ASD is now categorized on 3 levels. Anyone qualifying as level 2 or level 3 likely exhibits significantly restricted speech abilities or odd, repetitive behaviors, which would be obvious the first time you met them.
https://www.autismspeaks.org/autism-diagnosis-criteria-dsm-5
Generally, the ASD person will be lonely, socially isolated, and have few to no friends. They may struggle with making small talk.
Sometimes an ASD person IS a jerk. Their self focus and inability to understand another’s feeling or see their needs causes “jerk” behavior. Rudeness, thoughtless and unkind gifts, using silence when a spouse is trying to have meaningful conversation. Walking away when they become uncomfortable, criticizing the NT–areas such as being completely literal so when the NT says, “the line was a mile long” the NT is accused of lying . It goes on and on. It is very very confusing behavior.
Many ASD’s are able to take on NT behavior typically from 1-3 years. They memorize how to act by watching others, reading, tv and movies. However, most NT’s can look back and remember some things that were “off” but their relationship seemed great overall and they wanted it to work.
It is very hard work for the ASD to maintain NT behavior. They have to watch and mimic and can become emotionally drained. Of course, ASD’s are not all the same and some have more serious areas vs others.
I look back and little things come to the forefront : It was his companies holiday party and my first time meeting this staff. My seamstress ruined my outfit. Stores were closed and I had to improvise. When ASH picked me up, knowing the problem and that I was upset, he said, “you wore that blouse the last time we went out”. Literal. Not one word to help me feel attractive and good. Such a small slight but I did feel it and did not address it. It was confusing. He was such a great guy.
I can talk about this with ASH and have confidence that he has the ability to find the words to say that are appropriate now. Most NT’s married to ASD’s have many many such stories. May seem small but it adds up and corrodes one’s self esteem.
Thanks Oregon. I’m thinking of my mother in law and sister in law who can say the meanest things one minute and then act like all is fine the next. SIL is very rigid, right/wrong, judgmental. They seem to exhibit some traits of what has been expressed here
Even if he was tested, it might not change much. There are no drugs to treat the core symptoms of ASD. Most of the behavioral therapy for ASD is geared to children. There is little in the way of proven treatment options for ASD adults.
Wondering if this is an ASD thing: Came home today after a pretty awful day and said, “Can we go out to dinner? I’ve had a really bad day.” Then he proceeded to go on for 30 minutes about how his day was so much worse. Never in our relationship have I had a moment to have a bad day, be angry or frustrated. He can’t just cheer me up, he always has a worse day than I. And so I listen, and smile, and let him vent.
JC, Hugs.
Did you go out after his tirade?
Do you experience empathy from him?
Having your spouse tested may or may not make a difference. It has made a huge positive difference in my marriage. I know at least know that I am perfectly fine and an NT and have my own needs and quirks. Spending 30 years NOT knowing was so damaging.
The truth helps the healing as does the help of a good therapist. My Therapist specializes in victims of narcissism but often find that the problem is ASD.
Once ASH was diagnosed he accepted that I am NT (sometimes tries to argue differently). He is far more open and he has learned better NT behavior. I am not saying that this will happen for all that choose to be evaluated but it has helped us.
I have been able to believe in myself again. This has been paramount to my healing. The “not knowing” is so very damaging. I also have to understand that I will never ever have my needs met completely, less completely than normal. If I were younger I would make a different decision about my marriage. We just celebrated our 38th. As long as things keep improving then I am here to see but am also prepared to change my life completely. It was the not understanding why I felt so put down and confused that did the majority of the damage.
look up “Cassandra Syndrome”.
This is fascinating.
@oregon101,
Great topic for a thesis/dissertation!
Still learning from all of you. Who mentioned the refrigerator issues?
I completely get the refrigerator “help”. You have to stop, in the middle of what you’re cooking, because husband can’t find it; then they turn their frustration, at not finding the item, on you! “Why did you have it on that shelf? It shouldn’t go there!!!”
I told my husband to grab some pasta for me from the pantry “on the second shelf”. I, apparently, am the only woman on earth, who counts from the top down!!! He counted from the bottom up.
Now, I have to say, “from the top down, it’s on the second shelf”.
This is an Oscar movie.
The relationship between ASD and executive function is mixed. While an estimated half of ASD people have ADHD as well, a significant percentage of ASD individuals score normally on executive function measures for their age.
The fridge thing - although it’s not just the fridge, of course. It’s everything. I rarely ask him anything to do anymore because doing so requires more instructions than I give grandkids, and then the task always necessitates my involvement, anyway. I think I have 4 kids; 3 of whom are launched and 1 of whom never will be.
Here’s an example of being tone deaf. Recently had 25th anniversary. Asked for weeks to do something/anything. “It’ll be cold and dark.” Yes, it will be. You wanted to get married in Jan. and we live in the Midwest. He took a nap that afternoon/evening. Day came and went.
Recently discussing our wedding day - “I really wanted you to carry me over the threshhold.” I weigh 118. Any attempt at a pick-up and shove over would’ve been fine. Nope, wouldn’t try then and now the comment is “Well, you know I couldn’t.” He means he is scrawny, but most women I know would take it as they are too heavy.
Small thing, but multiple daily attacks on the self-esteem over 25 years adds up.
I’ve read some books listed upthread, but I find it irritating they and articles all are constantly what the NT can do to understand/deal with the situation better. I’m tired of being the one dealing. So tired.
The sad thing is that if you bring up the 25th anniversary others will tell you that YOU should have planned the evening. That completely misses the point that we are NT’s and need/want the feeling of being cherished. Making the plans instead without his interest equals just another night out.
The wedding night comment? Isn’t that devastating to think of now (I have a long and disappointing wedding story. If I had been true to myself I would have cancelled the week of the wedding.) It is the little put downs but it is also the neglect of our emotions.
The most important thing to feeling better is that you set limits (sometimes consequences) and that you get enough support outside of the relationship. Most of us have cut ourselves off from that support. I was protecting H. I did not tell even my GF’s much about the disappointing anniversaries or birthday gifts, the daily criticism and put down’s.
The most important thing is to stop reacting. Sadly anger often takes away from the problem being discussed. Say a clear message, write it out even. Then remove yourself. Go out of the house or in another room. Stop giving so much. Maybe you are a giver and it feels good to give but just not to someone who does not reciprocate. These are just a few ways to take your life back. It lowers the frustration.
Stop expecting understanding. Rote black and white behavior is a good expectation (and we do not always get this even). My ASH had some correction of me or put down for decades. I made it clear two years ago that he was to stop, that it was his problem with rigidity and not my problem). He stopped on a dime. The “you cannot take a joke”, “you are too sensitive” comments have also stopped.
@oregon101, when you are around spouses who are affectionate, considerate of each other, and obviously connected, does this just compound your misery?
What you describe just sounds awful to me. But I’m glad you are getting support and are finding ways to cope now that you understand the underlying reasons for your spouse’s behavior.
My ex spouse tested as having zero empathy. Not all people on the spectrum - or maybe even not many- lack empathy, but he does- and maybe that is a different problem, I don’t know. The problem lies in his ability to PRETEND empathy and understanding and the roller coaster that results. The only answer was to stop looking for understanding, but that disengagement causes problems too. I found there was really now answer and gratefully divorced after 25 years “for the kids.”
@compmom, how do you feel now after the divorce? Can you see yourself ever re-marrying? Did your spouse try to convince you to stay?
Happy on my own.
Is ASD considered a mental illness?
Mental disorder and not mental illness is the preferred terminology.
Autism spectrum disorder is included in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders so the answer to your question is yes.