So is this becoming one of the things that people ask about when first meeting someone? Would you actually ask someone where they went to school? And if the answer was a private school then try to ask about loans on the sly? That is almost as bad as asking a dude if he has a job. Not a very good way to start off a relationship.
We both had Staffords from UG. He took out more Staffords and PLUS loans for law school. I didn’t cosign his loans. Our parents, who were in no position to comment or help, had zero input into our decisions. After we paid off the loans, which was also the point at which the kids aged out of day care and DH joined the government, we could scrape together a down payment.
There is at least one poster on here (here meaning CC, not sure if they’ve posted on this thread) that has said repeatedly that they will demand a pre-nup when their children married.
My statement still stands even if it wasn’t a direct response to any one post.
Seriously, why are you assuming that people ask about finances when they first meet?
We are speaking about pre-nups, done AFTER engagement.
Did you not know about your spouse’s finances before marriage? Were there no transparencies?
Actually, the school and job questions is one of the usual ones which usually comes up on first dates not only now, but even back in my parents’ generation.
However, it’d be more in the mode of trying to know someone’s background…especially considering how our culture assigns great importance to one’s job as a part of one’s identity.
Interestingly, asking what someone does…especially in a way that assumes it defines their entire identity is considered a bit of a faux pas in some European cultures…especially on dates as they reject the idea one’s job defines one’s entire identity. Almost as bad as directly asking someone their annual income here in the US as a few international students found to their disadvantage*.
Heck, I commonly get asked where I went to school…and not always college, but also elementary, middle, and high school among new acquaintances who were also fellow NYC natives to establish which areas of the city we grew up in/experienced.
*They came from societies where asking about one’s annual income is considered normal innocuous conversation…including on first dates. Ended up cluing in some international students on how such a question is considered extremely rude and prying in the private matters of others in US society.
“So is this becoming one of the things that people ask about when first meeting someone? Would you actually ask someone where they went to school?”
Isn’t that what google is for? Cyberstalking? 
I had a student loan for my first degree, back in the day when the 5000 paid for everything for the year. DH’s parent’s paid for his school–he didn’t finish. So, yes I brought that into the marriage. We also didn’t have our first kid until we were married 10 years and that debt was paid for. My parents gave us a wedding and 5000 when we bought our first home. I have worked steadily while DH has started a business, one that is luxury driven, and he hasn’t made a dime since November. His parents left us comfortable while my mother has her home and nothing else. It’s balanced out. My D and her BF take turns paying when they go out. I think we showed her right.
"Where is the love? Everyone is making it sound like marriage is a business decision. You get married for love not the solidity of the person’s balance sheet. "
Marriage is a financial decision. Sometimes, the legal marriage contract just doesn’t make financial sense. You can just stay together for love without the legalities that might harm your finances, especially now that there is no longer a social stigma to living together.
I didn’t see it that way when I was young, all romantic and such. But now that I am older and wiser, I see it clearly as a legal decision more than a romantic one.
Yes of course love is a huge part of the equation - but compatibility and similar goals and values are important too. Case in point - one young girl (21) in my office, just got married after knowing the fellow for 6 weeks. A few months later, she’s getting a divorce. She didn’t realize how lazy he was, how he didn’t work a regular job, and didn’t have the same goals she did financially. She loved him - she didn’t know him.
I’d encourage anyone to really know the person before they decide to share a life together. And that includes their finances, career aspirations and views on spending and saving, as well as discussions on children, daycare, etc.
Hubby and I were both young in our careers, no debt, but no hidden jackpots on either side. And if my kids really love their future spouse, that’s fine. I won’t say anything to them, but all things being equal, I wouldn’t choose someone with huge loans for them. But I’d choose that over a whole lot of other things.
I don’t see this as dishonest. His parents money is not his money, and whether to share how much the parents have, should be the decision of the parents not him. Even with his trust fund, asking the balance to me is like asking to see someone’s W2, 1040s, and 401k balance. I don’t think two people need to share that level of financial detail with each other until they’re already engaged.
When I was a new young attorney, one of my colleagues said that her H was good BD material but not great H material. They got divorced and she found her H was “who was good H material.” Her ex has been with the same long time GF for decades now.
Waiting until after the engagement, however, will cause some to feel a sort of “bait and switch” was pulled. Especially if the one with the trust fund plead poverty to the point of effectively mooching off the GF/friends.
While not something to bring up on the first few dates, it is something to bring up when one has gotten serious enough to proceed to the engagement stage.
109 - Sure, but that was not the issue. The issue was not even the trust (financial) but the other kind of trust. If the man got a good chunk of $$$ a month in income from the trust fund while asking the GF to pay for the rent and feed him because he is a poor student... That BF is a dumping material.
Yes, candor and honesty are important traits in a healthy relationship. Mooching off people claiming poverty when one isn’t REALLY as poor as claimed is either active deception of deception by silence or omission.
The first problem with this is it assumes the trust fund is accessible. For various reasons, many trusts are setup so that distributions are at the sole discretion of the trustee. Others might have age triggers of 25, 30, or even older. The other is if someone pleads poverty and you’re worried about “mooching”, choose an activity that’s in both of your stated budgets. Last, not all bait and switches are bad. If I was standing on the altar and my fiancee said she had a $5 million dollar trust fund, I would feel like I just won the lottery.
Yes, if those conditions were part of the trust, that could also have been explained in a long term serious relationship.
The BF didn’t say the trust funds were not available to him when found out. That seems to imply he had some control over his trust. Even in an irrevocable trust, there’s a provision for beneficiaries or their guardians to withdraw x% of income to support beneficiaries. You can’t setup an irrevocable trust without that provision. I think it’s to make sure the trust belongs to the beneficiary not the grantor. The grantor gets to control how to distribute the principal.
I wouldn’t sweat if the debt is not approaching 6 figure. If it does and the future spouse doesn’t have an earnings potential, it would worry me.
to add to other comments…Divorce IS a business decision.
My brother signed a pre-nup because my SIL’s mother is a shareholder in a family business and anyone marrying into the family knew that signing was non-negotiable. At the time it seemed off-putting, but now that we are all older and way more business savvy, it makes total sense.
My daughter and her fiance have been a couple for more than four years now. There is a financial disparity between them. But this and other financial issues don’t seem to be a huge problem for them because they talk to each other about money matters. In fact, they’ve become pretty skilled at making all sorts of important life decisions together in ways that are acceptable to both of them.
They want to spend the rest of their lives together, but I don’t see any stars in their eyes.
I think they’re going to have an excellent marriage.
My marriage was in part a business decision. We married “young” (24) because I wanted him on my insurance. We had been together for several years and we were going to marry eventually anyway, we had been living together for several years, so it just made sense.