Dilemma

Paying for College
1

<p>D1 has asked me to fill out the CSS Profile NCP form. She wants to apply EA to a small private school that requires it. It is a very expensive school, total estimated cost of attendance is over $60k/year.</p>

<p>I believe it is an admission safety for her, 100% chance of admission. (She qualifies for automatic full merit scholarships at Temple and Alabama). She is likely to get a partial merit scholarship from this school, perhaps as much as $20k/year. That is not guaranteed or automatic. The out of pocket expense would almost certainly be over $40k/year, possibly the full $60k+.</p>

<p>The school specifically says on their website that they need the information by February 2015. She can apply without the CSS Profile being complete, they can make an admission decision without knowing about FA. My wife and I are likely to have much lower income for 2014 than both we did for 2013 or will for 2015 (she has been unemployed for a while). Plus, we have extensive debts (legal fees from her mother’s unending custody litigation).</p>

<p>My wife and I make significantly more money than her mother and stepfather do, and they are already >$150k. I am perfectly willing to give the school my information; however, I know it will hurt her when they get it and determine that she has no financial “need” at all.</p>

<p>D1 wants me to submit the CSS Profile information right away, not wait until we get our W-2s for 2014, and certainly not wait until the February deadline.</p>

<p>I am not particularly impressed with the school; it is legitimate, accredited, etc., but seems rather unexceptional to me. Further, they specialize in engineering, but she does not want to study engineering. Further, it would greatly increase the distance between us, which is something I had hoped to decrease once she is no longer subject to Custody Orders. </p>

<p>So, I don’t like it. I don’t see any good reason for her to go there. D1 is crazy about it though. I would not stop her from going there, but I am not willing to pay more money for it than I would pay for her to attend one of our public schools in Virginia (IS).</p>

<p>Should I fill out the CSS Profile NCP form early, or wait until I get my W-2 for 2014?</p>

<p>Should I set a hard limit on the amount that I will contribute to her education (for example, up to half the cost of an IS education at a Virginia public school)?</p>

2

<p>I’m afraid those are questions you’ll have to answer @FCCDAD‌. Obviously she won’t be getting any FA with >$300K in combined income to draw on. I personally would wait to file until I got a W-2. Between now and then I’d be considering how much to put toward school, and hoping the D started to rethink her top school choice. Good luck. This is a tough one for you.</p>

3

<p>I don’t see a reason to wait for W-2s, you can get the same info from the last paystubs and project through the last 3 months of 2014 and come up with a very good estimate. Is all income W-2 income plus any interest/dividend income you could get online? With the kind of incomes you have mentioned, it’s better that she sees there won’t be any need-based aid early, rather than later.</p>

<p>But, if you are going to have a limit on what you will contribute, then make that very clear now. I don’t know how good the communication is between you and your daughter, but don’t withhold that info another day. Whether or not to set a limit at a particular level depends on the financial and family dynamic situations that we don’t know anything about.</p>

<p>Have you asked your daughter why she’s crazy about this school?</p>

4

<p>You should set firm limits on what you would spend as a maximum. She can feel free to decide what schools fall within that financial ceiling.</p>

<p>My D1 is a NMSF and I set her financial ceiling at the cost of room and board. She was wise enough to have ASU as her most expensive school before additional scholarships are considered. Nothing wrong with making frugal educational decisions for college. </p>

5

<p>Yes, agree that whatever limit you set on your contribution should be communicated clearly to her now, before she makes her application list, so that she knows what level of merit scholarships are needed for each school. Unless there is a huge number of kids in college, you may also want to tell her not to expect any need-based aid since the parent household incomes combined will be over $300,000.</p>

6

<p>Just be absolutely crystal clear with her what you are willing to pay. Make sure she understands that she cannot just take out loans to make up the difference. And make sure she knows that getting in isn’t enough the money has to be there AND be able to be continued after freshman year (eg what are the GPA requirements). </p>

7

<p>At this point, I have no idea what we’ll be able to contribute, if anything. If my wife doesn’t find work, then we won’t have any money to spare at all. We bought the house without expecting her to get laid off.</p>

8

<p>You can call the financial aid office and get some idea of projected four year cost and types and amounts of aid likely to be available. Put the numbers in a spreadsheet with the other universities. Explain she may need to wait /gap year/ transfer in later if finances improve.</p>

9

<p><<<</p>

<p>I believe it is an admission safety for her, 100% chance of admission. (She qualifies for automatic full merit scholarships at Temple and Alabama). She is likely to get a partial merit scholarship from this school, perhaps as much as $20k/year. That is not guaranteed or automatic. The out of pocket expense would almost certainly be over $40k/year, possibly the full $60k+.</p>

<p>but I am not willing to pay more money for it than I would pay for her to attend one of our public schools in Virginia (IS).</p>

<p>I have no idea what we’ll be able to contribute, if anything. If my wife doesn’t find work, then we won’t have any money to spare at all. We bought the house without expecting her to get laid off.</p>

<p>Further, it would greatly increase the distance between us, which is something I had hoped to decrease once she is no longer subject to Custody Orders.</p>

<p>she [my wife] has been unemployed for a while). </p>

<p>My wife and I make significantly more money than her mother and stepfather do, and they are already >$150k.</p>

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<p>Hmmm…you said all these things today…not willing to pay more than you would pay for instate UVA…no idea of what you would contribute IF ANYTHING…would greatly increase distance between us…</p>

<p>You need to make some personal decisions. You can’t expect her to go to school where it’s convenient for contact with you when you make a good living and may not contribute ANYTHING. </p>

<p>Your wife, hopefully, will not continue to be unemployed. The economy is better, laid-off people are finding jobs…has she stopped looking?</p>

