Coronavirus May 2020 - Observations, information, discussion

[milee30]

My county is known for not being business friendly or flexible. While cities everywhere are trying hard to allow businesses flexibility to survive and making places safer by closing roads, expanding walkways and allowing restaurants to move seating outdoors… ours is doing the opposite. They sent code enforcement officers out this weekend to fine restaurants who moved seating outdoors. One pizza place near me had moved its seating outside to two of the parking spaces in front. The seating wasn’t blocking any walkways or roads, just taking up two parking spaces… yet they have been hit with a fine for unpermited seating.

Frustrating.

I have long known about the code craziness but had hoped during the pandemic the county might use a little common sense to think that maybe offering a restaurant the chance to survive, a few people some jobs, and an outdoor eating area which might prevent the spread of C19 might be worth sacrificing two parking spaces but nope.

[emilybee]

@mathmom

That’s interesting ours came with a page of instructions that told you to check off “temporary illness”.

If I lived in a state with the normal strict rules, I would just claim a temporary illness - even if my illness happens to be hypochondria.

I don’t know why each county is doing it differently. It makes no sense to me from a practical point of view. At least yours came with instructions. Mine came with a letter with info on date it needed to be mailed in by and that app only good for this election, not Nov. election. No need for instructions on what to check off since that was done for us.

[compmom]

In addition to the factors listed above: income level, ability to sustain loss of job or income, ability to social distance including remote work, and safety measures on the job, I think big factors would be use of public transportation, crowded households with only one bathroom, and high contact jobs (with or without safety measures).

These three are related to income level and the need to continue to work, so all these factors are connected. Even retired folks in smaller spaces, if not living alone due to economic situation, are at high risk. If they take public transportation, all the more.

Let’s hope that safety measures will continue to improve for health care workers, nursing homes, grocery, pharmacy, meat processing, delivery, bus drivers, and other high risk jobs.

Use of public transportation and crowded households are difficult to address. Frequent sanitation, increased buses and trains to create social distance, and masking may help with transportation. Some areas have dorms for those exposed, who cannot distance at home, but I have read that they are not really being used.

Testing, contact tracing, and use of dorms may help lower income folks. But they would have to be paid while self-isolating at home or in a dorm. And they would have to use the dorms.

(Until recently I would be in the category of needing a dorm if exposed, but am living alone again. And one of my kids is dependent on public transportation. So the use of the pronoun “they” doesn’t convey that these factors apply to many of us. It isn’t all even about income, but lifestyle and cultural factors as well.)

[emilybee]

I have no words.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/25/health/coronavirus-testing-trump.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

[roycroftmom]

NY stock exchange reopened for traders who could certify they had not used public transportation, and wore masks after temperature check.

[sdl0625]

New trend for those who do have the means. Two people i know in the midst of this are buying 2nd homes near the beach. One bought a house at the New Jersey shore. Another is looking at the Alabama beaches. I guess in these areas for a short time it became a buyers market.

[compmom]

@roycroftmom isn’t that discriminatory? I suppose it’s not as much of an issue for those who work on Wall Street.

[MaineLonghorn]

Interesting article about all the people moving or thinking about moving out of New York City.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/frustrated-and-struggling-new-yorkers-contemplate-abandoning-the-city-they-love/2020/05/25/153ca71e-9c5b-11ea-a2b3-5c3f2d1586df_story.html?fbclid=IwAR3JJmJwy5L-uD3fxexJYpHuLI6G-UctW2wRjxvaVoWI0qp5vfJpKqdD0g0&utm_campaign=wp_main&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook

[Creekland]

@Leigh22

I believe this holiday weekend was a turning point for many. My area was filled with parties - homes with a dozen cars parked on the street. The news showed mobbed boardwalks and beaches across the country. If there is going to be a big increase in cases due to behavior when would we likely see it?
Two weeks out?

If someone picked it up this weekend and is going to show symptoms, they’ll see them in 3-12 days (generally). Then they will have to decide to get tested. Then they will have to get test results back. Those two amounts of time will be variable, but figure you can add another week or two. Add an additional week for hospitalization because that often comes in a “second wave” of sickness - same person, but rather than continuing to improve, they start to decline. Deaths will come another week or several more afterward.

It’s not a quick virus most of the time.

Plus, an unknown number picking it up this weekend will be asymptomatic and not even know they have it. They’re lucky as far as the virus is concerned, but they’ll still be out there transmitting it to those they come across because they aren’t exactly social distancing or isolating and they think they’re healthy.

There’s a reason we’re staying totally in and isolated with all provisions already purchased for two weeks prior to going to see FIL for his 92nd birthday. Who knows if we’ve come across asymptomatic people in our shopping trips or might be asymptomatic ourselves?

