Colleges for the Jewish "B" student (Part 1)

Parents Forum
901

<p>Thank you for this interesting and honest conversation on SC. I still hope to visit in the spring - and there are still many things I like about C of C - but I also have some questions/reservations that probably won’t be answered until we visit and see for ourselves. </p>

<p>momjr - thanks for adding about the bus from JMU to the metro - I knew I had seen that somewhere but could not find mention of it on the website. Good to know I wasn’t hallucinating!</p>

<p>mdcissp - the funny/wonderful thing about this thread is that although I started it seeking more college suggestions - it has morphed into so much more - more than I ever could have anticipated - and I am enjoying it immensely.</p>

<p>At this point, we have appts scheduled to visit Gettysburg and James Madison at the end of the month - and I will certainly post our impressions after each visit. Planning to see Elon again (saw with S1) in the fall - Muhlenberg and Susquehanna as well. Spring will hopefully be College of Charleston. If S2 likes JMU’s size - we will try to fit in visits to Towson and Delaware. If we happen to get to Florida at some point (MIL lives there) we will make a side trip to Eckerd. York College - if we have time to fit it in. Bucknell - if he really gets his act in gear next year. University of Richmond - same thing. I am not planning to visit these last 2 unless I really see him upping his grades next year - otherwise there is just no point. So, that’s our list for now. I LOVE visiting colleges - so I am quite excited.</p>

<p>Incidentally - I don’t think anyone has mentioned Gettysburg at all. Anyone here have knowledge of that school? For us - I like the size although it maight be a tad small. very close - about an hour away - offers a mgmt major - about 160 Jewish kids out of 2200 - great academics - high grad. rate. I know some will describe it as very Greek and preppy - but that’s how people describe Wake Forest and we like Wake very much - we don’t see that description as a problem for S1 at Wake - so I’m not put off by that. Frankly, if I have to choose between “Greek/preppy” and “hippie/pot-smoking” - I’ll go with the former. Of course, this comment was tongue in cheek - those generalizations can be overblown.</p>

902

<p>D visited Gettysburg and liked it. The program she was interested in (music) turned out not to be a great fit, but she’s been recommending it to other kids around here. There was a lot I liked about it, and they offered her a strong merit aid package.</p>

903

<p>Momjr: Thanks so much for posting about the JMU transportation to the Vienna Metro. When I called JMU, no one mentioned anything about this option and said student needs a car to get back to the DC area. Can you please ask anyone you know who has used this JMU transportation more about it? i.e. do you have a bus schedule, how much is it, etc. Thank you so much-now because of this info. I am going to put JMU back on the possibility list. It was one of my son’s original schools that he wanted (Business school, has great food).</p>

904

<p>Re Greek influence, it is good to ask what % of the kids eligible to be in frats join. For Gettysburg, I thought I saw an exchange somewhere on CC, where the first poster thoguht the % was about 60 and the second poster noted that excluded freshmen, who were ineligible, bringing the % to 80% of upperclassmen. I believe there is a separate Gettysburg thread.</p>

<p>In general, it is regarded as a good school with, as you say a heavy preppy/Greek flavor. For schools of this size, where the CC forums are often quiet, I find the students review and college ******* sites helpful, as well as the Facebook page for the class of 2014.</p>

<p>Try to make your Summer visit after 4th of July weekend, as that is the anniversary of the battle and traffic will be heavy. York is pretty close by.</p>

905

<p>Anyone know anything about the Business school at JMU? Thanks.</p>

906

<p>I now happy campers at Gettysburg but none are business majors. I do know happy business majors at Dickinson, but OP has already said it is not a good fit for her son because of international emphasis. I mention it for others.</p>

<p>OP: Since business is increasingly international, are you sure this is a deal breaker?</p>

907

<p>I did not look at the JMU B school. Because JMU is pretty large, I would pay close attention to class sizes. At schools such as those discussed on this thread, where the prestige factor alone will not generate job offers, even in a good economy, there is a lot to be said for close relationships with faculty. </p>

<p>With all undergrad B schools and B majors, I would check out internships; job placements; and the depth of courses offered–some schools just offer a superficial business major with 1 or 2 courses in each of finance, accounting, marketing, etc.</p>

