D in road rage incident

Parent Cafe
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<p>All I know is Judge Judy would be able to get to the bottom of the ‘he said/she said’…of course she’d make some remark about how you know when a teenager is lying…their lips are moving…she’d yell at the other driver…she’d yell at the OP’s D…she’d yell at the OP for not having her D take responsibility for what her part in all of this was…and there would be no judgment for either party…both were at fault…both endangered the other…and both endangered others on the road they shared…there would be a commercial break and then…</p>

<p>Next case.</p>

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<p>I think it’s important to report this to your insurance company and to the police. It may be “he said, she said” this time, but I think you can be quite certain there will be a next time–and then there will be a history.</p>

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<p>AdvMom, this is a bummer for all concerned. Certainly the most egregious fault was with the guy who tried to send your D into the median and hit her vehicle.</p>

<p>Fortunately, we hope, nobody was seriously harmed. But do have your D and her boyfriend checked out.</p>

<p>I do share others’ reactions that this need not/should not have escalated. IMO *anyone *“giving the finger” is not playing nice. Avoid, ignore, etc., but do not respond in kind, as we advise kids in elementary school. </p>

<p>I am also curious abut what the boyfriend was doing during all of this, and do wonder if you have been given the full story re any involvement he had. He was, I presume, in the passenger seat while your D was driving. If the other driver approached on the right it would have been the boyfriend, not your D, who was more likely to be the main interactor. Is it at all possible that your D is covering for the boyfriend to protect him from your disapproval? Just wondering about that as I am skeptical that he was purely a passive spectator.</p>

<p>I would support a repeat visit to the police department on this.</p>

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<p>@ post 15, I have heard that saying sorry is equivalent to admitting fault, and was advised by my parents to never say sorry after an accident, but instead something like “It’s a shame” or similar.</p>

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<p>Your statement is completely wrong. Car insurance varies by state and that variance can be dramatic. Until you know the state, your comment is meaningless. In any event, if a judgment is entered against the guy, the insurance company liable will have to pay it. </p>

<p>As to “he said/she said”, courts deal with those issues on a daily basis. It’s called credibility. In a court, the daughter would testify, the boyfriend would testify, the guy, and the cop would testify. It the judge or jury believes the daughter and boyfriend, they win. Her argument is helped by pointing out that the guy told the cop she had a gun but no one found a gun on her.</p>

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<p>If it’s my daughter I would take care of the car and report it to the insurance as is to make sure you are out of pocket as little as possible. </p>

<p>You are mad at this guy for what he did to your daughter, you are looking for pay back. I say forget about it. You daughter is alive, he is no longer your problem. If the police doesn’t care, what does it matter to you. Next time, it may not be your daughter, it maybe someone with a real gun. You don’t know what this guy is like, could he be living close by? There are a lot of crazies out there. Just be happy she is alive and forget about it. I had a police threaten me once. I was all indignant about it wasn’t right, I should report him, but he knew where I lived, I wasn’t going to take a chance with my family’s well being.</p>

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<p>I am sorry and upset to hear about this incident. A similar thing happened to my oldest some years ago. Like your D, he responded to an unbalanced, road raged driver’s nastiness, and the guy went over the top. In our case, we hired an attorney to pursue the case.</p>

<p>I would do the same. Find out if the police has an accident report on what happened and why they do not, if there is not one. You need an attorney unless you know the laws well pertaining to these things. Whether his insurance will pay for the damage and any therapy, physical or otherwise for your daughter determines whether your attorney will go after him or his insurance company for payment.</p>

<p>State laws vary on how things are done. I was in an accident last month that was 100% the fault of the other driver. Not a thing I could have done to prevent his plowing into me. He was an elderly man who should not have been driving at all, and his license was taken from him after the police talked to him. However, the way our state laws work, any injuries that I would have gotten from the accident would be on my insurance tab, not his, though his insurance paid for all of the damages done, rental car and the tow. Just the way it works. If you are in a no fault state, it is possible that your own insurance gets charged for the accident and your premiums and policy would be affected. That’s why you should consult with an attorney who is an expert on car laws and insurance to determine what is the best way to go.</p>

<p>I also agree with those posters who say that your D needs to be advised on how to handle such situations better. I really jumped on my son for his reaction to the other driver, though that other guy was waaaay out of line, and dangerously crazy. The problem is that he, your D, we cannot control the actions of others, but we can control our own actions and reactions. Though we may have every right to do certain things, it is much wiser to refrain if such actions could result in harmful consequences to us. Though I fully agree that anyone has a right to jog in the park at night, wear skimpy clothing, say certain things, it is wise that such a person knows the possible consequences of doing them, as there exists a chance that it may not be worth doing. </p>

<p>When I was younger, my temper flared easier, and I did find myself in a number of situation where I was right, but better off if I had not pushed on them. It just was not worth the time, trouble, expense and risk. Now, I pick my battles more selectively and try to advise others, particularly my kids about weighing the risks and possible consequences. I don’t want them to back off of everything for fear of conflict, but I want them to choose what is a worthwhile situation to fight. It is a difficult lesson to teach as emotions run rampant when some jerk hurts you. As a parent, my blood boils when I hear of idiots picking on kids and intimidating them.</p>