<p>Anyway…determine the amount that you will pay, even if it’s Plus loans that you’ll pay back once your wife is re-employed. Tell your D the firm amount. </p>

<p>Estimate how much you’ll earn this year, don’t wait on that.</p>

<p>Your D may get the big merit there…and if she doesn’t, she’ll have Temple or Bama as inexpensive back-ups. </p>

10

<p>If she got into a super-reach like Stanford/Princeton/etc., I probably would be willing to pay more, because I think that would help her prospects in life/career more. Able, of course, is different from willing. It’s hard to set a hard-and-fast ceiling because I do believe some schools are worth spending more on than others.</p>

<p>The ceiling I am considering, however, is half the cost of attendance at W&M (which is a few thousand more than UVA).</p>

<p>We should know next spring, before D1 has to make a final choice, what my wife’s career prospects are for the next few years. If the money’s not there, I understand D1 may choose to go far away; but I would be dealing with bigger problems than whether she’s a convenient distance away. Money is a much higher priority problem than distance to college.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if there is money available, I expect to have a say in where it goes. </p>

<p>My wife has not stopped looking; we seriously need her income, my pay alone isn’t enough to cover regular household expenses (and no, we are not willing to consider selling our home). Her unemployment benefit has run out, however.</p>

11

<p>If your daughter is applying EA, and the school has an early priority deadline for the Profile for EA applicants…do the Profile now to adhere to that deadline. </p>

<p>As noted…no aid is likely anyway.</p>

12

<p>well, hope that she gets the big merit there. Tell her the limitations…current income can’t pay for college until wife gets a job. Encourage her to include a number of large merit award schools on her list. </p>

<p>I hope your wife finds a job soon. If her unemployment has run out, I think that means that she’s been OOS for more than a year. Has she considered other fields of work…trying something different? Many people are going in totally different directions and having a different 2nd career in their middle-aged-years. </p>

13

<p>I presume you mean OOW, not OOS. Unemployment runs out after 26 weeks (6 months) these days. Thanks, John Boehner and Mitch McConnell! </p>

<p>She got laid off last year. She’s too far along in her career for us to be able to afford her starting over in a completely new field. She has looked at and below her skill level, some interviews, no offers yet.</p>

14

<p>Yes, oops…Out of work… lol</p>

15

<p>In Florida, unemployment lasts for 19 weeks, and it’s not very much anyway. Some states still have it for more weeks under the Obama increase (it wasn’t Boehner who decreased it, but Obama who temporarily increased it).</p>

16

<p>Unemployment isn’t much anywhere. It might cover groceries, utilities, and gasoline, at most. Doesn’t survive to help the mortgage.</p>

17

<p>If you are not sure how much you are willing to contribute, based on your wife’s uncertain employment prospects (or any continued post-divorce litigation costs), tell your daughter what your worst case contribution is, so that she does not get her expectations too high. You can tell her that if your household finances improve, you may be able to contribute more, but won’t know until later, and that she should not rely on any such additional contribution, particularly when determining whether a school can be a safety.</p>

<p>It is a lot better to say in April, “we can contribute $Y which is greater than the $X we promised last fall” than to say in April, “we promised $X, but we can really only contribute $Z which is less than $X”.</p>

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<p>If there are schools where you are willing to contribute more, let her know which schools they are and what the increased amount is (but based on your worst case household finance scenario so that you do not overpromise what you cannot deliver).</p>

18

<p>You are asking for personal opinions/recommendations. Here are mine (take them or leave them):</p>

<p>1) Make a spreadsheet model to determine what you are willing to pay. I would model based on April 1 start date for your wife at 85% of previous salary.
2) Communicate this to D1. Tell her that for some schools (e.g. Stanford) that is negotiable and you would increase your contribution to as much as $YY (a sort of “family merit scholarship”) if she promises to buy you a sweatshirt.
3) Profile opens Nov 1 and the school needs it by Feb 15. There is no down-side to filling out the Profile form since it is all estimates at this point anyway, and it will make your daughter feel better. Just do it.</p>

<p>I am eager to check back here to revisit this discussion, since I feel a massive Boehner/Obama fest about to start, and I am SURE we will be able to solve all political issues in America right here! :)</p>

19

<p>In some states, it’s $900+ per week (NY, Mass are two high states and not everyone works in the cities). Florida is $275 max - not enough for the groceries, even if you walk to the store and eat in the dark.</p>

20

<p>It’s a tough go, I know FCCDAD. There are a lot of things going on here, and you can’t do much about a lot of them. You should discuss your financial situation frankly with your daughter and make it clear that you may not be able to pay much for her college. Since you don’t have an absolute maximum due to things being in flux right now, tell her that. </p>

<p>There are some things you CAN do however, and filling out the CSS PROFILE that she wants you to complete is one of them. Go on a head and do so and see what happens. It will be a good practice for the FAFSA coming up and other PROFILEs. Also,if she needs a NCP PROFILE from her NCP, that will put the battle in that court if your ex balks are delays in it. </p>

<p>My DH’s colleague has a DD who graduated from Temple recently, she went the Honors College route there and is now going to a top notch university for graduate studies. Her parents could have afforded to send her anywhere for UG but with difficulty. That she’s out with no loans, and parents have some money to contribute, it’s making a very expensive, but likely to be very worthwhile grad program possible with minimal if any loans. Those are some of the rewards of staying within ones means for ug years.</p>

<p>Also, do get ready to let fin aid offices know about the unemployment situation and the court issues. Those things could get some consideration through Professional Judgement on part of a financial aid office, though I would not count on it generating a lot more at your income level. </p>

<p>This s an excellent chance for an early read of your situation. Yes, it could hurt her, in terms of feelings, and be discouraging, but there is time for her to regroup and get a whole other outlook on her choices. </p>