Carleton College/Amherst College/Williams College vs. St. Olaf (Pre-med) [CA resident, 4.0 GPA]

In this case you definitely should budget for a full 8 years of university. Depending on where you go to university, you could be spending something like $100,000 per year for your bachelor’s degree. By the time that you get to medical school, it could cost $125,000 per year. This suggests that if you completely ignore the cost and attend relatively expensive schools, it is possible to spend perhaps $900,000 by the time that they call you “Dr. Lucyyyy”. I do know a small number of parents who could afford this without debt or other problems, but only a very small number (“One” being the number that comes to mind at first glance, and this definitely does not include my wife and I). Also, you do not want to take even half of this as debt because even doctors can have trouble paying this off.

The second thing that comes to mind when I hear “premed” is that the majority of students who start university thinking “premed” end up doing something else. There are a lot of other options. Some are related (such as various other medical professionals, as well as biotech research). Some are not. It is generally a good idea for a premed student to have a plan B.

Two other points have already been mentioned by others: Doctors get to deal with a very wide range of people. It might be a good idea to attend a university that will give you experience dealing with a wide range of people. Also, there are a LOT of colleges and universities that are very good for premed students. If you look at the students in a top medical school, they will have gotten their bachelor’s degrees at a wide range of universities. “All over the place” is an exact quote from a doctor I know who was telling me where other students in their MD program had come from.

And yes you will run into people whose beliefs do not fully align with you.

I do not know much about St. Olaf, but what little I know is very positive. If they have a 72% success rate for their graduates applying to medical schools, then this is very good.

Admissions to medical school will not depend much if at all on what college or university you attend to get your bachelor’s degree (assuming that you attend a decent school in the US or Canada, and avoid specialty schools such as maritime academies or conservatories of music or arts academies). Medical school admissions will depend upon your grades, and your references, and your experience in a medical environment. Premed classes will be tough. Both daughters had majors that overlapped a lot with premed classes, knew multiple premed students from these classes, and have mentioned how demanding some of these classes can be. However, obviously a significant number of students do get through these classes and do well.

I agree about running the Net Price Calculator and getting an estimate of what each school is likely to cost you. You might want to at least consider your in-state public universities, as well as LACs that give merit aid. You might also want to find out from your parents what your budget is for university, and whether any money saved on the cost of a bachelor’s degree can be applied to medical school. In order to run the NPCs, you will need to either get quite a bit of financial information from your parents, or get them to run the NPCs.

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Hi! My unweighted GPA is a 4.0 and my weighted GPA is a 4.6216. I have taken 6 AP classes so far (AP Human geography, AP World History, AP Biology, AP Calculus AB, AP Language and Composition, and AP US History), and I plan to take more as a senior. I have taken both precalculus honors and AP Calc AB and got an A in both semesters for both classes. I have gotten up to Spanish 3, but I do not plan on taking higher than that because my school does not have Spanish 4 and I do not feel that I am ready for AP Spanish. I have taken biology honors and AP Bio and got an A in both semesters of both classes. I have taken chemistry honors and got an A both semesters. I plan on taking physics as a senior. I am taking the ACT on June 8th and on the practice ACT I got 30, but I am hoping to do better than that when I take the real ACT.

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Hi! For my stats, my unweighted GPA is a 4.0 and my weighted GPA is a 4.6216. I have taken 6 AP classes so far (AP Human geography, AP World History, AP Biology, AP Calculus AB, AP Language and Composition, and AP US History), and I plan to take more as a senior. I am taking the ACT on June 8th and on the practice ACT I got 30, but I am hoping to do better than that when I take the real ACT. For my ec’s it is a little bit crazy because I have been to three high schools, but basically as a freshman I co-founded the debate club at my school, was in a program called the Health Science Academy where we basically did a lot of medically related activities in the class and got a lot of medical volunteer hours and worked at blood drives and things like that. As a sophomore I switched schools at the beginning of the year, so in my new school I did the debate team again, joined cross country and track (but I was really bad at running and was on JV I more did those just to make more friends hahaha), and joined academic decathlon. Then as a junior I was still on debate and I became the social media manager of the HOSA club, and joined NHS, but then after the first semester of junior year I switched to the school that I am at now. At my new school I joined NHS again and a club called Glamour Gals (basically a service club), and got NHS Vice President for next year, and also for next year I am running the Peer Counseling podcast on my school that talks about mental health and other issues that students could be facing on campus. I joined basically all of the clubs that I could at all of the schools that I was at so sorry if that was confusing. For my preferences, I definitely like smaller schools and am kind of opposed to bigger universities just because of personal preference, but if it would be the best option for me then I would for sure go to one. I currently live in California, but the region where I go to school and if it is rural or urban does not matter to me, as long as the school is good for me. I definitely do not think that I would be eligible for a lot of financial aid because my dad makes too much money, but I don’t want to spend a ton of money at school because I still have medical school and I also have three siblings (all younger) that need to go to college as well. My dad says that he can pay for whatever college I want to go to even if it is super expensive, but I do not want to waste all of his money especially considering my siblings and the fact that I still have to go to medical school. Sorry that this is really long I wanted to make sure to answer all of the questions hahah.

