<p>LOL, no apology necessary spectrum! I just figured we’d have plenty of time for all that and <looking around=“” furtively=“”> not to attract the evil eye.</looking></p>
<p>peonies, when your daughter begins complaining next summer about the angst, difficulty and tediousness of coming up with ideas for and writing a collection of application essays, you can vicariously share the pain by going back to page one of this thread and meticulously working your way through it again. (keep a pen and paper next to the computer)</p>
<p>mhc - I think a big part of a successful ED process is managing expectations - and that is why I bring up now the possibility of outcomes other than acceptances. I just want people to be prepared, rather than blindsided. If you look at your ED reach as a long shot - it’ll be a blessing if it happens - but I won’t be shocked if it doesn’t - that’s a healthier approach. And I am sure there are people out there who are feeling like I did 2 years ago - pretty confident of their child’s ED admit - and I just want them to be mentally and emotionally prepared for whatever happens. Sorry if I sounded like the bearer of bad news!</p>
<p>rockvillemom: I am from the area, and left to DC because the Jewish population is too small for me to meet other Jewish kids. So I think you decided right, and good luck in your future plans. Happy HAnnukah!</p>
<p>In our case, the ED is not really a reach, but a match. However, the admit percentage keeps going down each year. Nothing is really a done deal, even in a match school, until the acceptance is in hand!</p>
<p>Mhc:</p>
<p>My S1 looked at Middlebury and (thought he) loved it…it was completely opposite of a “fit” for him, and my H & I told him so. He still wanted to apply and I said, “don’t bother”. You’ll thank me later…it’s a WONDERFUL school for the right kids, but I did not see my S as fitting in there at all…I wish your sister-in-law luck with the next phase of her S’s college career.</p>
<p>I just read RVM’s note from HPU. It brought up a pet peeve of mine:</p>
<p>“The university is committed to religious diversity and tolerance,…”</p>
<p>I much prefer the word “acceptance” to “tolerance”. Perhaps I’m sensitive to this because in my life situation I am often in a position to be “tolerated” and I would rather think that I am “accepted”.</p>
<p>Thanks for giving me a spot to vent this :)</p>
<p>I absolutely agree about there being more options, especially jewish options, for the A student. I have fraternal twin boys who are so different that if you saw them you might not even believe they are related. Those differences extend to academics. S1 is at the top of his class and has so many options. The jewish population is almost a non-issue, but not completely. Two schools that are on his list are Duke and Vanderbilt. Those campuses are very accepting and have decent Jewish populations; however, the surrounding areas have reputations for not being so accepting, and eventually you have to leave campus.</p>
<p>S2 is a perfect B student. 3.5 weighted GPA and his options are limited to begin with and even more limited when you throw in the Jewish factor. We are from California and some of the best schools for “B” students here are Catholic which I am not comfortable with. For example, Loyola Marymont is a great school in a great location and “B” kids thrive there. If you look on there website you might think they have Hillel and you would be safe there- but it is not true. The Hillel has been fraught with turnover because of the restrictions that the campus ministry puts on the Hillel staff and the last time I looked (not recently) they had a Hillel but no staff. So it is very important to look closely and not just rely on the website.</p>
<p>Someone asked if my concerns were specific to Elon and the answer to that is no. I had Elon on my radar. Although I don;t know the family that I mentioned, I know of them and I know that they value education very highly. So when I first heard that there son had been selected for his first choice school, Elon, it immediately went on my radar as a school to consider. Then they showed up in town and suddenly everyone was excited about them. So I only bring them up because of the ending this story had for this one family. I might also add that we have a friend (50 years old) that went to Wake Forest for one year before transferring out because he felt back then that he had horns on his head. I don’t think these issues are institutional- in some cases they are cultural.</p>
<p>Have we shared our feelings with our kids- yes, and they think we are nuts. The level of Jewishness is not important to either of them, which is why the number of jews is even more important to me. I highly doubt that either of them will join Hillel, so it is important to me that there are other jewish people in their classrooms, dorms, etc. You have to understand that they have never felt discrimination, so they don’t really understand that it can happen and how it might feel. We are in a very educated area, and everyone is very accepting of differences; we have enough Jewish friends and are active in our community so they have never felt different, even though the Jewish community in our area is certainly not a majority population.</p>