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<p>AdvMom, you’ve gotten some pretty good advice here, and I can understand your frustration.</p>

<p>Yet the bottom line is that there are “crazies” out there, and they may not have a easily identifiable tag or label. Please do a google search on road rage incidents. It’s scary, to say the least. An automobile under power in and of itself is a deadly weapon. For the idiot who did what he did to your d is inexcusable, and is quite probably a sociopath.</p>

<p>But how does one distinguish a sociopath from a careless or distracted driver at 60 (or 20) miles an hour ?</p>

<p>Yep, flipping an idiot the bird from the perceived safety and confines of one’s own vehicle is an instant release, and you feel good doing it. It releases some tension. 99 times out of 100, no harm, no foul, both drivers realize their respective errors, and go on their way.<br>
Done it myself, and have to often fight the urge not to do it. </p>

<p>In an insulated, semi anonymous scenario of the confines of one’s vehicle people tend to feel relatively safe from “retribution”. But would your d have flipped the bird to someone who cut a line at a concert or the grocery store. Most would tend to deal with it with a comment, a remark, a facial gesture, a shrug, rather than releasing the bird. Again, it’s an illustration and potential food for thought.</p>

<p>But why take the chance on meeting that one nut that will run you into the median, or pull out a gun, or drag you out of the car with and try and beat you to a pulp with a tire iron?</p>

<p>Honestly, why take the chance?</p>

<p>Personally, if I witnessed the incident, I would have made every effort to stop and come forward as a witness. I agree totally that this man is at best a dangerous driver, and should be responsible for his actions and behavior.</p>

<p>I didn’t care for the police attitude, I would have felt your d’s boyfriend could have been a witness, albeit potentially biased but I don’t know the standard for the rules of evidence. The fact that the bf did wipe the offending paint from the other vehicle that was left on your mirror was a bad move; perhaps it would have proved helpful if there was an investigation. I would recommend the previous advice offered, and have d revisit the police station and talk to the responding officer, and patrol sergeant and shift supervisor if warranted. If you need to escalate for clarification, continue up the ranks.</p>

<p>Sometimes you need to be aware of a potential bomb about to explode, and the need to keep the fuse away from the flame.</p>

<p>I’m all for sticking up for ones self, and am more than willing to defend my property and the lives and limbs of others, but sometimes discretion is the better part of valor, particularly if you don’t have a reasonable assessment of the potential consequences of escalation. Some things are well worth risking life and limb for, whereas others are not. </p>

<p>I hope your d suffers no lasting effects. Personally, I’d be examining all potential legal options.</p>

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<p>Please put first things first, and have your daughter x-rayed immediately. The combination of headache, neck and back pain must be checked out medically, ASAP.</p>

<p>She might be walking around right now with a chipped or fractured vertebrae, need a soft collar to mend, or physical therapy. It could even involve surgery if there was a significant fracture. </p>

<p>I’m not saying this to generate insurance matters; I’m honestly concerned for her physical health, now and in the future.</p>

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<p>What Violadad said.</p>

<p>I have a long daily commute and experience very aggressive drivers just about every day. A person who would get so angry as to hit your D’s car on purpose has a real anger problem. If that person had such a problem AND a gun, it could be fatal to the other driver. The angry driver would be totally wrong and at fault, but that doesn’t ressurect the other driver. Best to just stay out of the way of the highly aggressive.</p>

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<p>Paying3tuitions is absolutely right. Make sure that your daughters medical needs are met. Sometimes a minor ache can be a major injury if not treated immediately. My MIL had a broken hip for over 2 weeks because she did not get it checked out properly. Your D’s health is the main priority.</p>

<p>Also important is information and advice as to how to handle situations where there are jerks who may potential sociopaths. Living near NYC, I can tell you that it is not wise to push some of the crazies out there regardless of your rights. Just in the last month, I witnessed two explosions from people that I think are truly dangerous and should be locked up. They are probably roaming the streets, and woe to anyone who incites them the wrong way. That is what is out there in the world. </p>

<p>When kids start driving, one thing I remember having to constantly remind them that having the right of way is not something to push if it is dangerous. A nasty car accident can leave you dead, maimed and in a lot of trouble and grief even if you are right. So can an encounter with someone who is psychotic or on the verge of psychosis. It isn’t worth the momentarily satisfaction of “showing him/her”.</p>

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<p>My car was parked and the kids and I were in at a 7/11. When we came out we witnessed a car back right into my SUV and crunch the fender. The guy got out. His eyes were all red. He was jittery and very nervous. He and his buddy kept looking at my daughter and crowding us.</p>

<p>As a mother I went into pure flight mode. Clearly he was wrong. Clearly he was at fault. But there are so many crazy people out there that even though we were at no fault I didn’t want him to have my name, my address, anything. I told him to just leave.</p>

