<p>My son called this morning - very upset about a grade on a group project he participated in. Apparently, one of the members of his group did not complete his work - resulting in a failing grade for the whole team (4 guys). The project will count as an exam for grading purposes. This will drag his grade down significantly.
I’m torn on this one. I remember experiencing something similar in college and feeling that I was treated very unfairly. But now that I have some life experience, I see that group projects can be good training for the work world.
Perhaps there was something more he could have done to ensure everyone did their part - and therefore - this might be a good (although painful) learning experience.<br>
So my question…do you think this is a fair way to grade students? My son’s thought is that this is a huge (lecture hall) class and that it’s not possible for the teacher to give attention and fair grading to this types of assignment. Any advice? Should he contact the teacher or just chalk this up as a learning experience?</p>
<p>Unfortunately, I think group projects are getting more and more relevent in today’s world. At work - like it or not - we are judged by the success or failure of our whole department.</p>
<p>This happened to my son this past semester (same school as your son). He carried the whole project on his back. The good news is that the teacher noticed and he was offered a TI position in that class for next year. I think it depends on the major–some majors are geared toward group work.</p>
<p>Thread merger! My advice to both my sons has been: in a group project, always make sure one of the members is a really organized girl. (It worked for me in marriage…)</p>
<p>Group projects are rampant in my childrens’ junior high and high school. I give this advice to my girls, if your team member totally flakes, it will still reflect on you. So divide projects up by talent, make sure team members are committed to doing the parts they are doing, set up intermediate milestones, and if a team member is falling behind, make a back up plan, which may or may not include doing their work for them. You are welcome to tell the teacher if some one is not doing their share, but don’t expect this will help your grade, it most likely will only affect the slacker’s grade.</p>
<p>In college, and in the real world, all this holds true.</p>
<p>I teach college classes. I often do group activities, but never for a grade.</p>
<p>I really hate this. If I wanted my kid to get workforce training, I’d send him to that instead. I send my kids to school to learn, not babysit classmates who don’t care as much.</p>
<p>I HATE group projects!! My daughter just complete a group project in college with 3 other students. Oh wait, one never showed up in class and the other dropped the class without telling anyone. Luckily, the professor was understanding and the girls were able to reassign the work between the 2 that were left. My daughter did most of the work but didn’t mind as she is as anal as her parents 
The night before the group presentation and written paper was due my daughter was waiting for the other girl to email her portion. At midnight she was still waiting and trying to study for a final in another class. She was able to get the work finish, just a lot later than she would have liked.</p>
<p>Group projects during elementary and middle school are more work for the parents. We are the ones that have to schedule when we can get the kids together to work. When you are a mom with several kids with assorted activities and your own work, it is hard to find a time that works for all kids in the group. My daughter was always the one that would give in and miss an important activity or a play date.</p>
<p>I guess he should have said something in the first place ahead of the score to the prof. My D had a similar experience and she became frustrated because she did not decide to attend college to be a hard ass to another student. She shared that aspect with the prof and adjustments were made. </p>
<p>It’s not about learning for the workplace because these things often happen in general studies classes and not everybody is going to be a business major and not everybody is going to work in a team. </p>
<p>I pointed out in the right situation you may have a physical fight if someone dogs on a project. It creates an unnessary pressure to a student. Yes, by all means let the prof know, let the advisor know. Sometimes it’s pointing out something the prof didn’t consider that needs to be pointed out. Let’s say a student beats up another student for not working on the project and thus lowering everybody’s grade… would that conflict happen if groups weren’t demanded by the prof? Does the prof share responsibility for that situation? Who wants that kind of pressure. The best way to avoid a conflict is to not create a situation where it can happen.</p>
<p>I don’t think they are fair. My kids have had many of these over the years, and have almost always been stuck with far more work than the others in the group. This past weekend my D spent 11 hours shooting and editing a French video project. The other kids did very little and arent’ very good in French, so she had to decide whether to take the lower grade or do more of the work, as usual. She chose more work. I think it’s a lazy thing for a teacher to do. This particular assignment included each student making up and handing in 10 questions—a quiz—about their projects. They have done the whole thing for the teacher, including first teaching each other, then making up the test. There are lots of times in the real world that this kind of thing comes up, but I think kids shouldn’t have to deal with the laziness of other students for their grades.</p>
<p>In architecture school I had several group projects. One was a design project, I was part of one of the few couples that stayed married. I remember one project where I read what my partner had written and was absolutely appalled - it was disorganized and jargon-filled, the worst of architectural gobbledygook imo. I took my red pen to it. Unfortunately she didn’t see what was wrong with it. We ended up compromising. Since Columbia’s arch school was pass/fail, it was only my pride that got hurt turning in that thing with my name on it!</p>
<p>mathmom - funny comment about avoiding a divorce. One of the strange parts of my son’s experience is that the kid who didn’t do the work is one of his good friends. He talked about how he needs to confront him ( I know - he should have done that BEFORE the project was due). I’m not sure the friendship will survive.