<p>What schools is S2 applying to? Chapman (his #1, but not mine because it is close to home); University of Denver (my #1 for him); University of Oregon (he has been accepted but it is big so I hope this isn’t where he ends up-decent # of Jews); Colorado State Fort Collins (he has been accepted but would choose oregon over this one so this is probably out); Boulder (pretty big); UCSC (he has a shot at this one- do you know that it is 30% jewish?); UCSB (no chance at this one!); Lewis & Clark (does not meet my criterion but it is such a nice school!); Univeristy of Puget Sound (ditto what I said for L&C!); and SMU (which I can’t even believe that I paid the application fee- fails on all levels for me!!!</p>
<p>A great school that I had heard alot about and was told wasn’t religious at all was Santa Clara. But then I looked on their website and they didn;t appear to have an active Hillel but had a very active Muslim Student Union- wow- that was something I hadn’t really considered. We are close to UCI and there are all sorts of issues between the Jewish students and the Muslim students, and I wouldn’t want my Jewish kids to go there. I wonder if that is something that we should be looking at too???</p>
<p>Mhc: I’m so sorry about your nephew. It does put not getting into your first choice ED into perspective. My niece left college mid-semester her sophomore year. It was very difficult for my sister and her family. My niece suffers form OCD which makes everyday life challenging. She ended up living at home, working part-time and attending college part-time. It took many years, but she graduated this past August. We’re all very proud of her. She’s the ultimate late-bloomer, but she is doing well.</p>
<p>RVM makes a good point about choosing a school for fit rather than prestige. My husband feels that my daughter could have aimed higher, but I know that she will be more comfortable at a match school than a reach.</p>
<p>The nephew who just left Middlebury does have attention/focus problems. I never was told exactly the diagnosis but he has always taken meds and always had extra time for exams and papers. I remember my son once affectionately complaining and lamenting that if he had as much time for SATs and leeway in other areas as his cousin, he’d be do a lot better. There wasn’t much I could say to him then to explain his good fortune and advantage over his cousin who he was and is very close to. Unfortunate as this is, it might retroactively explain and put some of that into context for him. Unfortunately I think it also obscured somethings for his parents.</p>
<p>As it turns out I also have a niece in the same class at Midd. She always breezed through high school but her mom tells me how difficult it is for her. The students who attend and find it easy are a certain breed. The school is definitely not for everyone who can get in just because of high grades or test scores.</p>
<p>I only bring all this up amongst “friends” here because we need to be just as cognizant of fit and our kids abilities when helping them choose colleges.</p>
<p>2flipper2 - thanks for mentioning your “B” twin’s schools - this thread tends to have an east coast/mid-atlantic tilt and it’s good to get some west coast suggestions.</p>
<p>spectrum2 - I have to laugh at High Point. When I rcvd the e-mail response from the rep today - I thought I was getting something written specifically for me and my concerns. Then later on, I looked up Hillel info on their website - it was the exact same info! So - I guess I’m not all that special!</p>
<p>peonies - I’m really glad you are finding this helpful. I learned so much going through the process with S1 - and am learning more with S2 - and everyone else has the same learning curve - so the more we share ideas the better off we all are. Sometimes I actually wish I had a 3rd kid because I think by then I’ll have the hang of it!</p>
<p>chochipcookie: I think I’ve mentioned before that I am in practically the same boat here. DS is waiting for an ED school that he has loved forever. He won’t do other essays unless he has to and I am freaking out.</p>
<p>As to the competition thing, I have a very hard time answering the relentless questions and fielding guarded responses.</p>
<p>college4three - I really hope the ED works out for you and your son. I just get nervous when I read posts like yours because that’s exactly where we were 2 years ago - and when S1 was deferred - he had from Dec. 15th to Dec. 24th to do whatever other applications he was going to do. (We had already made firm plans to go away on 12/25 and the schools all had 1/1 deadlines). So - he was able to submit 4 apps in that period of time - and that was it. A very very long wait until acceptances in late March. He had one EA safety school acceptance in December - and thank goodness I had insisted he do that one - it was quite a battle - so at least he had that - but he was over-qualified for that school and not interested in attending - so it really didn’t help much.</p>
<p>It is fairly likely that S2 will do ED - but I am going to insist that 3-4 other apps be done in the fall - just in case. I would rather “waste” the time and money on those apps that be in panic mode on 12/15. Been there - done that - won’t do it again.</p>
<p>^thanks for the support. I purposely made no plans for the December break, just in case.
