As high schoolers, it feels like we're not allowed to make mistakes.

Pre-College Topics High School Cafe
1

<p>It’s kind of ridiculous how some of these seemingly tiny choices we make as teenagers will affect the rest of our future. For example, I took a benchmark test in 5th grade that would determine my placement in the math curriculum for the rest of my high school career.
I was a 5th grader, I didn’t care. So I didn’t pay attention and didn’t take it seriously. Naturally, I got placed in an average level.</p>

<p>Consequently, I spent the rest of my school career trying to get ahead in math, as my school wouldn’t allow me to get ahead without doubling up or spending $1000 to take a class over the summer. Being one year ahead is seen as “average” in my school, and these days, no one can afford to be “average” if they don’t want to be overwhelmed with debt after college.</p>

<p>We’re always expected to take responsibility for all of our actions. Get one C or D outside of freshman year, GAME OVER. NO decent scholarships, NO grants, NO prestigious universities for you, unless you do something like cure cancer. </p>

<p>However, when adults make mistakes, we’re expected to give them the benefit of the doubt. When we have crappy teachers, we’re supposed to forgive them and just study on our own. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING is the teacher’s fault. It’s ALWAYS the teenager’s.</p>

<p>If a teacher is bad at what they do, great. They consequently receive the resentment of any student unfortunate enough to get their class.
Nonetheless, they still get to keep their job, and they still get paid unless they do something extreme like sexually molest their students.</p>

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<p>You don’t need to go to a prestigious university to be successful.</p>

3

<p>Don’t blame the system or other people for any of your problems. It doesn’t even matter if you’re right because there’s nothing you can do about it.
Just do your work and do it well. If you want to get ahead in math, go self study the AP test.
Why would you not be responsible for your actions? You don’t have to be perfect, but if you are doing your work there’s no reason to make a C or D. Don’t blame teachers, people around you, the test you took in 5th grade etc. Just do your work. Life isn’t easy.</p>

4

<p>I don’t mind being responsible for my actions, but it certainly feels like many in the adult world do not have to be. Why do they expect us to when they can’t even maintain a half-way decent example?</p>

<p>I’m still going to do my work as I always have…I have no choice. In order to succeed, conforming to the system is necessary. But I’m going to do so with bitter resentment.</p>

<p>What else could I have done for the test in 5th grade? Was I supposed to start caring about college then? :/</p>

5

<p>One thing you’re missing: people who want to be in the highest math track and get the best grades are a small minority at the top of the teenager scale. Teachers are a much bigger group at the bottom/middle of the adult scale. So the comparison isn’t apples to apples exactly but I agree it’s messed up.</p>

6

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<p>This is not true, except the prestigious universities part. Even then that’s not completely true. I can empathize with you because a test freshmen year determined my high school math track and it is very average. I’m a junior taking Algebra 2/ Trig. I think if you want to get ahead, you will have to take the initiative to do so and just live with it. Life isn’t fair and it won’t ever be, just do the best that you can. And even those high schoolers that don’t mess up (the 4.0 people) don’t always see the rewards they want (admissions to ivy league schools and the like).</p>

7

<p>Everyone in my county and a few others in England take an exam in 5th grade to decide which school they’d get into, either a normal state school or a selective grammar school (still free) with more funding and independence. Some people weren’t so smart then or didn’t get private tuition (I got 3 years) and as a result don’t get nearly the same opportunities, placing a huge amount of your future on one exam aged 10.
I think it’s generally worse with the UK school system. My entire grade for this year and last will be based on two short exams in the summer. Just one mess up and that’s it. It’s the same for a fe other subjects, but for most 25% is based on coursework ar an extended essay.</p>

8

<p>That’s kind of weird that you had to take a test in 5th grade to figure out your math curriculum. My 5th grade teacher recommended a bunch of us to the “higher” level in sixth grade because we liked math, did well in it, and enjoyed helping others with their problems. He was able to watch the whole class for many months, and around Feb, he made those recommendations based on which kids he observed liked math and were good at it, not on a single test that we took (although we probably would have done well on it). </p>