He will email his teacher (I advised him to keep it respectful). Also told him not to expect much.</p>
<p>Group projects for grades are horrible. They only benefit the person doing the least work, because team members take up the slack for them and they get the grade regardless of the effort they did/did not expend.</p>
<p>D always complains about boys who don’t pull their weight. Same boys are always hanging around the girls, trying to get their attention. if they only knew that the girls would look at them, if they helped out on the projects.</p>
<p>“that the girls would look at them, if they helped out on the projects.”</p>
<p>Now you know that’s just not true. Girls don’t smarten up for a while after college in most cases. In college, they still tend to choose the cute fixer uppers with issues than the guy who is everything a girl/woman says she wants in a man. ;)</p>
<p>Do students who are graded on group projects learn about group dynamics before the project begins? Is there a “de-briefing” about the performance of the group after the project is complete?</p>
<p>My daughter recently completed a group project and part of the assignment was a “peer review” sheet. The girl on the team who didn’t do any work received poor “grades” from the rest of the group.</p>
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<p>We frequently do those, too. Also, sometimes a project report will include a section on who did what. </p>
<p>Of course, our classes are generally small enough that the profs have a pretty good idea of what’s going on in each group before we tell them.</p>
<p>I hate goup projects. Both of my kids have found that it is just easier for them to cover for everyone else, so they do most of the work. They take charge and just assign others insignificant roles so that they feel that they are chipping in, but won’t hurt the grade if there is no follow through from them. Most kids are basically happy to less, and not make waves. </p>
<p>BTW, my son got a lousy grade in hs on a project b/c one kid (who had known behavioral issues, but needed to be in a group) decided to take part of a project (this part was done in class) from another group rather than doing his share of the work.
The teacher spotted it, and apparently failed this student (this is what he claims, but who knows), and he gave Ds to other members of the group (feels that they were a team, so all should be effected). He felt that other members of the group knew what the other kid was upto, and stood by doing nothing about it. Well, my kid did NOT know what the other boy was upto. This was a 2 quater class, and this project was a very significant part of his grade. I thought this was pretty lousy of the teacher, but my kid not accept responsibility for something that he did not know was going on. I sent a PM to you.</p>
<p>Even if one of the kids slacked off in the group, I don’t see how the whole group would end up with a failing grade. It’s a group project and the blame shouldn’t be placed on the slacker. If I were in a group with a slacker, I’d somehow either force the other person to pull his/her weight or eventually do it for him/her. But blaming him/her for the failing grade would be irresponsible.</p>
<p>Toneranger,</p>
<p>Just the title of this thread touches a nerve with me! My entire family HATES group projects with a passion!!! </p>
<p>The only person who benefits from group projects is the LAZY teacher who gets to grade 5 projects rather than 30.</p>
<p>“If I were in a group with a slacker, I’d somehow either force the other person to pull his/her weight or eventually do it for him/her.”
You know, I don’t think it’s that simple. My son’s friend (the slacker) promised that he would hold up his end - to the very last minute - and then didn’t. Therefore, the group was missing key components of the project when it was turned in. Is it really irresponsible to blame the slacker for screwing things up?
One thing I can say is that my son learned not to always trust what people say - probably a good thing to know for the future.</p>