In general, I figure the next couple of months might be the most dangerous for this virus because so many want to go out whether due to making a statement or just being lulled into thinking all is well because everyone else is doing it. I’m waiting that out and will see what it’s like on the other end of the couple of months. If I’m wrong, no harm to me. If I’m right - far safer.

[homerdog]

My friends who sell real estate in the Chicago suburbs are super busy. Families moving from the city out to the suburbs. Many admit that they would have made the move eventually but the pandemic has sped up their decision to get a move on now.

[greenwitch]

I imagine many people will be moving back to the city once there’s a reliable vaccine. Nature abhors a vacuum, and real estate loves to fill one!

[roycroftmom]

I don’t think the city they return to will look the same for a decade. Theatre, restaurants, clubs-many did not survive the pandemic.

[oldfort]

I am wondering if people will want to move back into the city because if a lot more people could work from home then what’s the upside for living in the city? I think it may be different for a city like NY once Broadway, restaurants, museums, bars return, but who knows. I still prefer city living, at the same time there are a lot of people who prefer open spaces.

[MaineLonghorn]

Every time we visit DH’s nephew and his wife in Manhattan, I think, “Wow, it’s fun but what a lot of work!” So much walking. And then our nephew’s wife got COVID! I don’t think they will move, though. They don’t have any kids and make a really good income. The pandemic doesn’t seem to have affected them financially.

[ucbalumnus]

@MaineLonghorn

Every time we visit DH’s nephew and his wife in Manhattan, I think, “Wow, it’s fun but what a lot of work!” So much walking.

However, the increased daily walking probably increases their physical fitness to the point that the daily walking does not feel like a lot of work to them.

Of course, living in a denser area does increase the risk of novel transmissible diseases like COVID-19.

[greenwitch]

More on restaurants re-opening very cautiously:

https://www.nola.com/news/coronavirus/article_10e860da-9bc1-11ea-92fc-9b6ffe3035bd.html

“A lot of our people still wanted to talk it out, see how it goes,” Gulotta said. “We didn’t want to have to juggle managing tables and social distancing in our dining room on top of everything else it takes to reopen.”…

Money is tight, and the remaining staff is small. From 46 employees pre-pandemic Gris Gris now has six. That’s why Cook is sticking with takeout through Phase 1 of reopening.

“We decided our main goal was to pay the bills on the building, so when things do come back we have somewhere to work,” Cook said. “The choice is either fight or file for bankruptcy, and I’m a fighter.”

[mathmom]

I really like walking - it’s one of the things I like best about the City, but it is funny when you can walk faster than the traffic.

[Southmom]

I love NYC BECAUSE of all the walking!

[OneMoreToGo2021]

In the saga of the virus and the lockdown, the wisdom of the crowds, that is the wisdom of each of us, was thwarted by bad data, perhaps intentionally bad. On the other hand, the ersatz wisdom of the collective bureaucracy in federal, state and local health agencies was based on crafted data. In the end data didn’t matter, as the bureaucracies were more concerned with their natural territorial imperative, which is to rule and control.

The most frightening aspect of the coronavirus-19 (COVID-19) epidemic in the US is that it brought about exaggeratedly heightened fear of death. That fear, once magnified to proportions which become palpable to the individual, became the basis for dreadful economic and medical policies from governments and crushed the natural optimism of the public.

[snip]

In the bizarro world of COVID-19 reporting that is the case – 1.7% is greater than 98.3%. Specifically, deaths among a narrow 1.7% group of the population are greater than deaths from the other 98.3%. Numerically a death may be a death, but from a policy point of view, to be blunt about it, not all deaths are the same.

Fact #1: 1.7% of the population in the US resides in long-term medical care facilities (LTMCFs) and total 5.7 million.

Fact #2: The residents of LTMCFs accounted for 38,800 or 53% of all COVID-19 deaths (based on recent data). The rest of the country, the 98.3%, have experienced approximately 34,600 deaths, or 47% of the nation’s total COVID-19 deaths.

That means the death rate, deaths expressed as a percent of those living in medical care institutions, is 0.682%, more than 50 times the death rate of the rest of the population at 0.012%. The death rate for the overall populations is 0.022%.

https://www.aier.org/article/focus-on-the-covid-19-death-rate/

[momzilla2D]

@Creekland

Plus, an unknown number picking it up this weekend will be asymptomatic and not even know they have it. They’re lucky as far as the virus is concerned, but they’ll still be out there transmitting it to those they come across because they aren’t exactly social distancing or isolating and they think they’re healthy.

It might be interesting to test all those people that packed into that Lake of the Ozarks pool party, to see what % contracted the virus there. OTOH, if it turned out to be few or none, that would just encourage more bad behavior.