Even a cursory glance at history in this country will show that in much of the 20th century, middle and upper class members of most repressed minority groups were far harsher on members of their racial/ethnic/etc group who deviated from white, middle class social norms.
The psychology behind it is actually quite simple. If you are a member of a minority group, you are considered a representative of that group by the majority group. Members of the majority will rarely be seen as anything other than an individual. Thus, in order to continue improving their status among the majority culture, higher status members of minority groups must heavily self-police all members of their minority group in order to keep their status.
You can see this in the coverage of any mass shooting nowadays. Immediately upon release of the perp’s name or ethnicity: White? Mental illness. Black? Thug. Middle Eastern? Terrorist. Rinse and repeat.
Correcting myself - Brian Rice was one of the arresting officers and he’s African American. He is the one who made eye contact with Freddie Gray before he ran. He was treated for mental illness recently which makes things even more complicated.
Of the six officers accused, three are white and three are black. The most serious charges are leveled against the driver of vehicle, the only one facing a murder charge, who is black.
Sgt White, the only woman of the group, who is also black, is being held on $350K bail, charged with involuntary manslaughter, second degree assault and misconduct in office. She was the one who was supposed to investigate the citizens complaint, and spoke to him but did not try to assess his condition. Talk about trying to throw the kitchen sink at someone. 350K bail, manslaughter, assault…and she didn’t even touch him. Wonder if now they can prosecute all those officers standing around not providing medical attention when Eric Garner died. Perhaps the police departments should actually train their officers how to assess people and provide CPR, and inform them that if they don’t do it quickly enough, they’re going to jail.
^yes, busdriver, this! medical care should be a non-negotiable given. Of course. That they all stood around Garner’s body without trying to revive him or get help should absolutely be actionable.
African Americans have a long history of this phenomenon, and I can’t think of a single black person I know who is surprised by this sort of thing. Part of it is exactly what you mentioned here, greenwitch, and I personally believe that the thing which underpins it all is internalized racism.
“^yes, busdriver, this! medical care should be a non-negotiable given. Of course. That they all stood around Garner’s body without trying to revive him or get help should absolutely be actionable.”
I think police officers should be very well trained in CPR, and paid for that accordingly. I would hope that they have rules in place as far as being required to provide assistance. However, I suspect that all they are required to do is make a phone call for medical attention, but maybe someone else can answer that. I think they SHOULD be obligated, however, if that is not the procedure, I don’t know how they can be imprisoned for that. I would think that someone’s conscience would require them to provide help, however, people often hesitate in providing assistance for many reasons. Afraid to be sued if it doesn’t work, not wanting to be in contact with their body fluids, afraid of getting too close to them and getting attacked.
My point being, even if it is the right thing morally to do, I’m sure there are very specific rules about this. And if those rules don’t require them to provide medical care, then the rules and training need to be changed. But it is unlikely that someone could or should be imprisoned for something they are not trained and expected to do.
“African Americans have a long history of this phenomenon, and I can’t think of a single black person I know who is surprised by this sort of thing.”
Why would anyone be surprised? Everyone is familiar with the statistics. The vast majority of blacks who are victimized, are victimized by other blacks. Though I’m not quite sure what racism has to do with that fact.
These are police officers taking a person into custody ---- their own internal regulations require them to respond to requests for medical treatment and (duh!) to call for prompt medical treatment for someone in their custody who is injured and unable to speak for themselves. If common human decency, a Judeo-Christian moral code, and their own police regulations were not enough to compel them to take action to get timely medical help for someone in their custody ( a person BTW they knew at the time was being arrested without cause) then maybe the penal code and jail time will help the next group of officers to make the right decision.
You put a guy in your van and he’s conscious and asking for a medic. You don’t call a medic, nor do you do anything to aid him. Later, you stop to assess his condition. He is unconscious. You do nothing. When you finally get to the police station, you unload the other prisoner first. When you return to get your guy, he has stopped breathing.
