:01pm

The amazing thing about control freaks is that they don’t realize they are control freaks.

-Yeah.

-And by control you mean what?

Youdon_tsay · October 28, 2010, 2:02pm

Cecil, you should know that I am INCREDIBLY good-looking, so you would like me IRL.

Nrdsb4 · October 28, 2010, 2:06pm

I sincerely doubt any parent who is “teaching” their kids to text, sext, and play video games all day would spend even one minute on a site called “College Confidential.” So you aren’t going to get a whole lot of feedback from “hands off parents” who have raised “slackers” on this forum.

srw · October 28, 2010, 2:07pm

I haven’t read the other thread, but I will give my 2 cents based on what I have read here.
I taught my kids the basics of life when they were young. Work hard, get a good education, be kind and ethical…etc. Then I have stepped away as much as possible. I am very proud of my sons and the choices they make. Do they always make the best choice? No, of course not, but they do learn from their mistakes. They have completely chosen their own paths in life and seem to be happy and thriving. Sometimes there is a bad choice of girl friend and my oldest has been in and out of college, but he is slowly understanding that a degree is very necessary. If I had stayed on his back he would have completely turned away from getting an education, but he is accepting the reality of it on his own terms. Both my sons have worked since early HS, they have bought and maintained their own cars. My youngest is in a private college has worked hard to maintain his scholarships and has worked two jobs while in college to make ends meet. So my “hands off” approach has created two independent young men who are not afraid of hard work and they are both decent ethical people who know what they want to do with their lives and are not afraid to work for it. As a matter of fact my rules while they were in HS were: go forth and do what you want as long as you come home on time, I do not smell anything I do not want to on you and you seem to be happy and thriving, OR your life will be mine to run. I only had one break curfew once. Even as seniors in HS when they were both over 18 they never asked to have their curfew extended. Why ask a kid where they are going, we all know that most will not be where they have said they were going. My way, wen they got home they were not afraid to tell me where they went and who with. Being available, supportive and setting a good example are far more important than micromanaging a kids life. They WILL rebel - pick your battles.

emeraldkity4 · October 28, 2010, 2:07pm

*Are you saying, basically, that you didn’t do much and let them find their way? That you only interveined when you had to but otherwise stood on the side and whispered in their ears as needed. *

An example-
my younger daughter wanted to take a year off before college- which I was all for- She worked two jobs to earn money for travel ( she wanted to do a gap travel year- however, we couldn’t help financially). To make her money go further, she wanted to travel/volunteer in Asia, as Thailand, India etc, were much less expensive than what her friends parents were paying to have their kids travel in Europe.

She mentioned to me, that she needed help to find a program through which she could volunteer in India, and setting up airfare.
I was in denial, that my barely 18 yr old daughter would be going to India by herself, and instead found her brochures of programs 500 miles from home.
She found the program & set it up herself & while it took her longer than she wanted to earn the money to go, she spent almost 5 months volunteering & traveling in India.

worknprogress2 · October 28, 2010, 2:11pm

I don’t think we have a surplus of “hands off” parents on the College Confidential thread. This is just not the place where delinquent parents hang out.

I have been a school psychologist for over 30 years. I do a lot of consulting work, mostly with young adults. I have seen the good, the bad, and the ugly in parenting. I have seen good parents with a child who inexplicably gets off track. I have seen amazing kids with parents who are absent, hovering, abusive, you name it. I am humble enough to know that I don’t have all the answers - we are raising children, not plants, so we cannot always control the outcome.

What we can control is who we are as parents. I have always maintained that we should have child-rearing classes, rather than child-birth classes. Before our children are born we should look to our partner and decide what we value, what we cherish and live our lives so that our children hear, feel, and see that message each day. I think we should write it down so that when issues pop up we can ask ourselves, where does this fit in what I value?

I have rather high expectations of my daughters. I expect them to be grateful for everything life has given them. They were blessed to be born in this country with good health and fine minds. They were blessed to be born where they never had to worry about being hungry or cold. They are expected to treat everyone with kindness, whether they like the person or not. They are expected to use the gifts they have been given to make a difference in this world. They are expected to endure when things get tough - because their lives are still easier than most.

I believe if we think about our own values, and commit to living our values, our children will generally do the same.

Both of our dd’s have been successful by most anyone’s standards. D1 graduated from our flagship state u, did two years as a NYTeaching Fellow in the Bronx, and now is working in DC. She is engaged, paying for her own wedding (we will give a generous gift) and is just a lovely person.

D2 is a senior at a top ranked school, has done missionary work in Egypt, New Orleans with her church at college and is planning on working for a non-profit for a couple of years before law school.

This is not to say there was never any friction in our home - we are not some perfect Hallmark family. But I can look at both of my girls and know that in the things that matter they have absolutely lived up to, no exceeded our expectations.

