<p>I’d get your husband involved - you need a united front on something like this. Your daughter also might have a problem with alcohol.</p>
<p>BTW, has she asked either of you as to what you think about the BF?</p>
<p>Ditto to Romangypsyeyes. For more information, you can read books on verbal abuse and the profile of a verbal abuser. They use various ways of controlling their partner and alienating them from their family and friends. When one imagines an abuser, the tendency is to think of them as a bad person with bad motives. This is not the case. They can be narcissists with a great personality, successful and charming. Their dark side is hidden and they deny it. The partner is confused, for it is Jekyll and Hyde- a loving person periodically goes bad. The abuser always blames the partner "if it weren’t for you being or doing XYZ this won’t happen. The partner tries to do better. They don’t succeed because the problem is the abuser, not them. It slowly erodes at their self esteem. The pattern over time is what is harmful. The partner knows something is wrong but does not understand why this happens with such a great person otherwise.
The abuser’s motive is not evil. It’s a deep insecurity that they look outside themselves to fix, often started with a verbally abusive, controlling parent and a meek enabling one that rallies the family to tip toe and placate the abuser. This insecurity is triggered by the slightest hint of criticism or abandonment, like if their partner has an outside interest in anything (even their parents). Isolating the partner gives the abuser a sense of security. They can also escape from their problems with a variety of addictions: alcohol, shopping, whatever. They and their partners can be male or female so it is not just men abusing women. The partner lets go of various aspects of her life and eventually it takes its toll emotionally. It is slow and gradual.
I suspect this man is critical of you, because any relationship your daughter has is a threat to his security. This is another “red flag”. You do not marry a person on their own, you join the family. Yes, a couple can have their privacy, but in most cases, one recognizes that this is their spouse’s parents- and future children’s grandparents. They should at least show them some respect.
I know it is presumptuous to make these assumptions about someone I do not know, but, like Romangypsyeyes, I am familiar with the pattern, and many things you write are saying “Red Flag” to me. It may not be possible to get your daughter to talk about this outright. She may not recognize it as it can be subtle, but she knows how she feels, and you know your daughter. Maybe discussing aspects of the pattern without using words like “alcoholic” or “abuser” may get her to open up to you. Please let her know that nothing she says to you is unacceptable even if what she says is outrageous- don’t judge her or him as it may silence her. You may hear more of the story. Start with asking her how she feels when he criticizes you… and how she feels when she is with him. Look up the term “gaslighting”. She may be detached from her feelings when she is with him, and certainly when she has been drinking. If she wants to leave him, she may need your support to do it.
An abuser may not necessarily try to hurt the partner. What they are doing is acting out of their own deep pain onto the partner. They feel justified in doing this when the partner accidentally triggers their own pain. It’s pain lashing outward. Afterward, they can be genuinely remorseful and apologetic. This can be confusing to the partner who does not recognize this as abuse. Asking about how she feels may reveal the pattern rather than asking about “abuse”, but it is abuse.</p>
<p>OP: You mentioned that everyone noticed how much your D drank, and how you don’t see her often, and that she doesn’t drink around you. Is it possible that they are both drinking often together, and you just have not become aware of it until now? I think if you are going to to talk to her about the drinking you should approach it from a health/economic concern. I disagree with other posters who are quick to assume that there is verbal abuse in the realtionship just because there is excessive drinking. </p>
<p>As far as the things he said about you to her…I don’t understand why your D would mention it to you unless she deliberately wanted to hurt your feelings.</p>
<p>I do not want to seem at all critical, but I am wondering if when you told her that she shouldn’t tell you what he said, that, if done in the future, she will stop letting you in. Although the information was painful to hear, it gives you insight into what is likely a very complex and difficult relationship for your daughter. Information will be important for the future.</p>
<p>I think that his not liking you is only significant in the sense that it is the way he is thinking and behaving. It sounds from other posters, like he wouldn’t like you even if you were Mother Theresa.</p>
<p>Would it be possible for you and your husband to get professional guidance to work through the nuts and bolts of how to keep your relationship with her going and to not alienate her. At the heart, you love her and may not know (as many of us wouldn’t) how to make this actionable without alienating.</p>
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It’s not just the drinking, FinanceGrad. It’s the whole picture that some of us find alarming, perhaps because it looks all too familiar to us. Notice that it’s the posters who have direct or indirect experience with domestic violence and/or verbal abusers who are expressing these concerns.</p>
<p>deb - agree that you don’t want to shut down any communication D may provide no matter how difficult it is to hear - you need as much insight as you can get into what their relationship is like.</p>
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<p>I totally agree. I’ve seen this with other people, although I have no professional expertise.</p>
<p>I would add that his characterization of you as loud and obnoxious seems to me indicative of a mentality that women should be quiet, meek, and subservient. Really, really bad sign for any future marriage.</p>