<p>When I looked at Dickinson’s business offerings, I thought they were very slim and international to the exclusion of more basic offerings, in keeping with Dickinson’s efforts to distinguish itself through its international emphasis, but it is a good school and I could be mistaken.</p>

<p>Many schools on this thread offer Summer institutes, in business and other fields, and they can be a great way to check whether your child really likes a field; or a rural or city school; etc as well as earning some resume points.</p>

908

<p>mythmom - that’s a good question. I would have both Dickinson and Rollins on the list were it not for that issue. S2 hates foreign language. He has taken 3 years of Spanish - and while he has gotten A’s - he just hates it. I think the Spanish teachers at his hs are horrible - S1 took 4 years of hs Spanish and generally hated it as well. S2 is going to try Latin I for the fall semester - and we’ll see how that goes. It was his GC’s recommendation as he had this one empty semester slot and it was pretty much either Latin, or a semester of gym or art and he chose Latin pretty much out of curiosity. Many colleges require a year of language - so chances are he will see Spanish again - but the schools with International Business seem to require a level of proficiency that may be beyond him.</p>

<p>mdcissp - my impression is that business is one of the best/largest programs at JMU. I will find out as much as I can when we visit later this month and report back.</p>

909

<p>yabeyabe - you raise a very interesting point and I want to ask your opinion and others on this question. In December, S2 will be asked to pick courses for senior year of hs. Given that we keep saying he might want to major in business, I think it would be good for him to take perhaps 2 courses that are business related. (The summer program is also a good idea - just don’t know if S2 would agree.) His hs offers things like accounting, business law and marketing. Also offered are AP Statistics and AP Economics. He would also take honors English, calculus, and physics.</p>

<p>People seem to generally say good things about the APs - but I get some negative feedback on the other business classes from the standpoint of the college admissions process - that taking marketing or accounting senior year in hs would not impress admissions. Not sure why this is - perhaps because those are not viewed as college prep classes? But I think it would be a good idea for him to take maybe one of the 2 APs I mentioned plus the business law and marketing, for example, to see if those subjects interest him. What do you all think?</p>

910

<p>Re: JMU transportation. Google Homeride JMU. Homeride offers transportation on weekends and holidays to and from northern Virginia to JMU, UVa and Virginia Tech.</p>

911

<p>rockvillemom-
There were a lot of posts about Gettysburg in this thread. You can click on “search this thread” in the top right of the thread and type in “Gettysburg”. 2 pgs of posts popped up.</p>

<p>Interesting that no one has responded to the question about Emory at Oxford. In all my yrs living down here (am another transplanted northerner) I have heard very few of my friends and probably none of my Jewish friends, talk about it as an option for their kids. I’ve known some grad students who did some practicum work there. It is small, and sort of in the middle of nowhere. Reading their stats, of the students who reported a religious affiliation (and almost half didn’t) only 3% were jewish and only 13% were from the mid atlantic/new england area. [Oxford</a> College - Oxford Facts](<a href=“http://www.oxford.emory.edu/a_distinctive_place/oxford_facts/index.dot?]Oxford”>http://www.oxford.emory.edu/a_distinctive_place/oxford_facts/index.dot?)
The 2 yr feeder school to Emory has only about 800 students. If a student wants to attend Emory but is unlikely to get in directly as a freshman, it is a good option.</p>

912

<p>JMU Homeride</p>

<p>"Home Ride is a bus service designed for college students so our schedule fits your needs. Generally, we leave JMU on Friday afternoons and return on Sunday nights. We also make special runs for Thanksgiving, Christmas and Spring break, to fit the university calendar.</p>

<p>All trips start from and return to the JMU Bookstore. Our buses go into parking lot G and stop between the Bookstore and Godwin Hall. Our stop in Northern Virginia is in the south parking lot of the Vienna Metro Station. In Charlottesville, we stop at the Student Activities Building at UVA; in Richmond, at the James Cabell Library at VCU; in Hampton, near the Outback Steakhouse at Coliseum Mall. "</p>