ACCecil · October 28, 2010, 2:14pm

So my “hands off” approach has created two independent young men who are not afraid of hard work and they are both decent ethical people who know what they want to do with their lives and are not afraid to work for it. As a matter of fact my rules while they were in HS was: go forth and do what you want as long as you come home on time, I do not smell anything I do not want to on you and you seem to be happy and thriving, OR your life will be mine to run.

-Great on point reply.

-I appreciate it.

-Your approach worked for YOUR kids that is all that matters.

-My question for you is this. It sounds like you gave them some room but you also set boundaries. If those boundaries had been crossed would you have shriveled up into the fetal position or laid down the law?

-If you had chosen the latter approach wouldn’t you have been afraid they would turn away from you because you were so mean or whatever other fear sounds good?

paperplane · October 28, 2010, 2:24pm

I’m pretty old-school when it comes to expectations.
My children were/are (one out of the nest) expected to do their best at school, to do chores, to be respectful of others. When they were young, I supervised their playdates. Then I supervised and checked their schoolwork. I made sure they didn’t watch too much TV. Or eat too much candy. Is this the sort of thing you mean?

As they grew older, I was much less involved in those sorts of things. You might even call me ‘hands-off’, though we do eat a family dinner most nights, and spend leisure time together. Through high-school, they have a curfew. They choose their own friends and social lives, and I only get involved in school work now if they ask for my advice.

My overarching goal in parenting has always been to prepare my kids to think on their own and to have solid values instilled in them to help guide them after they were old enough to be making decisions independently.

Kids mature at different rates. It is up to the parents to gauge when they are ready to ‘fly solo’; that ‘flying’ also is best done a little at a time. Successful ‘flights’ and crash-and-burn failures both teach kids how to get along on their own.

The references to kids who have had troubles and are quitting school, etc–may or may not be from the parenting. I’ve seen kids in the same family, raised by the same rules, where one always had to learn everything the hard way. Some people are just like that. As parents, I feel my job is to love my kids for who they are. To give them the benefit of lots of love always, and to begin letting them fly the plane as teenagers, so they will be fine when they are on their own.

mathmom · October 28, 2010, 2:32pm

I think I was pretty hands off. We made it clear we expected our kids to use their intellectual abilities, but we were not going to spend our days nagging them or micromanaging homework.

My older son is brilliant, but very one sided. In high school he whipped through his homework (doing well enough to graduate in the top 2% of his class), and then spent hours on the computer. I looked in often enough to know that there was a lot of gaming, but also a substantial amount of time reading about Linux and learning to program in Linux as well as some time where he was earning money programming. I was a little worried he might not know how to work hard once he got to college, but he chose a college where he could spend 90% of his time doing computer programming, math or physics and he’s had no problem continuing to excel, but putting a lot more hours into official learning.

Younger son’s gifts are harder to pin down and he had some minor LD issues, but we used pretty much the same approach. He’s taking two notoriously difficult courses and has admitted that he’s struggling a bit to keep up with all the work. But it’s clear to me from conversations that he is working to the best of his abilities and learning a huge amount. He’s a pretty social kid and I thought it was possible that he might get distracted by the party scene at college, but in fact I think he’s not being social enough.

I think I was lucky that neither kid seems to be interested in drinking or experimenting with drugs and that they fell in with a crowd with the same attitudes. I don’t consider it superior parenting on my part really.

system · October 28, 2010, 2:32pm

I have high expectations of myself, as does my spouse of himself. I believe that in most cases, setting a strong example for one’s children leads to those children developing into responsible and self-motivating adults. Providing a home where there is alot of love, communication, humor, faith, and service to others as the environment in which those children are raised makes an enormous impact. Do we have rules? Yes. Have there been consequenses for not following them? Yes. But I would still call us “hands off” parents by the OPs definition, and our kids are far from slackers.

paperplane · October 28, 2010, 2:32pm

I’m pretty old-school when it comes to expectations.
My children were/are (one out of the nest) expected to do their best at school, to do chores, to be respectful of others. When they were young, I supervised their playdates. Then I supervised and checked their schoolwork. I made sure they didn’t watch too much TV. Or eat too much candy. Is this the sort of thing you mean?

As they grew older, I was much less involved in those sorts of things. You might even call me ‘hands-off’, though we do eat a family dinner most nights, and spend leisure time together. Through high-school, they have a curfew. They choose their own friends and social lives, and I only get involved in school work now if they ask for my advice.

My overarching goal in parenting has always been to prepare my kids to think on their own and to have solid values instilled in them to help guide them after they were old enough to be making decisions independently.

Kids mature at different rates. It is up to the parents to gauge when they are ready to ‘fly solo’; that ‘flying’ also is best done a little at a time. Successful ‘flights’ and crash-and-burn failures both teach kids how to get along on their own.

The references to kids who have had troubles and are quitting school, etc–may or may not be from the parenting. I’ve seen kids in the same family, raised by the same rules, where one always had to learn everything the hard way. Some people are just like that. As parents, I feel my job is to love my kids for who they are. To give them the benefit of lots of love always, and to begin letting them fly the plane as teenagers, so they will be fine when they are on their own.