How much medical training do you need to determine that a guy who was asking for a medic, and is now unconscious, needs medical attention? This is not rocket science! They arrested the guy even though they knew perfectly well he had committed no crime, and then they killed him. I hope all six get convicted on every single count.
I would be very surprised if the police were not required to be CPR certified and also to be recertified each year. It seems a no brainer to me for any first responder.
Yes, all hail the almighty statistic, the conservative’s best friend and most stalwart meme.
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Can’t miss the opportunity to pile drive that one, even though my statement was in response to something greenwitch said in post #299, which I then sited in the quote box:
Try to keep up here. The operative word is oppress, as in victimize, afflict, suppress, keep down, handicap, encumber, dispirit. As in "why would someone oppress a person who belongs in their own “group”? My non-surprise was over black oppression by other blacks, not over the conservative’s comfort blanket and red meat morsel, the vaunted black crime statistic. I’m sure you do have a difficult time understanding what internalized racism might have to do with the topic greenwitch raised, and to which I responded. I’m also sure that I have neither patience, nor enough breath in my body to attempt to break it down for you tonight. Perhaps tomorrow.
Passing a CPR certification class annually does not mean you are confident, competent, and required to perform it. I would like to know what the regulations are, as far as what is required of a police officer. Will a phone call do? I wonder how accurate an interview I saw was, where the cop said that it is common for people who are being arrested to call for medical attention, their arm, their neck, etc, and they think they are faking it. So is it required that every time someone claims they are in pain, that the police must call for an ambulance?
I don’t think that Sgt White should be automatically accused of manslaughter and second degree assault, just because she happened to be there. If she thought he was fine and let them continue on, that is completely unfair. There are certainly very specific procedures involved, and I wonder if the prosecutor is charging her based on what Sgt White was required to do, or the maximum amount of charges that the prosecutor can make.
Ah, yes, I also was SO not surprised to see the “but black-on-black crime!” Meme show up here.
Not surprised that many on this board watch FAUX News, but a little surprised that someone is wiling to admit it. (Was lovely the way a protester chewed out Geraldo Rivera to his face the other night. Heard that State’s Attorney Mosby’s husband handed some idiot Faux “reporter” his a$$ on a platter today, and that it was really something to behold. looking forward to watching it. )
Freddie was clearly screaming in pain when he was arrested. At death he had a crushed voice box. Clearly you can’t scream if your box is crushed. Something happened during the ride and I think it was more than a rough ride. I watched the interview of the other guy being held in the van. He said he clearly heard one of the officers say, " yeah we gave him a run for his money, he’s not moving". They beat that man and I hope some of them pay
Baltimore cops have a history of brutality. Few people in Baltimore wonder why anyone would run when they see the cops. If you are these kids, would you run the next time you see the cops? These are white kids. Imagine what happens to the black kids. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GgWrV8TcUc Freddie Gray was the last straw. It amazes me that people don’t protest every day in the neighborhoods around where Gray was arrested.
I think if I lived in Baltimore, I would probably just stay in my home. Fifth highest murder rate in the US, 235 murders in 2014. Some of the cops may be abusive and violent, but how many of those 235 people were killed by cops? It amazes me that people don’t protest there every day about their friends and neighbors being executed.
This phenomenon has also been illustrated in other societies and historical events ranging from Indian colonial soldiers brutalizing and buying into the British colonial racist worldview to locals who collaborated with Nazi and Japanese invaders in occupied countries during WWII and brutalized their own people in the process.
There’s a reason why such collaborators…especially in the WWII cases were dealt with harshly* after those Axis powers were defeated by the Allies and local resistance groups.
Ranges from local women in France known for associations with Nazi occupation forces having their heads shaved off by French resistance fighters to collaborators being summarily executed and sometimes hung with "traitor" signs by local resistance or government forces of the nations freed from the Axis yoke.
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