Good memory, and thank you.
The outbreak was where H works, and that is how he & I got sick.
So far, the 2 restaurants I work for have not had an outbreak (no masks in BOH).
There have been plenty of reminders, but it seems that at least some posters these days think the rules (reminders) don’t apply to them.
Didn’t you mean bubble wrap yourself on your deck? ???
Absolutely true that we are dealing with a lot of firsts. A lot of unknowns. However, we are dealing with infectious disease and we DO KNOW that this particular infectious disease spreads like wild fire.
Like any other infectious disease, what do you do at the personal level? You limit exposure. If it requires masks, social distancing, work from home (if you are fortunate enough to be able to do so), you do it.
This fast spreading infectious disease doesn’t care where you live, how you vote, if you’re bored and feel like you deserve some time at a bar with friends, etc. It thrives on access to humans.
We can argue all day long who should have done what. The reality is, unless everyone is willing to stay at home full time (and no, that’s not possible), the virus will spread. That’s what infectious disease does.
Big focus now should be the funding and manufacturing of all the necessary pieces of vaccine supply chain (vials, syringes, etc.) and a distribution plan to make them immediately available on a massive scaled basis the second a vaccine is ready to go. We don’t know the date, but we do know what needs to be done. Any consulting firm could walk the feds through the steps. The federal government, PARTNERING (hey there’s an idea) with states and local governments should be feverishly (pun intended) working on the plan to deliver vaccine to the american people as if it was ready now.
I assume that’s happening. I wish we were getting updates on that as it would provide national confidence and motivate people to do what’s necessary today. But that would take…LEADERSHIP and Crisis Management. Some things belong outside of politics. Can’t think of a better example than Covid 19!
The virus “still has the upper hand,” former CDC director says
From CNN’s Wes Bruer
Former US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Director Dr. Tom Frieden said on Fox News that although the US is doing more testing and hospitals are better prepared, “this virus still has the upper hand.”
The increase in cases in Southern states is the result of reopening too fast and it “is going to continue to get worse for weeks,” Frieden said.
Frieden said the deaths will lag cases of infections by about a month. And while the increase in cases appears to be in younger populations, Frieden said “what starts in young adults doesn’t stay in young adults.”
Frieden estimated that in the next month, the US will see at least 15,000 more deaths from Covid-19. He also said cases will rise.
“As a doctor, a scientist, an epidemiologist, I can tell you with 100% certainty that in most states where you’re seeing an increase, it is a real increase. It is not more tests, it is more spread of the virus," Frieden said. "And the one number to look at that’s very important is the percent of tests that’s positive. The number of cases, that can vary some because we are only diagnosing 10, 20% of all cases. So the numbers you’re seeing are just a reflection, a tip of the iceberg of even more spread.”
Leading GOP senator says it would “help” if Trump wore a mask
From CNN’s Rebecca Grandahl and Ali Main
Senior Republican Sen. Lamar Alexander, who chairs the committee on health, education, labor and pensions, told CNN it would “help” if President Trump wore a mask because it would eliminate political stigma around doing so.
“If wearing masks is important and all the health experts tell us that it is in containing the disease in 2020, it would help if from time to time the President would wear one to help us get rid of this political debate that says if you’re for Trump, you don’t wear a mask, if you’re against Trump, you do,” the Tennessee Republican told CNN.
When asked whether the American people should look to the President for public health advice given his past remarks, including his comment about slowing down testing, the senator said the public should listen to medical experts.
“My suggestion to the President all along and for the other political leaders is let the experts do the talking about medicine. People trust them,” Alexander said.
I love this thread. This thread is the something that helps me with COVID. (Topic of June thread) Compared to many other places I could go to discuss/learn it is actually quite civilized. Would I enjoy it more with less snark and rudeness? Yes. But I think a little bit of that keeps it real. I know that out there are people at the extremes, much farther out there than those on this thread. So a too civilized discussion keeps us a bit naive about what people are saying and thinking. I like knowing that if someone on here says something unsubstantiated people will call them on it. And they will defend. Some opinions are based on facts and some on feelings or even misinformation. All those opinions are interesting and useful to me.I feel better able to discuss with friends and family when I’ve seen a lot of information and a lot of discussion/opinions and can see how things are different around the country. Thanks to all and to the moderators for putting up with us so far.