3togo · October 28, 2010, 2:33pm

hmm … I set healthy and appropriate expectations for my kids and I assume they have little in common with yours for your kids. Are you having fun tweaking CC parents?

takeitallin · October 28, 2010, 2:35pm

Let’s start fresh here. We have 4 children:
*boy twin, age 26- BS Engineering, full time project engineer for one of the largest construction firms in CA, part time grad student
*girl twin, age26- BA English, Masters in Education, high school English teacher
*girl, age 20- soph at Penn State. Should be a junior but transferred from Boston Conservatory of Music and had to go in as soph.
*boy, age 15, soph. in HS. 4.6GPA, varsity cross country and track, probably Var. soccer this year (JV last).

We set high expectations for our children from birth. We didn’t hammer it in to them, but rather tried to set examples and exposed them to a large variety of activities and experiences. We monitored their activities fairly tightly (checking to make sure responsible parents are home when visiting friends, curfews -flexible depending on activity, etc.) There have been no limits really on hair style or color, clothing (except nothing profane or provocative) or piercings. Gave them guidelines with consequences for not meeting them, tried to stay out of every-day decisions such as friends, activities, sports.

Surprisingly, the 26 yr.old D who pierced eyebrow, nose, lip in HS and dyed her hair every color in the book is now probably the most conservative. She was a model student in high school, and there were no drugs, alcohol, partying, etc. She has been married a year, bought a house recently and is a wonderful person.

Her twin on the other hand who was fairly conservative in looks went thru a big party, drinking stage. We really clamped down on him and totally restricted car use, friends, activities. His grades were not good in HS and he barely scraped thru. There were consequences, all clearly stated beforehand. On the other hand, he has always been an extremely hard worker and had a job since 15 with no pushing from us. He decided to move out at 19 and go to a CC 100 miles away- we were too strict. We told him we would continue to pay for education and books, but no room or board. He got a full time construction job, took 12 units for a couple of semesters, then suddenly got serious, transferred, got almost straight A’s and departmental awards. Who knew?? He tells us frequently he is so glad we stayed on him and didn’t give up on his education. He lives in LA and visits very frequently, calls almost daily.

The 20 year old is very out-going, very bright, and musically very talented. Good grades in HS but did not enjoy HS- a lot of drama but that is her. Extremely responsible, very focused, loves Penn St. Has a BF (almost 3 years). Nice guy but we wish she would date other people. Would not say anything unless she asked our opinion. Even then, I would never criticize him but only tell her I feel like she needs to see what else is out there.

15 year old is easiest. Focused, competitive to a fault, already picking out colleges. No trouble so far but he is so busy I don’t know when he would do anything.

I would say we are very involved without being helicopter parents. We have never interfered with choices of friends, or bashed friends except for safety issues. We have had to bite out tongues frequently but have always held back our comments. We could not stand the oldest D’s last boyfriend, but never said a word. She eventually realized what we had seen and dumped him. Her husband is the best ever! If we see a situation getting out of hand, we will discuss it with our kids and list possible consequences. Tell them they have choices in life and they will have to live with consequences. We always treat them with respect, even if we don’t agree with them. They have made plenty of mistakes, and they have learned from them each time. I feel like we have given them our values and our experiences, and I trust them enough now to make good choices in life. If they do make mistakes, they all know we are here with open arms to support them.

Our system is not perfect but whose is? At the same time, I have to say the results from our oldest 3 are looking pretty good and the 4th is definitely on the right track.

Elleneast · October 28, 2010, 2:40pm

My very high expectation for my daughter is that I want her to be a stand-up person. She knows that ultimately she needs to be able to put a roof over her head. Any way that she does it is fine with me.

My parents were very authoritarian and I went off to college without the tools to make my own judgements. I hope that my daughter understood that my parenting was more about learning how to handle life than any pre-determined goal that I set for her. It was her job to set her goals. Her Dad and I were around to give what I hope was good counsel (and to nag about the day to day “stuff”). I cared much more about her being an honorable person who worked hard and lived up to her commitments than anything else. If I had Attilla the Hun moments it was about organization and the occasional wet towel on the floor.

That is not to say that I didn’t give my two-cents worth and let her know that there are consequences for actions. Especially in middle school kids can be totally wacky when it comes to common sense but by the time she was in high school I felt it was a balancing act of occasionally cautioning and helping with organization but for the most part telling myself to back off and letting her figure it out.

She is a caring friend and an incredibly hard working person. She has had a number of curve balls thrown her way and has handled them. She works extremely hard for what she wants but is able to come up with Plan B and embrace it when Plan A doesn’t work out. THAT is a skill set worth having.

I am possibly the most ambitious person on the planet when it comes to my kid having the tools to create a relatively happy life. I guess that I am “old school”.

Appropriate Expectations 4 Kids: Do You Have Any?

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