Christians Sue for Right Not to Tolerate Policies

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<p>Kluge,</p>

<p>Christians believe that unrepentant sinners (those who do what they want and are unwilling to humble themselves before God) are separated from God. The punishment for refusing to yield to God is death, eternal separation from God. It is God’s job to implement the punishment for such persons. </p>

<p>You appear to be angry because Christians do not believe that homosexuals get any special exemption compared to all other sinners. It doesn’t matter what natural sinful tendencies you have (and we ALL have them), whether they are toward materialism, pride, sexual sins, gluttony, procrastination, irresponsibility, etc. If you do not turn your life over to God and allow Jesus Christ to be Lord of your entire life, then you cannot be a Christian. According to Jesus, there is no other path to God (John 14:6).</p>

<p>There is absolutely nothing bigoted about Christianity. ANYONE, including an arrogant, prideful, jerk who has been a multiple murderer and rapist and has previously been a satan worshiper, can become a Christian. So can a person who appears to act substantially better than average, volunteers for many non-profit organizations, works at a steady job, and helps little old ladies across the street. Your income level does not matter, nor does your sexual past, nor does your race. The only requirement is recognition of your own sinful self and 100 percent acceptance of Jesus Christ as your lord. You could only call this “bigoted” using some bizarre re-definition of the word.</p>

<p>Evangelical Christians do not encourage anyone to beat, attack, or harass anyone. If Christians were prejudiced against people who have an orientation toward sin, then that would exclude all of humanity. </p>

<p>You assume that evangelical Christianity causes or at least significantly contributes to physical attacks on gays. I do not subscribe to this opinion. In terms of evangelical Christianity, all sex outside of the husband-wife relationship is sin. It doesn’t matter if the extra-marital sex is heterosexual or homosexual. None of it is OK. If Christianity were the inspiration for the physical attacks, then one would expect many more “hate crime” attacks on heterosexuals, more of whom are having sex outside of a husband-wife marriage than are homosexuals (because of their sheer numbers). Homosexuals are attacked for a large number of reasons. Many people who are NOT religious simply find homosexuality abhorrent. </p>

<p>I have repeatedly suggested that I would have no problem with groups being formed who oppose Christianity, and even those who attempt to belittle Christianity, as long as Christian groups are also allowed to form on campus. Your attempts to label me as a “bigot” are rather silly. Perhaps you should buy a dictionary.</p>

142

<p>Of course it contributes to attacks on gays…anyone that says that a group are lesser, sinners, encourages others</p>

<p>So a question, what is your definition of marriage…legal, moral, God, Church</p>

<p>Did God make the legal marriage laws?</p>

<p>Seriouslly, if a loving couple gets married in THEIR church, with THEIR clergy, in front of THEIR friends, how is the sex extra marital? They are married before God. The legal marriage is a different matter and involves more contract than morals. </p>

<p>Unless you are implying that Your God knows what is in THEIR hearts, and your God trumps their God, I don’t get how you can decide that their sexual behavior with each other is extra marital if they are married TO EACH OTHER, legal contracts aside, we are talking convenants before their God</p>

<p>it is unfortunate that those convenents are not made legal in the eyes of the law, but who is to say their promises to each other in front of God are not real? You? Your Church decides for everyone what is moral?</p>

<p>And what is SEX by the way, give me a definitation, cause, is it sexual intercourse, touching, petting, kissing, because I would bet you that many many many Christians have premarital SEX, depending on your deifinition.</p>

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<p>The stats are difficult to find- I have my suspicion as to why, but I think you would not buy my theory…However from personal experience and anecdotal at best- having lived in San Francisco- and living close to Fire Island and Provincetown. Also there are several gays in my my family and they claim that the same ills that exists in the hetero world also exist in the gay world. You know that is a good project for me- I will do some researach to see if I can locate some stats for you-</p>

<p>Because you don’t see it though does not imply that it doesn’t exist- for e.g. (not related but a reality of life) my company hired 21 interns last year and 12 were from the same college!- no nepostism here huh? Something my firm would never advertise or somehow this info never finds it way into the press.</p>

<p>check this site out:</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.murdoch.edu.au/elaw/issues/v3n4/vickers.html[/url]”>http://www.murdoch.edu.au/elaw/issues/v3n4/vickers.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>Allmusic- enter "domestic violence amongst gay couples " into your search engine and you will see several reports with sources…</p>

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<p>I don’t know what criteria are used to determine that an act is a “hate crime”, but I doubt that many of those who are attacking homosexuals are doing it for religious reasons. There are probably criminals who view them as affluent and weak, as the stereotype goes, just as some people view the elderly as a convenient target. I have also heard of men who were sexually molested by men as children who have taken out their rage against random homosexuals. Is it considered a religious hate crime when people go into a church and harm people?</p>

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<p>logosprincipal,</p>

<p>Well, most of the men who molest little boys are actually married men with children of their own, and identify themselves as heterosexual. Heterosexual men tend to like younger females. A boy has a similar appearence to a young female. Men tend to be more visually oriented in terms of who they like for sexual partners. Men who have had sex with other adult men rarely molest children. :)</p>

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<p>songman’s source:

The data in the study suggests that one’ sexuality is as important in the incidence of domestic abuse as his eye color. You’re not accepting the idea that sexuality might possibly not pertain to matters that have nothing to do with sexuality. Gay people should be treated no better or worse than their heterosexual counterparts, and right now they are not. The study also points out that gay people are frequently treated as second-class citizens by both law enforcement and the court system.</p>

<p>And as for LP’s question, the answer is yes.