This is why it will never work. It’s not about the Coronavirus. It’s not about the science. It’s hyper focused on the politics and optics with the virus as blanket immunity.
And to those who say if you don’t like it leave. This is the topic of our lifetime and not just important to you. Actually the more people the better for the country and our families.
Who are you all to say something this communally important should be controlled by your voice and not welcoming to all?
That it should be filled with invective and animosity only certain topics seem to bring out in people?
Don’t tell people to like it or leave it.
There’s a school thread. There’s a medical thread. Create a science thread. This one needs to survive as well. However with heavier moderation not less.
And hyperbole like “we are descending into chaos” a few posts back. How’s that helpful or remotely accurate.
Is the chaos after grocery shopping, outdoor patio eating, going for a walk or talking to your friends and families today. Chaos?
But let’s see where this all leads us. It’s interesting to see the breakdown in civil discourse and mutual respect.
I don’t know about “chaos” but she makes a legitimate point about the testing difficulties. Lines of cars so long it’s stressful to me just looking at the photos. I can’t imagine being in those cars feeling sick and terrified for hours upon hours trying to do the right thing by getting tested. This is unacceptable.
It’s the lead that buries the story.
I live in Ontario. Our numbers have been dropping. Most of the province was allowed to move to stage 2 a few weeks ago with the exception of 3 regions (Toronto, Peel (next door to Toronto) and Windsor (across the border from Detroit)) where the metrics (including hospital capacity) were still too high. Well people from those areas simply started going to neighbouring regions that were more open so it was decided last week that the 2 areas in the GTA could move to level 2 and then Windsor was allowed as well even though we still aren’t hitting the metrics for opening.
At the provincial level we are still reporting between 100-200 new cases per day, but very few deaths and new hospitalizations are low. New recoveries are running neck in neck with new cases for the most part so our number of active cases aren’t dropping much which is frustrating. They are processing around 20,000 tests per day. It took a long time for them to get the testing capacity up but now it’s been at a consistent level. Our percentage of positivity is hovering around 1%. The bureaucracy of our health care system in Ontario is incredibly convoluted which made getting a coordinated response in the beginning very difficult and LTCs took a severe hit. They had to bring in help from the military to several care centres to supplement the staffing it was so bad. The only silver lining in all of this is that it has shined a light on the cracks in the system and I will give my province’s government credit that they have risen to the challenge in addressing the shortcomings. It took a while but things are much less chaotic now. The initial federal response was also very slow and disorganized, but the provinces seem to be doing much better now without having to rely on the feds.
I live in Peel (next door to Toronto) which consists of 3 municipalities with a total population of around 1.4 million. My city specifically has about 722,000 people so is the biggest city in the region. Our regional numbers are still on the high side. Today we are reporting 59 new cases, an increase of .98% for the region. Typically the numbers are higher in the city to the north but today we are reporting 33 new cases for my city specifically which is an increase of 1.25%. Early on our nursing homes were hit hard and were a big driver of our numbers but now almost 50% of the reported cases are in the 20-29 year old age group. I don’t know what’s driving that but it’s a bit frustrating.
Face masks are not mandatory here. Individual retailers have set their own criteria and they aren’t universally required. I’m not out and about much other than to do groceries and the store I shop at has strict protocols including the requirement for masks, so I don’t really know how wide spread their usage is but I have run a few quick errands at some other stores (drug store/pharmacy etc.) and there are still people not wearing masks inside. Now with the move to Level 2 more stores and services are being allowed including shopping malls, hair salons, esthetics, and outdoor patios. I am hoping we don’t see a surge of cases.
DS19’s university has already announced that the fall semester will be mostly online (as have the majority of the big schools). He has a room in an off campus house leased but has not decided if he will move in in the fall or not yet. I suspect he won’t and to be honest I would rather he stayed home but it’s his choice. We still have not received any direction as to what will be happening with K-12 schools in the fall. DS21 really needs to be back in school in person at least part-time so I hope we don’t see a large increase in cases now that we’ve opened up more so that can happen. He hasn’t had any contact with his friends since mid-March when the schools were shut down and he’s very socially isolated. Dh was initially still going into the office every day but recently transitioned to WFH 2-3 days a week. That will last until September when his employer expects to start restaffing more in office. DS19 has been WFH in his bedroom since April. The school year for DS21 just finished this past week. None of us are out and about much. I do groceries for us and my parents 1-2x per week, the boy’s go for occasional walks by themselves (they haven’t seen any of their friends in person since March and DS19 and his girlfriend just broke up), dh has been riding his bike 3x a week outside, and I sometimes go for a bike ride too, but not often. Mostly I’m just home. Dh was very happy to finally be able to get a haircut yesterday. They only took appointments and had 3 customers in at a time. Everyone was masked and socially distanced. The boys’ need haircuts and have dentists appointments scheduled soon, but I’m still not comfortable with either so will cancel the dentist. Since they aren’t out and about the haircuts can wait for now too. I don’t know when I will feel comfortable returning to the salon either and can live with the small amount of grey.