DS has one EA acceptance in the bag, with Honors program and scholarship money, so he knows that he has back up. There are two other EA apps in. Two more apps are pretty much ready because one has no supplement (only scholarship essay) and the other’s supplement is done (he submitted the same essay to another school). There are other schools where he’d be a great fit but they are reaches too. He has to have essays that are great. </p>
<p>As for your S2, I suggested all the way back in the beginning of this thread that Sussquehanna is a hidden gem. I am glad that you and S2 liked it. I hope you keep it in the forefront of your search.</p>
<p>college4three - I feel better hearing you have sent a few EA apps out.and already have one acceptance.</p>
<p>Susquehanna has been one of the nicest college surprises we have encountered - like it very much. The only hesitations would be the smallish size (2300 or so) and the small Jewish community. It offers rolling admissions and I believe they start releasing decisions in early December - so its a very viable school on the list. Current plan is to visit again in the fall for one of their full day programs. I would highly recommend it to anyone looking for a smallish school in PA - beautiful campus - good fit for a “B” student - lots of academic support and personal attention. One of the best info session/tour experiences we have had and a level of personal attention that is outstanding. The only off thing I have to note with SU is the lack of responsiveness from the Rabbi. Unlike every other college I have contacted - where responses to questions on Hillel and Jewish life were handled promptly and eagerly - she has completely ignored me. I tried several times to reach her through e-mail and FB and I even mentioned to the admissions person we spoke with and our tour guide that I had yet to hear back from her and that was 3 months ago. Just don’t know what to make of that. Perhaps we will try to meet her when we visit again in the fall.</p>
<p>Although I am not Jewish, my S2 (junior) has several of the same schools on his list that have been discussed on this forum - Elon, Wake, Tulane. I was actually a bit concerned about the lack of diversity at Elon and Wake (religious and otherwise) and am glad to hear that things have changed at these schools. Thank you all for the wonderful information - it has been, and I’m sure will continue to be , very helpful!</p>
<p>Flipper2Flipper-
I read your post about your twins and wanted to share that my S1 is currently a sophomore at Vanderbilt with LOTS of Jewish friends who are very happy and have never (thankfully) had any issues in Nashvhille. Vanderbilt’s Jewish community is wonderful so I hope he decides to apply. Good Luck!</p>
<p>So - this article about the spread of gender neutral housing at George Washington University caught my eye today. For those of you not familiar with the school - it has a great urban downtown DC location - strong Jewish population - great for students who want to intern on Capitol Hill. Might be a little reachy for a “B” student- but doable for a stronger “B+” student - especially with ED or ED II.</p>
<p>"Starting next fall, George Washington University in the District will allow male and female students to live in the same room or suite in nearly all of its residence halls. Dozens of colleges across the country have begun to offer gender-neutral housing, as it is called, but usually the option is available only to upperclassmen or those living in apartment-style halls.</p>
<p>Allied in Pride, a LGBT student organization at GWU that led the effort and has advocated for gender-neutral housing for several years, cheered the Thursday announcement. In a statement, the group said gender-neutral housing “is extremely important to LGBT students, many of whom feel more comfortable living with someone of a different gender. However, this decision is a monumental victory for everyone – LGBT students and their straight counterparts.”</p>
<p>Last academic year, several student organizations endorsed the idea, including the Residence Hall Association and the College Democrats. This spring the student government added its support. The university then convened a committee to study national housing trends and surveyed students, parents and alumni. That committee recommended adding the option.</p>
