Observations being out in a shopping area.
Target busier than Walmart
Nordstrom Rack had a “line” at one point. Must have just opened this weekend. It seemed like people had bags while on line for returns.
Dicks looked busy
Old Navy not open yet. Bed Bath beyond on Curbside.
Marshalls, TJMaxx and similar had decent crowds.
DSW looked empty
Found in target today. (the one store I walked into) Household cleaner with bleach. 20 pack of Surgical type masks. Toilet paper and paper towels.
According to photos I’ve seen, Door County and Lake Geneva, both in Wisconsin, are being visited this weekend by many people, most not wearing masks or physically distancing. Some but certainly not all of the visitors are from out of state.
Interesting result from the UK, about the results from 20K people hospitalized for covid between February and mid-April. The researchers looked at the increased risk of death for various co-morbidities and conditions. It turns out, for hospitalizations, the biggest risk is increasing age. It’s bigger than any health condition like obesity, diabetes, heart conditions, lung conditions, etc.
As compared to the risk of death for a person under 50, someone over 80 had an 11 times bigger chance of death. Someone aged 50-59 had a ~2.6 times bigger chance of death. The worst common health conditions were dementia (1.4 times bigger) and obesity (1.3 times bigger).
Bad news for me. I’m healthy, but I’m in my sixties (5 times bigger chance of death than you youngsters under 50).
If the hospitalization data in the UK looks like the US data, there’s a selection effect. Older people are more likely to be hospitalized for covid than younger people. Worse news for me: if I were infected, I would be more likely than a younger person to be hospitalized for covid, and if I were hospitalized I’d be more likely to die.
Eyeballing the numbers, I didn’t see a huge selection effect for the health conditions. It didn’t look like people were hugely more likely to be hospitalized if they were obese, for example.
The paper includes the following delicate line: "Mortality in our cohort was high in patients admitted to general wards who were not admitted to critical care, which suggests that advanced care planning occurred. " They are adamant that there was no rationing of health care.
I think the chances of catching COVID-19 laying out on the sand, swimming, and playing in the surf in this heat, sun and humidity are approximately zero. Not going to be a problem in my opinion.
Denying service to people wearing masks:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/may/22/us-stores-against-face-masks?CMP=oth_b-aplnews_d-1
If a store is denying service to people wearing masks, that’s a helpful sign to avoid that store, now and in the future. If they don’t care about public health, I don’t want to shop there. What other health rules are they flouting?
Here is another article, published yesterday (May 23), about the Milwaukee Municipal Court judge who survived COVID-19. https://catholicherald.org/catholic-herald/fighting-for-my-family/
I am a believer in freedom. Stores have every right either to require masks or to deny service to those wearing them.
Let the market decide. I trust the collective wisdom of millions of individual economic actors much more than that of a politically appointed small group of “experts” and masterminds.
The stores don’t have the right to refuse service to those wearing masks if masks are required (they are in Denver, not in Colorado).
Do the stores have a good reason to refuse service? A safety issue, like not allowing masks because they are afraid of being robbed? What about women wearing hijabs?
More stupidity and selfishness.
It’s a different argument for sure, but yes in an ideal world a store should have the right to deny service to someone wearing a hijab. There will be other stores that take the opposite approach and society will sort it all out without coercive governmental mandates.
Of course, we do not have an ideal world. The question is whether you trust individuals or politicians to do a better job of directing society. I side with individuals.
On health matters, I side with scientists and the people they advise.
My friend is an infectious disease specialist and he went to China twice in December to study the virus and told my family before Christmas a pandemic was coming. Told my brother and SIL to buy masks and extra food. Whatever China did or didn’t do, people in the field had it on their radar for sure. In January I read about it being airborne. The mask think always seemed crazy to me. The supposedly ‘new’ information about turbulent clouds that contained both large and small particles that can travel super long distances (much further than 6 feet) and stay in the air up the 3 hours wasn’t new but from a 2014 MIT study. The mask thing was always weird to me and I think driven by there not being enough for doctors, who should have priority. It eroded public trust, though. Seeing Americans come up with so many masks designs and produce so many in a short time makes me think if they had enlisted the public’s help to solve the shortage rather than try to make people think masks don’t work we would likely be better off and there would be more current buy in for wearing masks.
Haven’t looked at the links but:
While the young tend to be self-centered, and as such not as concerned about something that’s for old people to worry about, maybe we’ve just burned up all the goodwill and go-along a lot of people are willing to devote to this.
They’ve been yanked one way and then another by the 'scientists, and they’re sick of restrictions that long out-lived their usefulness.
I understand the desire for a return to normalcy. I am staying home and not going to stores as I am immune deficient but even I feel like going out and doing things. I do go walking, thank goodness. But I don’t have anyone local who is as careful as I am so I am not going to make a quaranteam at this time. Sounds nice but not yet. Maybe this summer I’ll hang out with my friend outdoors, both in masks, sitting more than 6 feet apart. I think that will be OK, but we will see when we get there. She for sure does a lot more things that I do in public and that’s my unease.
If I didn’t have immune deficiency, I see how people could get lulled into feeling it’s OK, esp when they see so many being more social and doing more.
I hope that people will be smart. I hope those crowds are the minority. outside is a close together crowd is better than inside but without masks, those close together outside will spread the virus. I hope they will all be OK and not make lots of others sick and/or die in the process.
I do worry what opening too fast will do to our fall. I think it is seeding the illness for a big rebound.
One positive is my doctor thinks a vaccine is likely in even January. That would be wonderful.
Also, I think there are not many places that are not allowing masks. I think they are a tiny fraction of existing places and not a big concern at this time. Hope so, anyway. I get freedom to choose but we require seat belts, don’t let people drink and drive, etc. Once a behavior can literally kill another person, it is something that can get regulated.
And they can explain all this to the grandma they infected, as she fights for her breath in the hospital.
Sorry. NO sympathy.
Went on a nice walk with pups. Saw nothing out of the ordinary today. People mowing their lawns, working in garden. 3 teen girls social distancing on a front lawn/driveway. A family on their bikes and a runner. Cars in driveways, so people home and likely in their backyards, enjoying the beautiful day.
My neighbor’s went up to their camp yesterday in the Adirondack woods near Saranac Lake. They are completely off the grid, except for a generator to run their fridge. That is a very new addition. They were bringing in all the food they need and will be back tomorrow. They mostly went to open it up. I’ll have to ask how crowded the lake was as I’m sure they went out on their boat. Definitely way too cold to swim in yet. There aRe several beaches on the lake which aren’t private.
If any beach is crowded in my neck of the woods it will be Million Dollar Beach on Lake George. Haven’t heard of any reports yet. I certainly hope it’s not crazy there this weekend.
My town announced today our pool complex will be closed this summer as did another suburban town.
My husband and sons just got back from our remote cabin. Thy talked to only one person the entire weekend and saw a handful of canoeists on the lake when they went fishing. If things deteriorate we will head up there for awhile.
@“Cardinal Fang”
I’m in my 60’s too (age 66) – but I don’t look at statistics quite the same way. Instead, I look at it as: older people are more likely than younger people to have a whole range of chronic health problems, beyond the specific conditions that are included in the stats. And statistically, there are issues tied aging, such as weakening of the immune system, that don’t necessarily apply on an individual basis. In short, a person’s chronological age does not necessarily match their biological age.
So yes, you and I are statistically at higher risk-- but individually our risk factors might be quite different. It’s just that we are in an age range where overall mortality is higher – but just like with any other statistical grouping (example: statistics show that men are taller and stronger than women) – there are individuals at all ends of the spectrum.