<p>For me, I would chalk this up to lesson learned. An expensive one yes. But to keep a man like this away from my daughter (although the license plate may be enough to track her down) would be reward enough for me.</p>

<p>But, maybe I am just paranoid (although that doesn’t mean I not justified!).</p>

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<p>You need to teach your daughter not to reciprocate. For all she knew that man had a gun on his passenger seat waiting for someone to **** him off. That was what my mother always taught me, and reminded me when I was 18 and started really driving a lot-- and then it actually happened to someone we know, in a nice quiet neighborhood where nothing ever happens. You never know. You NEVER engage strangers. If he was crazy enough to try and ram a young girl into a barrier, he is certainly crazy enough to be afraid of. I hope she has learned that from this but I just wanted to make sure you know that it is not too late to have a conversation about it so she doesn’t make the same mistake in the future. I am not trying to lecture you or her about this, simply saying what I would need from my own mother as a 19 year old in this situation, I am about your daughters age. Trust me, when we make huge, life threatening mistakes–sometimes we still need our parents to step in and be parents, even if we are young adults.</p>

<p>I don’t even know what to say about no tickets being issued. Seems to me I’d want to press charges for assault anyway if I could manage it. It makes no sense to me that tickets couldn’t have been issued, if not to him for leaving the scene when she OBVIOUSLY didn’t have a gun because she was searched, then to both for reckless driving and then they can go to court and let a judge decide. It is unfortunate that police have this much power over situations like this. I don’t know enough about those sorts of laws to really say much but if I were you I would not just be letting this go if I had any other avenues to take. While your daughter did make a very dangerous mistake, the most dangerous mistake was made by that crazy man and you’re right that he needs to be taken off the road.</p>

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<p>I agree that this guy is dangerous and that your D should never have been subject to this.</p>

<p>Maybe it’s because I don’t drive much (living in NYC), but this story makes me cringe. There was risk taking here (by both your D and the nutcase) with potential harm to other drivers. I’m picturing lots of maneuvering in and out of lanes, writing down of license plate #'s while driving, etc. I often see this type of reckless behavior on the highways and it terrifies me. </p>

<p>I’m not sure what the etiquette for merging is anymore. It used to be that the driver who was merging yielded to those already driving in the lane, but now my experience is that they don’t even look anymore but just merge on heedlessly, often forcing me to move over into the next lane, or slow down if that’s not possible. I try never to be in the right lane for that reason. However, I think drivers are expected to move over to make room if possible.</p>

<p>Your D needs to learn to pick her battles for her own sake. She’s lucky that he didn’t come after her after she pulled over.</p>

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<p>Legally, the person entering the highway or in the lane ending has to yield but I think the etiquette is that, if you can accommodate merging traffic by changing lanes, then that is the appropriate thing to do. I assume the OP’s daughter couldn’t get over. However, the nutty driver may have thought she could have and should have. No excuse for his behavior of course. I’ll admit that it annoys me when people stick to their lanes in disregard of people merging. I have told my daughter repeatedly that holding her ground in the right lane when people are merging might be legal but not always safe. Some people expect you to accommodate them and make room so you have to wary.</p>

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<p>I got hit by car that swerved into me. H was with me. Totally not my fault, but the other driver lied and said I swerved into her. We had moved to the side of the highway and there was no way to determine what really happened. Still angers me that I got part of the blame for that one some years ago. It happens, unfortunately.</p>

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<p>Oh wow. Glad your D is okay. Heard a similar story years ago, and have repeated it to my kids many times, as a cautionary tale, about someone trying to force a friend of mine and her husband off the road after her husband gave him the finger. Fortunately, they lived to tell about it.</p>

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<p>Not only for the person who is the victim of the road rage person, but also the road rage person himself should be aware that the other person might have a gun.</p>

<p>We had the situation recently in our city where a woman driving under the influence (booze, marijuana, and amphetamines), became PO’ed with a couple in a car–followed them around, did the usual road rage thing. Followed them into a parking lot and backed into their car. The husband thought the road rage person was trying to kill them with her car.</p>

<p>He was an off duty police officer. Took out his gun and shot into her car. Wounded her (and a little boy he didn’t know was in the car). This was not her first incident with road rage, by any means. She’s lucky she and her son weren’t killed. (Police officer found not guilty of grossly negligent discharge of firearm.)</p>

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<p>That’s another danger–drivers under the influence of something that pushes them way over. You just don’t know who these jerks are. It is scary.</p>

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<p>I was with my son and had a very similar experience in a parking lot. The other guy did not hit me. He just parked on top of mine. I asked him if he could move his car over so that I could get into the driver’s seat (he was parked all the way to the right of his space). The guy flipped out! At this point I realized that he just was not behaving in a normal, reasonable fashion. I don’t know or care about what his issues were. I ended up getting into my car through the passenger side and got my kid into the car with record speed. I locked the doors and just left. My adrenaline was flowing and I was in flight mode, and a mother bear protecting her cub. We were safe so I feel things went well, but I was shaking for hours. There are crazies out there!</p>