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Hi! I responded to someone else with all of my stats and extracurriculars and things in another comment, but I can copy and paste it to you if you can’t see them. I am really sorry that I did not post them in the first place, I was not sure that so many people would see this and would actually look at them if I did post them originally. I am making a list for colleges that I am going to apply to, so that is why I was asking about these colleges, I know that it is not likely that most people get into them but I was still planning on applying if there was any chance that I could get in. Sorry if it was a bad question to ask right now.

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Hi! I just responded to someone else with my credentials and things like that, but I can copy and paste it to you if you can’t see it. I don’t think I have an actual specific budget for medical school and college, I just know that my dad makes too much money for me to get any significant amount of financial aid or anything like that. My dad says that he will pay for me to go anywhere that I want to, even if it is expensive, but I just don’t want to spend all of the money on college if it isn’t worth it if I could be going to another school for less money, especially because I have to pay for medical school next and I have three siblings that also need to go to college after me. I am Catholic, but I would be fine going anywhere that was Christian (as long as it is not mormon). I don’t know if you read what I responded to other people but basically I have been to three high schools and the one that I am at now is definitely my favorite (it is a private christian school) because I like having people around me that have my same faith and just think that my environment is more positive that way, so I would just want to go somewhere where I could find people that have similar faith to me, where our religion would be respected, and where I could be involved with faith-based activities on campus too.

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Hi! I am not exactly positive what I want to major in, but I was thinking maybe something like Public health, because it interests me and would be related to the medical field still, and also because I have heard from a lot of people that majoring in something like biology or chemistry would burn you out really fast. I have taken AP Bio and I got an A in both semesters and thought it was really interesting, I just do not want to be burnt out if I major in something like this. If you have any advice on what I should major in though I would definitely take your advice.

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Are you concerned that you will get burned out taking a lot of stem types of courses? Or sciences? Please clarify!

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Note that there are lots of Catholic colleges and universities around to consider, with varying levels of religiousness in campus life. Many public and non-religious colleges and universities have Catholic churches nearby and/or many Catholic students.

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No I have taken two science classes every year in high school because I really like science (so far I have taken biomedical science, biology honors, physical science, anatomy, ap bio, and chemistry honors, and senior year I will take ap environmental science and physics), I have just been told by a lot of people that majoring in biology or chemistry will burn you out fast and I am just afraid of being burnt out. Science has always been my favorite subject and it is actually interesting to me so I have always enjoyed learning about it, but I have heard that people do not make it to med school because they get burnt out, so I am just afraid of that happening to me if I majored in biology or chemistry instead of something like public health, but I am open to anything really as long as it would be beneficial to me. Sorry for not being clear earlier.

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Thanks for all your details. :+1:
You have a great academic record :medal_military:

You can keep exploring majors :slight_smile: If you’re interested in Public Health, you can study data science or policy. But what about Environmental Science? A combination of major+ minor that links sustainability or climate change with health (impact of heat, floods, fires, on health?)

Don’t worry about being unclear, if we aren’t sure about something, we ask :slight_smile:

Since you’re in California, would you be able to visit Pepperdine and LMU-LA?

You could look into Whitman.

St Olaf could be a good option.
I suppose you’ve thought of Holy Cross, Notre Dame?

I am not sure what you mean by getting burnt out if you major in biology and/or chemistry. Plenty of people choose these majors, do very well, and are happy.

You could be any major as a premed…as noted above. It is often mentioned on CC that job opportunities are better if you do not major in biology.