<p>Prices were pretty reasonable - $38 from JMU to Vienna Metro. Thanks for sharing this info sevmom.</p>

<p>jym626 - thanks - I keep meaning to go back through and re-read some posts and make some notes. The thread is growing faster than I ever expected and I have lost track of some of what has been discussed three weeks ago.</p>

913

<p>Parent of a (very happy) current Gettysburg student here.</p>

<p>The Greek presence at Gettysburg College has been discussed a lot on the Gettysburg threads, and the percentage of students involved is always overstated; it is nowhere near 80%, as someone estimated above. If you go to the Common Data Set for any college, you’ll be able to find the numbers easily. At Gettysburg, the total percentage of all students who are Greek is 38% of men and 26% of women. Freshmen are not eligible to join so the total percentage of UPPER-CLASS students is about 43% Greek (but it’s still only about a third of ALL students, if you average out the 38% and 26% numbers given above.)</p>

<p>Whether that’s high or not or whether Greek life is good/bad is obviously a personal preference. My daughter initially had no intention of joining a sorority (no doubt because of the negative way Greek life is often portrayed.) However, once she got to know some of the girls/guys in the houses, she decided she’d like to join and has enjoyed every minute of it. Each sorority and frat has its own “vibe” and people gravitate to the ones they feel comfortable in. And lots of her friends are not Greek, so it’s not like it’s an isolating factor. There are so many things to do (lots of studying being the primary activity), that the number of hours my daughter spends on activities related to Greek life is very small.</p>

<p>As far as majors, the closest thing to Business is the Management major (which includes courses such as Accounting, Finance, Marketing, Statistics, Business Law, etc.) There is also a Business minor. And yes, there is a one-year foreign language requirement. </p>

<p>I don’t know anything at all about Jewish life there. My daughter has Jewish friends, but I don’t think they’re particularly active. I think they go to the Jewish holiday dinners and that may be about it – but it seems that most of the student body is not overly (outwardly) religious, no matter what the denomination, but that could just be my personal impression. </p>

<p>Overall, a very happy experience for my daughter – academically, socially, personally. Gettysburg is not for everyone; it’s small and rural, but it turned out to be the right fit for my D and she’s already dreading graduating next year. I believe that most kids end up happy with their choices and your son probably will too, no matter where he goes. Good luck!</p>

914

<p>horsfeathers - thanks so much - I enjoyed reading your post. We are looking forward to our visit.</p>

915

<p>Rockville, re the courses, B schools generally require stat and econ, so those are good preparation. It is hard for me to think a college would look down on kids taking Business law, marketing or accounting–those are neither vo-tech courses or guts. I think most kids will find marketing more fun than accounting and more relevant to business life than business law (unless he is also thinking about law school).</p>

<p>I think what your son wants to take is crucial, as, from your description, if unmotivated, his grades may slip.</p>

<p>Horsfeathers, as you say, there have been a lot of threads debating the Greek influence at Gettysburg, with both sides pretty vocal. One mentioned students giving publications much higher %s than the official one, with no reason given. I think the upperclassman % is much more relevant than the all students %. Since freshmen cannot join, it is the upperclass % which more accurately reflects their popularity.
Does your daughter agree with the other common Gettysburg stereotype of a majority of students being more likely to wear J Crew than t shirts and shorts?
In any event, I think Gettysburg’s high graduation rate shows overall student happiness at the school–any small rural school will lose a certain % of kids just for those factors.</p>

916

<p>Many thanks to all who provided the bus info. from JMU to the Vienna Metro. We are going to explore JMU as a result of this valuable info. </p>

<p>Rockville Mom: AP courses: From my experience with our older son who took many AP courses, the most important thing senior year is for your son to take courses of interest to him and to check out the teachers. Do not stress him senior year. Only sign up for classes with the best teachers. Also, I think the most valuable AP courses are AP Calculus and AP Science class if the teachers are great. You should also check the AP course acceptance guidelines at each college because not all APs count for college credit (what a surprise!) depending upon the school. I also highly recommend taking a course at your local community college this summer if your son has nothing to do.</p>