<p>Sylvan, I understand that some posters are projecting their personal experiences on this situation, which is fine. I was just voicing my opinion to the OP based on the fact that she just posted that she does not believe there is any abuse.</p>
<p>Just a thought: these things that the boyfriend said about you, are they things that you have noticed bother your daughter about you? Is it possible that she is saying this as a way of telling you it actually bothers her and using him as just someone else who agrees with her (something along the lines of a person saying: “Well, Sally thought Mary was bad at her job,” because they don’t want to be the only person saying that Mary is bad at her job)? I do find it kind of weird though that your daughter told you these things - I am also in favor of things like that staying between the couple.</p>
<p>As for the drinking, I wonder more and more if that’s something they have in common (rather than something just he does). I know it’s very easy to blame the significant other for things the kid “picked it up,” but I find that a lot of times it’s something the kid already does/wants to do and just finds a like-minded significant other.</p>
<p>My opinion is that you should talk to her, but ONLY about the drinking, at least at first. The heavy drinking was observed by multiple people and can’t really be denied. It was way too much drinking for the circumstances, and rightly is a cause for concern.</p>
<p>The behavior issues are based more on impressions, and are much more difficult to pin down. They are also more likely (in my opinion) to generate a strongly defensive response from your D.</p>
<p>Bring up the drinking as tactfully as possible–express your concerns about that, and then see what she says.</p>
<p>I agree with Hunt. An abuse accusation, if it’s not happening, is extremely serious and can cause a very serious negative reaction from the daughter’s side (which, in my opinion, would be justifiable, if nothing is going on).</p>
<p>I agree with refraining from accusations and blame, but to be aware of the pattern this fits and the possibility. The title of the post is “Concern about BF”. But focusing, criticizing or blaming the BF may lead to nowhere… and you know what? It’s not about him.
The real concern is the daughter, and the sense that something is not right. At the very least it prompts investigation. “Trust your gut” is the message here for both mother and daughter.
The feeling is that this could not be a healthy relationship and the goal is to help your daughter identify what is and what is not healthy. “Trust your gut”
Drinking and criticism are just symptoms. It could be any addiction- gambling, shopping, workaholism. These can go hand in hand with abuse, or emotional unavailablity, denial and dishonesty. A relationship with someone like this is not healthy. It hurts. Telling someone a relationship is not good for them is not as affective as them feeling it.
There are no perfect people- everyone has flaws, but people can be emotionally healthy or not.
It’s not about blame. Every abuser or addict was once a victim. They are doing the best they can. The concern is if your daughter is involved with one. Connecting with your daughter at the level of her feelings, in a non judgemental, non accusational or critical way, may help her listen to her gut and open up to you. Then she can decide. I agree with the idea of professional help from someone with expertise in this topic. They may be able to advise you on how to approach this.</p>
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<p>What she’s doing is bouncing his comments off of you, as she trusts you. She’s trying to figure out what to think about his statements.</p>
<p>You seem to be telling her that you don’t want to hear this, that they are the unit, not you and your D, and that what her boyfriend says to your D should not go any further. No doubt he would agree! If it were my D however, I would let her know she can come to me always, if she wants to, and tell me anything and everything that is on her mind.</p>
<p>Really thank you to each and every person who has replied. It really gives me a lot to think about.</p>
<p>Texted with D on her lunch break. She was in a great mood and very happy. I thanked her and the bf for meeting us and hoped that it wasn’t too terrible for the boyfriend. She said that they had a great time and the boyfriend was in a great relaxed mood afterwards. Makes me think that maybe he was very nervous meeting us and that he was worried we wouldn’t like him.</p>
<p>I will bring up the drinking on both of their parts when I talk to her in person. It was not the right place to be drinking so much and everyone noticed it. My D drank much less than the boyfriend or my S. I do have to remember what I was like when I was in my early 20’s. I drank more and more often than I do now. </p>
<p>I do feel that there might be some red flags in this relationship but I do not know enough to make a determination now. I will try to find time to have a heart to heart with her sometime in the future. </p>
<p>The problem I’ve been finding that when I see my kids now, grandparents, aunts, uncles and family members want to see them also and it is hard to find any alone time with them. It is something I really miss. But also not sure how to tell the grandparents, (esp, my recently widowed mother) that they needs to postpone their visits. As the only time I see much of them is during holidays. It’s hard to explain everything and my family dynamics here but I will find time to talk to D alone. Hopefully soon.</p>
<p>If you can afford to do so, maybe you can go and visit your D and then have some face time one to one with her and not have the demands of everyone else who wants to see her when she comes home to visit. Just an idea. You might even go out to dinner one night with her and the boyfriend just to have another first hand observation too.</p>
<p>When she comes home, even if all the other relatives are there, perhaps you can ask her to come with you to the store or something–if the others try to horn in, just say you need her to yourself for a while. Sometimes it’s easiest to have a serious talk with someone when you’re on the way somewhere.</p>