I could probably visit those schools, but I’ve actually thought of Pepperdine before because it is sooooo pretty there and a lot of my friends or friends parents have went there, but I have heard that there is not a lot of support for premed students there, as well as the fact that to get to any hospitals that would let you do shadowing or anything like that you would need to drive about an hour away to get to them because they would be in LA and Pepperdine is in Malibu. That school is so pretty though so I have definitely looked at it before. LMU and Whitman both seem like pretty good options, I might add those to my list. I heard that Holy Cross is really competitive and I would prefer more of a collaborative atmosphere, and Notre Dame seems a little bit too big for me. I’m just not sure if it would be more worth it to go to a school like Amherst or Williams and the places like that that I would be very interested in and excited to go to if it meant spending a ton of money as opposed to going to a school maybe with a higher acceptance rate that I am less excited about but that would give me more money, so I am just conflicted there mainly. I am honestly not even sure if I would get into the schools like Williams and Amherst and Carleton, so I am just conflicted overall which is basically my main problem. Environmental science seems super cool to do as a minor with the way you described it and I never ever thought about that, so thank you! I will definitely consider doing that.

Sorry I’m just going based off of what I’ve heard but basically that it was draining to have those as your majors or something like that, I’m not sure it’s just what I’ve heard. I didn’t know that job opportunities would be better if you do not major in biology, so thank you! I’ll definitely keep that in mind when thinking about what to major in.

It has been reported by others…not by me (I do think they are right).

My D was a bio major with a chemistry minor, and would do it again because she loves it. However…most biology majors do end up back in school.

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If you’re looking at Carleton and St. Olaf, add Macalester to the mix. It has a nominal religious affiliation (Presbyterian), though I think the school feels more like a secular school. However, they do offer merit aid, and the location in the Twin Cities will open up lots of opportunities for internships and applied learning in public health, along with possible shadowing opportunities at local hospitals. You can also cross-register at the University of Minnesota. More information here: Health Professions Advising - Macalester College

And here: Macalester Life as a Pre-Med Student

Just to reiterate my comment above: you are likely to be able to find a faith community of your choice on practically any campus. There are usually interfaith centers that sponsor both interfaith and faith-specific clubs, services, and activities. If a school seems to offer much of what you want and has a vibe that appeals to you but does not have a religious affiliation, do yourself a favor and investigate further. I suspect that the chaplains or interfaith center staffers will be happy to put you in touch with a student to talk about spiritual life on campus (any campus).

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Got it for Notre Dame - but perhaps visit before you cross it out for sure?

There are LOTS of Catholic colleges with good support for premeds, access to volunteering, and dozens of majors. However they tend to be mid-sized (~7,500 students +/-1,000)
Beside the Loyola you know (LMU-LA), there’s a Loyola in Chicago, too -perhaps a bit bigger than what you’d like and a Loyola in Maryland, too (smaller).
St Mary’s CA is small but perhaps not academically strong enough. Same thing for st Kate’s in the Twin Cities.
Could Santa Clara be your goldilocks? Worth visiting.

Medium sized in the Twin Cities, St Thomas.
Villanova and Boston College may be too big.
(Fordham isn’t very good for STEM).
Fairfield and Providence in New England ?
Marquette in Wisconsin ? (A safety, as would University of Scranton – very pretty campus, very supportive.)

Seconding Macalester : it’s small, very personal, collaborative, and in a megalopolis with excellent public transportation for easy access to medical and volunteering opportunities :slight_smile:

You can apply to Williams, Amherst, and/or Carleton : the odds are minuscule you’ll get in since anyone’s odds are very low. This way the decision is kicked to Spring 2025. However before you go through the application process, run the NPC and show the results to your parents.
You can apply priority or EA anywhere and if you find a college you like best, ED.

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I’m sure you know this…but the first two years of medical school are a LOT of sciences…a LOT.

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Oh yes I definitely know, I just don’t want to burn myself out or anything like that before I get there hahaha.

Creighton is Catholic (Jesuit) and has its own medical school. You would get good merit. Omaha is a fun little city.

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For those who may come across this in the future, I would put Baylor in the Notre Dame/Pepperdine level rather than Level 4. Not all classes are infused with evangelical ideas (especially outside of humanities), there are professors from other faith traditions, and the conduct restrictions are less stringent than they were in the past. I know a number of devout evangelical families who are not considering Baylor for their kids because it’s now “too liberal” - they prefer schools like Samford and Wheaton (IL).

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