<p>Yayabe: Right on, now which B-school best fits your criteria for small classes, great teachers, has good internships, and some Jewish kids? Which B-schools are too big and better to avoid? Do you think Towson and Salisbury B-schools are o.k?</p>

917

<p>mdcissp, I don’t what class size is at JMU, Towson or Salisbury, or how many business courses Towson and Salisbury offer. I would be surprised if UMCP, Pitt, Temple, Rutgers and PSU have small classes, given their size, although I think they would do well on your other criteria.
There is a form of business school certification–something like AASCB–which is regarded as a sign of a good program. I do not know if schools without separate business schools (Muhlenberg, Gettysburg) are eligible for it, but certainly think those 2 are very good small schools generally, as are Franklin & Marshall and Ursinus.
American might meet your criteria and has a separate school. Susquehanna has the accreditation, but not a lot of Jewish kids. Goucher and Drew have a lot of pluses, but not a deep business program. I think Richmond is strong, but a reach. Binghamton, McDaniel or Ithaca might be an option.
I like what I hear about Clark and Alfred, but did not look at their business offerings.
Fairfield has a good separate business school. but may be overwhelmingly Catholic, as is St Josephs. Manhattanville, not far from NYC, prides itself on its internships, but I was turned off by its lack of on campus weekend activities. Elizabethtown and Lycoming are well-regarded regional schools.</p>

<p>I found it a very difficult search. I did not look outside the northeast.</p>

<p>This economy makes it hard to review internships and job placement, as so many companies have cut back.</p>

<p>My preference for small schools with small classes is based on my belief that most kids on this thread, including my own, will be more likely to be involved in classroom discussion and pay close attention in a a small class taught by a professor, rather than a professor in a large lecture hall or a grad student in a smaller group. When I was at UPenn, it was not a large place–perhaps 4000 undergrads–but the introductory classes had hundreds of kids in them and the professors–while famous–did not interact with the students in class. </p>

<p>I also think that a student at a less prestigious school needs a strong faculty mentor to help them land internships and jobs and that is more easily accomplished in small classes. </p>

<p>There is a site, rate my professors, which can be helpful.</p>

1 Like
918

<p>Rockvillemom - Regarding class selections, I don’t see how selecting some electives that are in the students areas of interest could be considered a weakness. But that is my personal opinion. I was an accounting major in college and when I was in high school, I took every business elective that was offered. I think it’s a great place for kids to try to start figuring out what they do and don’t like. The kids have their core classes, I figure their electives should hold more of an interest for them. My D, who can’t stand math, will not take Calculus senior year. Maybe statistics? Not sure. She may not take Physics either. Guidance counselor says she can drop science for senior year. Or maybe take a science class that she would enjoy. But she will still probably take 3 A/P’s senior year. She has 3 A/P’s for Junior year and had one A/P sophmore year, sprinkled with electives in the fields that she is interested in. To me it is a well balanced schedule. Maybe I am being Naive?? But I think her schedule helps show who she is. It certainly distinguishes her from others. </p>

<p>D1 has finished Spanish 4 this year and she is done! The foreign language department is horrible!</p>

919

<p>mdmom - S1 took 8 APs - he was a strong enough student to do that. S2 - we’ll see. He is taking his first AP - AP Psych next year as a junior. If that goes reasonably well (which means he hangs onto a B), I might suggest he try either AP Econ or AP Stats senior year. I really doubt he would be able to do both. Yabeyabe - I appreciate your input. I think it would be beneficial for him to take marketing and maybe the business law class senior year - to get a taste of what business courses are all about. Picking classes can be a little tricky at our hs as they have to take 7 classes - there are no study halls. So, there’s a lot of balancing in trying to find 7 courses that he wants to take without overwhelming him.</p>

920

<p>Hi Rockville Mom: I suggest that you go to your guidance counselor’s office and request to see the sheet which lists all the AP courses and scores (1-5) from last year’s AP exams.
It will be quite revealing. Some teachers have high numbers of kids getting top scores, other AP courses will get a spread of scores. Since you need anywhere from 3,4 or 5 depending upon the school to get AP credit, might as well sign up for the AP courses where the kids meet with the most success and highest scores to be sure to get college credit.</p>