<p>If you take responsibility for your actions and thoughts, only good things can emerge. There are so many kids in my school in ap/honors courses that cheat on quizzes and tests. This one kid in my calc class actually cheated on his midterm and the proctor said or did nothing. I feel like not many kids take their actions seriously. </p>

<p>In the long run, it doesn’t matter if you got a 91 or a 96 in a class. It doesn’t really matter if you took algebra II or precalculus your junior year. And it certainly doesn’t matter if you fail an occasional quiz/test (it happens to the best of us… Pretty sure everybody’s failed a quiz before in their life). To be honest, I feel really bad for those kids who cheat just to pass something b/c they’ll never take risks or learn how to deal with learning from failures.</p>

<p>What does matter is how you took responsibility for yourself and learned from your past mistakes and lessons and tried to fix them. What matters is how you tried to set an example even if others weren’t. What matters is how you worked hard for what you wanted and didn’t settle except for your very best. :)</p>

9

<p>The math placement test thing is severely screwed up, but still. </p>

<p>“We’re always expected to take responsibility for all of our actions. Get one C or D outside of freshman year, GAME OVER. NO decent scholarships, NO grants, NO prestigious universities for you, unless you do something like cure cancer.”</p>

<p>How else could it be, though? There aren’t even enough spots in HYPSM-esque schools for all the 4.0 students, let alone students who get Cs and Ds. </p>

<p>However, most colleges, including most good colleges, are not anywhere near as selective as HYPSM. As far as I can see, once you get outside the US News Top 30 or so most of them accept well over 50% of their applicants. </p>

<p>I thought your comparison of teachers and top college applicants was a little weird. Applicants to top colleges are supposed to be among the best students in the country, and teachers are mostly-average adults with jobs. </p>

<p>You don’t have to be above average to be an adult with a job…and isn’t that sort of a relief? I mean, do you really think all the people a year behind in math are going to end up homeless and unwanted or something?</p>

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<p>I don’t get C’s and D’s fortunately, I get mostly A’s. However, that plagiarism incident with APUSH scarred my transcript with a C+. </p>

<p>I compare teachers because they have high expectations that they can’t even meet. They expect you to always be timely with homework, which would be fine if it weren’t for the fact that many of my teacher sturn in their grades late and lose assignments.</p>

<p>Many don’t seem qualified to teach their subject, either.</p>

11

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What? You just sound bitter and irrational.</p>

<p>And you weren’t supposed to start caring about college in 5th grade. You should be interested in learning and understanding the complex world around you.</p>

12

<p>Should’ve cared about getting an education.</p>

13

<p>So sorry that I spent my time enjoying my childhood. I suppose that you can honestly say you spent elementary school doing math problems for fun and studying? :/</p>

<p>Alright, so my behaviors in 5th grade should determine my success and aptitude for a particular subject for the rest of my entire life? Because I didn’t particular care in 5th grade, that must mean I’m utterly incapable of progressing beyond that mindset?
Is that how it should be?
Are you really going to judge me based on that?</p>

14

<p>Please explain how and why I sound irrational to you.
Based on my experiences in high school with my teachers, it’s honestly a true enough statement…</p>

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5th grade won’t determine your success in life nor will how well you do in high school.</p>

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<p>Since the benchmark test determines what math/science courses I am permitted to take throughout my career post-elementary school, it pretty much does determine my success in high school.</p>

17

<p>In your situation I’d almost be inclined to switch schools, but if that’s impossible I don’t see how a college could penalize you for taking what your school requires you to take. Most schools don’t pick your courses for you in fifth grade.</p>

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<p>How similar your situation is like mine actually made me chuckle a bit. Don’t see this so often on the internet.</p>

<p>Where I live, kids move up from ‘elementary school’ to ‘secondary school’ after sixth grade. It’s a big step. I’m not sure if it is that big of a deal in the US, but it can kind of very significantly affect the rest of the kids’ school careers here. This is the time when kids (more like their parents) can choose to take admission exams to get into a few competitive secondary schools around. The stats are crazy for sixth grade, imo. A school I know admits 450 students out of roughly 3000 applicants (15 percent?!). And the indicator is purely academic, so parents rush to sign their forth/fifth/sixth graders up for tutoring classes to prep for these exams. A kid I know with a really enthusiastic mom took classes (that his mother waited in line since 4am to sign up for since there is a high demand for the best tutors) from like 8am-6pm in addition to their usual school time. On weekends. In sixth grade. </p>