As I understand it, a hate crime is a misnomer because they do not constitute a crime in and of themselves. Generally they apply in sentencing procedures, with a rationale that, while those who commit crimes for circumstantial reasons are very bad, those who commit crimes against a group as a symbol are far more arbitrary in their choice, and thus more dangerous to society.</p>

148

<p>cgm - What is this “your God” vs “my God” business? Have you resorted to paganism?</p>

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<p>Sam Lee,</p>

<p>I’m skeptical. Can you back that up with some evidence?</p>

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<p>Just remember (all sarcasm aside, of course:)) you must stone your mom when she comes home from yoga. If both members of a married couple have affairs, the woman is killed while the man is spaired.</p>

<p>Is this the kind of thinking we want governing our world? </p>

<p>On the other hand, so long as the people expressing their anti-gay/feminist/(insert minority group here) ideas in a manner that isn’t threatening, they do have rights to say things they shouldn’t. I wish no one would talk in such a disgusting way about anyone else. However, everyone has the right to expression(barring certain circumstances), not just those who are politically correct and accepting.</p>

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<p>logosprincipal,</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.apa.org/topics/sbehaviorsub1.html#whatcauses[/url]”>http://www.apa.org/topics/sbehaviorsub1.html#whatcauses&lt;/a&gt;

</p>

<p>But since most of the men are heterosexuals, therefore, most of the pedephiles are heterosexuals. Another thing I think you may be mistaken is that just because a man molester a boy doesn’t mean he’s homosexual. A I said before, boys and girls look alike when they are children and pedephiles often prey on boys and girls (doesn’t mean they are bisexuals). Years ago, my younger brother was molestered by someone who now has a wife!</p>

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<p>Leanid, I really admire your ability to twist meaning to suit you. I merely meant that homosexulaity, like heterosexuality, is innate, just as diabetes or learning disabilities are. Just like being blue-eyed or brown-eyed is. </p>

<p>Do you believe in evolution (as you so apparently do, since you say that genitalia “are meant to interact with opposite genitalia”)? If so, is it possible that evolution plays a role in the existence of homosexuality? If you don’t believe in evolution, why did your God design homosexuals into the system? What role are they intend to play?</p>

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<p>Sam Lee,</p>

<p>I’m still skeptical here. Do you have any statistical evidence? I could believe that there would be more incidents of heterosexual abuse of children, especially if you include incidents such as between an 18 year old male and a 15 year old female, but I find the claim that most people who molest boys are males who claim to be heterosexual, and are married with children, difficult to believe.</p>

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<p>many molesters are fathers who molest their daughters…i have no idea of percentages, but that is true</p>

<p><a href=“http://georgiacenterforchildren.org/stats.htm[/url]”>http://georgiacenterforchildren.org/stats.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Molester Characteristics:
One of the myths regarding child molesters is that they “look different” or behave differently from others in some way. Here are some statistics describing child molesters:
97% are male
91% are heterosexual
91% consider themselves to be religious
75% are married or formerly married
73% are Caucasian
65% earn a middle income or above
48% are college educated
The molester is not a stranger. Over 91% of children are molested by someone they know.
Stepfathers are 7 times more likely to abuse than biological fathers; however, abuse by a biological parent tends to be more severe. (A child who is abused by a biological parent is at higher risk of sustaining an injury from the abuse than those abused by a non-biological parent.)
Contrary to popular belief, only about 30-35% of molesters were sexually abused as children. (Hanson & Slater, 1988)</p>

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<p>Hard to believe, but there you go</p>

156

<p>A thought about evolution…</p>

<p>It isn’t complete. </p>

<p>Assume, arguendo, that Darwin is completely correct. There is absolutely nothing in “The Origins of the Species” to indicate that, as of 2006, humans had completely evolved while other life forms are still in the Darwinistic struggle. </p>

<p>Given that humans often die of inheritable disorders, that many women are physically unable to get pregnant, and that humans still encounter a host of genetic problems, it is fair to assume that we have not finished evolving… if you even can finish evolving. </p>

<p>There are infertile men and women; in theory, evolution should have taken care of that in the time before IVF - whatever gene or combination of genes that causes those problems wouldn’t be passed on. We still have “anti-survival” traits… which leads me to believe that you can have other, genetic, anti-reproductive traits - naturally. Like being homosexual. </p>

<p>(For those of y’all who thought that I said that homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, I never did… stand by the fact that same-sex attractions are inborn.)</p>

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<p>CGM,</p>

<p>The information that you posted is interesting, but it doesn’t indicate that the primary molesters of boys are married heterosexual men who have children.</p>

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<p>It says 91% are hetrosexuals and 75% married (or were)</p>

<p>here are some more stats:</p>

<p>Girls are sexually abused three times more often than boys </p>

<p>Pplease show me that stats that is gay men that do the majority of sexual assualts as has been inferred</p>

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<p>CGM,</p>

<p>If I accept these numbers, then 9% of the offenders are homosexuals while they make up less than 5% of the population.</p>

<p>I don’t have definitive statistics on this. I merely said that I had read of situations in which males who were sexually abused as children lashed out violently against random homosexuals.</p>

160

<p>Here is a well-documented article on the subject:</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS02E3[/url]”>http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS02E3&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;