This morning on the news, a doctor from Houston used similar words - chaos and out of control. The long line for testing was also shown. I recall seeing a similarly long line of people in Queens, NY back in April waiting to get tested.
A nurse from Houston who had volunteered in NYC in the spring said the situation was identical to New York. In her words ‘We are New York.’ Watching the daily reports of what was going on in hospitals in Queens and elsewhere around NYC was heart wrenching (for patients, families, and HCWs), and yes, chaotic. Although there have been hyperbolic moments on this thread, I think the use of the word chaos is accurate.
Silly. I am in Houston, and I promise there is no chaos where I am. I called my ER doctor friend, and he promises there is no chaos at any Houston area hospital. Some hospitals are beginning to implement their surge plans. That seems like a good idea. Also, elective surgeries are now being postponed. Also a good idea. We also have surge facilities built 3 months ago which are still empty. Sound bites from tv or twitter do not often reflect reality.
Texas Medical center has a very good website with their daily data. As of today, they are able to handle all ICU cases, and have no concerns regarding PPE or testing availability. Their concerns are on the growth rate
Only citizens in the most authoritarian countries aren’t allowed to describe their countries in a negative way. Fortunately we aren’t one of these countries.
It does remind me, though, of that CNN headline a few months ago stating that almost everyone on ventilators would die. My doctor friends just shook their heads at that one. The patients they were incubating weren’t dying.
When I was complaining to my teen I wished the media would stop using the term lock down to describe Ohio’s stay home order he said that I was staying home. He, on the other hand, was locked down since we weren’t giving him permission to leave home. He appreciated the media using the lock down term because he related to it more.
Recently, he reminded us he is a teenager navigating his first pandemic. “How old were you during your first pandemic?” he asked. He is good at pointing out how we will be on different paths.
Maryland’s numbers.
Positivity rate ticked up slightly 0.03% to 4.89%. Not as many tests as usual ran yesterday.
Total hospitalizations down 32 to 446. ICU usage down to just 158.
As for thread moderation. I’m glad it’s reduced but it’s certainly still necessary.
“A nurse from Houston who had volunteered in NYC in the spring said the situation was identical to New York. In her words ‘We are New York.’ Watching the daily reports of what was going on in hospitals in Queens and elsewhere around NYC was heart wrenching (for patients, families, and HCWs), and yes, chaotic.”
^^ This makes me so terribly sad.
First off. Anyone can say what they would like. It’s a free country and site.
If we say Houston testing centers are descending into chaos.
That’s accurate.
What was stated pointed to a much larger state of being. And the uneasiness and fear that can lead to is real.
My contention is there are many posters who seem to market a perspective that caters to fear and excess worry. And it’s calculated. And it’s an election year.
So if others who feel we should stick to the scientific and personal impacts versus political “blame-menship” need to be allowed the same courtesy and not have the embedded cool kid hive swarm in defense. It creates a circular environment.
They are also bullies here. I don’t even always disagree with the point but the bullying here is out of control at times. And it comes in groups. I will personally push back on this and be subjected to the same. I don’t care. You don’t scare me.
It’s also why this thread is likely headed for the dust bin of cc history.
If posters can’t accept a simple and factual distinction between hyperbole with a design versus a occasional conversational type overstated position (which I do), I’m just at a loss.
I believe it would have - the issue with lockdowns, distancing, masks - is that you don’t know where the next flare-up is coming from, so you have to use a kind of carpet-bombing approach and protect everywhere. We don’t know who patient zero was in AZ to start off this new explosion of cases. But we do know that if we’d prevented a much higher number of interpersonal interactions further ago, it could have been prevented.