<p>The program will be “completely voluntary” and will be available in all but three halls, according to a university press release. The university plans to monitor the pilot program over the next three years. And students who opt to have a randomly assigned roommate will continue to be matched with someone of the same sex."</p>
<p>I guess I’m a little old-fashioned - I was a little surprised and taken aback by this. I guess if it is voluntary and those who choose random matches will get same-sex roommates it is ok - how do others view this? One of my first reactions is that you might have boyfriend/girlfriend couples who choose to share a room - and then they break-up midyear - seems like this might cause more requests for room changes. What makes GWU’s program unique is that while a number of other colleges offer one or two gender neutral residence halls, GWU is extending this virtually campus-wide. Does anyone have a student living in gender neutral housing and how has it been?</p>
<p>2flipper2: I really appreciate your western list I can see S2 going that way and I have been wondering about California and even Oregon schools. You mentioned U of O on your list and I was wondering if you gave any considerations to OSU and if you found any positives or negatives about it. I’m interested in exploring SMU, which I know you said failed for you on all levels. Given what you are searching for I can understand why. What I’m wondering is if you uncovered any real problems or if it is just a matter of the Jewish population being too small and the surrounding culture being too Christian. Given its location and yours it would seem that at the time there was something about it that made it attractive enough for your S to go that distance. If you are open to sharing that I’d be interested in hearing that as well. I expect that my S2 will seek out a Jewish community and Hillel wherever he goes to school if there is any community to be sought. We have different criteria than you have but information regarding what you have found would still be helpful.</p>
<p>RVM:I agree with you regarding “gender neutral dorms”. (I find that term amusing.) I can see isolated circumstances where this could be a good thing. I prefer for it to take a a lot of effort to arrange for a mixed gender room. College life is new and complicated enough and dorm rooms are really small. When I went to school it wasn’t unusual for students to live in a mixed gender apartment, and I saw some very unhappy conflict even in that more spacious environment when a breakup occurred. Sharing one small dorm room even in good circumstances could be difficult, complicated and distracting. While I want my kids to have fun in college, I also want them to live in an environment that is conducive to putting their focus on their studies. It seems that this is a situation that for many can lend itself to more distractons and angst than is necessary or good for the overall college experience. I wonder if this has already been road tested at some schools and if it has resulted in an increase in the pregnancy rate. I think that if schools adapt this, limiting it to upper classmen and apartment living is a better way to go.</p>
<p>I saw the GW article in the Washington Post and found its new gender neutral housing availability disgusting. Why? It creates tremendous lack of modesty. I don’t think it is proper for boys and girls to share rooms and goes against my moral view. There is no privacy. Ditto for Muhlenberg and any other campus that offers this kind of housing.</p>
<p>I actually think Hillel on campus should strive to create Jewish and/or kosher dorms available on campus for living/learning communities with single sex rooms. Kosher dorm facilities are available on some campuses, but should be more wide spread.</p>
<p>My sense about the gender-neutral housing is that it accommodates, for example, gay men who would rather have a (possibly single) bedroom in a suite with women than deal with the discomforts of other male students. Or close friendship groups of mixed sex, where no one’s dating anyone else in the group. I lived in a dorm setting in college which consisted of singles off of hallways, and many of the “rooming groups” were mixed-sex groups who chose to group themselves along a single hallway. The bathrooms were co-ed, so when a big group selected a particular hallway, that floor/hall became, in a sense, a giant co-ed suite. I can envision that this is the concept at GWU, where they have a number of large suite options with singles and double bedrooms that surround a central common area.</p>