<p>And there generally are some obvious differences btw the ‘competitive’ schools and ‘normal’ schools. Better teachers. Better teaching technology. More advanced curriculum. Positive image in society. Better learning environment. And while other kids end up at less strong universities, kids from the top secondary schools fill up acceptances in national top schools and programs, some go to great schools abroad. There are exceptions, of course. But I believe this is a fairly accurate description. </p>

<p>All of this - decided when you are in sixth grade.
Also, please don’t think I’m saying this because I’m a bitter, from-those-normal-schools kid. I’m not, but the truth is extremely disturbing. </p>

<p>And to those people saying ‘a couple Cs won’t affect you so much’. I mean, come on. In this hypecompetitive world, one tiny shortcoming and we get pushed down. And it’s the top we want to be. Many times I really feel like I’m living with some seriously unrealistic expectations from the world: get good grades (which, for my Grade 11 year, involves excelling in math, biology, physics, chemistry, history, health, PE, economics, arts, AND two languages. I mean, who the heck can be great at <em>all</em> these things?), follow the school’s requirements (coming the class on time at 7.40am, do 40 laps around a football field to fill up the mandatory ‘healthy students’ program requirement after school, take part in random school activities that I feel are absolutely preposterous and uninteresting, to come up with a few), have the energy to focus on extra tutoring classes, get impressive standardized exams scores, do ECs, be a leader, worry about college app, possess good social skill, work on an internship, be a good kid, help parents with housework, and the list goes on (who needs sleep and relax these days?). Crack under the pressure a bit, maybe failing to efficiently run that club you are in, and NO you are not good enough. Like a faulty machine.</p>

<p>I kind of agree with post #5. I’ve heard stories about adults out there that get seriously screwed up because of a momentary lapse of judgement or a minor mistake. I don’t think we are having the worst here. Yay?</p>

<p>Solutions? I don’t have one, man. Too tired to think somehow. I tend to bitterly rant to people in the same situation. It does stop me from going insane.</p>

<p>One advice though. Despite all things, the competition might not be as cutthroat and crazy as you may think it is. I’m not a guru on this, and I know nothing about you, but i’ve seen many seemingly average people going to great places. </p>

<p>This turns out to be more of a rant for me than something to help you haha. Sorry :confused: Bottom line is - I don’t know how to fix this damn situation, but I totally understand what I think you are saying.</p>

19

<p>At my school, our high school curriculums depend on 8th grade standardized test scores, as well as our averages in different classes. Since we all knew that high school was determined by those tests, we actually did try :smiley:
I guess it’s a private school thing to base it off of 8th grade, not 5th.
Oh, and you can test up; one of my friends was put in a lower class, but he just took a test that tested his mastery, scored well enough, and was bumped up.</p>

20

<p>As someone who just graduated college last May, I can tell you that it doesn’t get any easier, so you need to get used to it now. Mistakes in college have an even bigger impact than they do in high school. So you’re behind in math now, there are ways you could have gotten ahead again, even if they were inconvenient. That might not always be the case in college. If a course isn’t offered over the summer and the school doesn’t want to accept credits from other places, you’re out of luck. And Cs and Ds? Pretty much say goodbye to competitive internships or grad schools unless you have some AMAZING research.</p>

<p>And maybe teaching is different because of tenure and unions, I don’t really know. But at least among people I know, most of us (myself included) are terrified to make any mistakes because one is enough to have us out of a job. We’re too easy to replace right now. And yes, these are people who graduated from good colleges, with good GPAs, and work experience. It’s an employers market. </p>

<p>So, it doesn’t get any better. I’m sorry that a test in 5th grade determined your curriculum. One in 6th determined mine. I had to double up science in high school to get the classes I wanted. High school’s a special place, if you want something bad enough, there are lots of ways to make it happen. It’s not always like that later. So please, get over it and just own up to what you need to do to get what you want.</p>