DS2 is working in a sleepaway camp this summer.
I found out that he had an unpleasant day. He told me that “upper staff” made about a dozen of male counselors dress like girls. He was wearing a bikini top, a skirt and makeup. His words were “I felt humiliated and degraded”. I am not sure what activity it was, or whether it was for a show/play, but it should be voluntary. I asked him why he agreed to do it; we had conversations about not doing things that make him uncomfortable. He said “we had no choice, if your name was picked out of the hat”. I understand that he likes his first job and is trying to work very hard, but this is beyond the pale. Crossdressing is not a job requirement. Another thing is he is not worried about pictures, saying the camp has a strict policy, but I do. Campers are not allowed to bring cell phones to camp, but we all know they do. These pictures taken by anyone may end up on FB in the fall, even if they comply with policy during camp. It may ruin him in HS or it may drive another teen over the edge next year, if that’s part of the program. I feel he would not want me to make waves with management, but I am fuming. Thoughts?
I think that it is a silly thing to do in 2016. Not very PC for several reasons.
But how is this going to “ruin him in HS”?
I think you’ll get more responses if you change the thread title to reflect the actual situation … “Beyond the pale” isn’t very descriptive.
Very poor judgement to let this happen. Sounds like hazing. What other things might you be forced to do if your name is pulled out of the hat? What would be “ok”, what would not be “ok”?
doschicos,
I think it is clear how this may play out in high school if people see pictures of the popular athlete in drag on social media. Our high school is getting “special bathrooms” next year, btw.
Not sure it was hazing if everyone had equal chances to be picked, and I don’t know who is “upper staff”. My question is whether I should address it with management. My husband is against mommy taking care of things. I am surprised that DS2 went along with it, usually he is outspoken. Maybe he realized it when it went too far.
Are you concerned that being in women’s dress will “turn your son gay,” or more that other people might think he is gay or a cross-dresser and harass him accordingly? Your mention of “special bathrooms” makes me suspect that there’s a particular reason that dressing like a girl is more bothersome to you than, say, dressing like a pirate or whatever.
I’m not following you at all. Are you concerned that if the pictures get out, your son will be viewed as being insensitive to the feelings of transgender people? I think your son’s overall actions will prevent that perception, if, for example, he stands up for the rights of LGBT people on his campus when they are threatened.
I don’t think this is “beyond the pale” but I would encourage your son, and not you, to address it with whomever runs the camp. I agree with your husband on that. I also don’t think this will “ruin him in HS” if somehow the pictures are posted. Most kids, unlike some parents, are much more accepting of trans kids, and also are pretty astute at figuring out which kids are trans and which are not.
Hazing could involve some element of random selection among those being hazed.
Wow, way to miss the point.
Who are you responding to, @Pizzagirl ?
Responding to #8. Whether or not something could be hazing if the “victims” were randomly selected isn’t even remotely the point of this thread.
Like an initiation thing for new counselors maybe? Otherwise, I don’t know.
This is hazing, pure and simple. It breaks my heart that dressing “like a girl” is still considered a way to humiliate a young man in 2016 but alas, that’s our reality.
It’s not going to ruin him in high school especially if he owns it and laughs it off.
I’d absolutely go to the highest staff member possible and blow the whistle on this. It’s not ok.
Our local swim team would have different themes for each Saturday meet and every year there was always a cross dressing one. Some boys really got into it and it was hilarious. No question of it being humiliating or somehow gender-questionable. However, it was completely voluntary and up to the kids how far they took it.
What happened to your son does sound more like hazing since upper management forced it on the underlings. Teasing is only fun if you can laugh at what’s said or done to you, otherwise it crosses into bullying. If there are any photos or later repercussions he should be clear to laugh it off. If he appears uncomfortable the bullies are likely to pounce.
8 was a response to the OP's belief in #4 that random selection could make it not hazing. So it is relevant to the topic of the thread.
I missed a bunch of posts because I had this tab opened when there were only 2 posts.
There is a huge difference between dressing in what is obviously not-very-voluntarily “drag” and the fun, playful, voluntary drag. Further, there is an enormous difference between dressing in “girls’” clothes and identifying as Trans. No one will mistake your son as being Trans if he is/identifies as a cis-male.
What does your high school getting “special bathrooms” (whatever that means) have to do with anything?
I am usually all for high school-aged children taking problems into their own hands but when it comes to bullying and hazing, I firmly believe adults should step in ASAP if they know it’s going on. I’ve known too many kids who committed suicide due to bullying to think it should just be left to them. IMO, this is much different than something like disputing a grade.
I don’t think that dressing like a girl will turn him into anything. He knows our family is supportive of LGBT and I know he is not gay.
I am upset that he felt pressured into it. On the outside he may have laughed it off, but to us he said he was humiliated. I don’t want him to become a subject of jokes in school. In addition, it should not happen to other kids.
I will try to find out if this was a part of a special activity he did not mention. May be I will feel better then. He seems to move on already.
Thank you for your input.
I don’t like the idea that it was forced on the new counselors by “upper staff.” It could have been funny if all the guys - all of them - dressed up. I have seen this at parties and in college dorms and it is pretty funny to see guys prancing around like this. But they changed the whole tone of it by forcing only random younger guys to do it. Sounds like the typical abuse of power to me.
If your son felt humiliated then others may have felt the same way. I would be upset only because my son was upset. I would leave it up to him on how to proceed.
Voluntary and participating willingly is different than being forced to participate in something that made him feel humiliated. That is not ok. He may say he is over it but he needs to learn this type of expectation is not acceptable nor appropriate.
I would have a problem with what happened and wouldn’t take it lightly. He should not feel pressured to do anything that he is not comfortable with. What is the consequence for not complying?
What happens next? What else will he be forced to do that he is not comfortable with?
I would draw the line right now before something more serious happens.
He needs to learn to say no and not succumb to pressure. He needs to learn how to defend himself.
Was this entertainment for the camp participants? I don’t think the parents of the campers paid for this kind of entertainment. I maybe in the minority here but I definitely have no tolerance for this kind of immature behavior.
The senior staff were out of line and they need to be reported or be given some warning for this type of behavior. They need to be accountable for their actions. I would consider this unprofessional.