<p>The answer is yes and no. No average students become doctors but yes because some average students become great students who become doctors.</p>
<p>There is your path, grasshopper.
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<p>Great point, madboutx. I think there is an assumption that average grades in HS mean someone is average in intelligence. There are a lot of bored, underachieving, really brilliant kids in high schools who have not yet found their calling. So, average grades in HS may not mean someone is not capable of being a physician. However, you must be really smart to be a physician. And eventually, you need to achieve the grades to get into med school. Those underachieving, smart kids have to eventually apply themselves in college to achieve their goals.</p>
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<p>Using a few of my kidsâ friends as examples, I would prefer that my doctor is knowledgeable but non super smart. Scary smart people at the high school often have social things to worry about, and often develop the so-called âGod complexâ. </p>
<p>A docâs thinking is influenced by insurance companies and lawsuits and the like, not by knowledge. I have an awesome dentist and my kids have a dentist that is beyond belief. Yet insurance company policy and a bit of âGod complexâ on their behalf will have us going to less expensive dentists in-network because the good ones are out of network, and even with âinsuranceâ we pay a ton of money.</p>
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<p>What makes a dentist âawesomeâ or âbeyond beliefâ? Or does your area tend to have a lot of dentists who tend to âfindâ problems to increase procedures, want to do X-rays every year for patients who are not especially decay-prone, or have other undesirable characteristics?</p>
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You donât need to be âreally smartâ to become a doctor. I know several people who became doctors who certainly did not meet that description. Instead they were just regular kids who worked hard, but didnât necessarily catch on to classwork as easily as others (in advanced classes). However, they did achieve respectable grades and test scores through hard work. This is the main requirement, which is not the same as being a super genius type. Even grades can be poor in certain circumstances. For example, the table at <a href=âhttps://www.aamc.org/download/157594/data/table25-b-mcatgpa-grid-black.pdf[/url]â>https://www.aamc.org/download/157594/data/table25-b-mcatgpa-grid-black.pdf</a> shows med school acceptance rates by GPA and MCAT score for black students. Note that students with a 2.6 GPA and a 30+ MCAT score have a >50% acceptance rate. Even with the median MCAT score among the group, there was a >50% acceptance rate with a GPA slightly under 3.0. There was a 33% acceptance rate with an average MCAT and 1.47 to 1.99 GPA (too small a sample size to be statistically significant).</p>
<p>To answer the original question, yes, it is entirely possible to be an average high-school student and become a doctor if you apply yourself at the university level and are committed to your goals.</p>
<p>Americansâ fetishization of the medical profession never ceases to amaze me. Itâs just a job. A noble and time-consuming one, yes, but it doesnât mean youâre superhuman, or smarter than everyone else, or exceptional from birth. Doctors poop too.</p>
<p>And I say this as someone who comes from a family of doctors.</p>
<p>Rmh-
Former MT s make fabulous physicians!</p>
<p>We have several where I work and I always love their callsâŚmuch easier to discuss a blood culture with P. Aerug with someone who understands what an MIC is.</p>
<p>MIC? Music industry conference? OrâŚ
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<p>âI would prefer that my doctor is knowledgeable but non super smart. Scary smart people at the high school often have social things to worry about, and often develop the so-called âGod complexâ.â</p>
<p>I find this kind of amazing. Why is it necessary to compromise? Why canât a physician be really smart, knowledgeable, AND have good social skills? Not all really smart people have poor social skills or are self-absorbed, narcissistic people. This reminds me of how many people choose âlikableâ politicians for public office, who often lack the intelligence to perform their responsibilities. </p>
<p>I want a physician who is smart, thinks with great complexity, grasps information readily and has a large fund of knowledge. I personally also like someone with compassion, but intelligence is critical. I would hope that even if someone squeaked by and got into medical school with lesser abilities, the brutal vetting process would weed them out.</p>
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What a stereotype. Wheres the data, or is this again anecdotal?</p>
<p>There was a guy in my high sch. class who was very personable , intelligent âŚsuper nice guy but was never considered to be one of the top students. He wasnât in the top ten, wasnât in the honor society, was not in all the what was back then called âacceleratedâ classes. He went to an HBCU and then on to Med. school at a different HBCU. Twenty-five years later he owns a small town medical practice not too far from our home town. He was a really good guy who tried hard and made it.</p>
<p>Here are some recent data on medical school admissions:</p>
<p><a href=âhttps://www.aamc.org/download/321494/data/2012factstable17.pdf[/url]â>https://www.aamc.org/download/321494/data/2012factstable17.pdf</a></p>
<p>And some more data:</p>
<p><a href=âhttps://www.aamc.org/data/facts/appl...ethnicity.html[/url]â>https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/appl...ethnicity.html</a></p>
<p>from the Association of American Medical Colleges. Itâs a chart showing medical school acceptances by GPA crossed with MCAT score.</p>
<p>I agree with Madaboutx and Ghostt: It is possible for an average high school student to become a doctor or vet. To the best of my knowledge, none of the applications ask about a studentâs high school record. The data Iâve linked show what the student needs to accomplish in college to get into medical school. Admission to vet school is not any easier, from my observations. So the student would really have to do a turn-around, to become well above average.</p>
<p>An average Harvard student could probably get into medical school. However, an average high school student will not have the opportunity to become an average Harvard student.</p>
<p>I think the optimal mix of skills really varies by specialty. I think finding someone who listens well, is hands-on, and has a reasonable grasp of whatâs new and cutting edge is important in a pediatrician, a geriatrician, OB/GYN, etc. Frankly, I could care less about the social skills and bedside manner of an oncologist, neurologist, cardio-vascular surgeon, etc. For those situations, I think most people want someone who is at the top of their game intellectually with very strong skills at absorbing data, interpreting new and leading edge technologies and outcomes, and even if they donât pat my hand and reassure me that everything is going to be OK-- Iâm good with that.</p>
<p>I think most HS kids donât have a clue as to the hundreds of interesting careers that are out there, hence the âIâm going to med schoolâ phenomenon. Thatâs a shame- particularly for kids who enjoy the sciences but may not be med school caliber applicants. Iâve posted before about my neighbor who recruits patients for clinical trials- what a fascinating job she has. A friend of one of my kids is working for the CDC in public health; another maps disease and symptoms for Google. A HS friend of mine trains nurses who have been in practice for a while in using new technologies, and a former colleague is in marketing for a diagnostics company.</p>
<p>There are many ways to use an interest in science besides going to med school.</p>
<p>Several of my HS friends who were not necessarily in the top classes or the top students at that time went into medicine and are doing just fine. In fact, Iâd say thats probably the majority (ie the MDs were bright, but not the tippy top students). The tippy top students that I can recall offhand are in other industries, academia, research, law, engineering, finance. Some re in healthcare, but its by no means the majority.</p>
<p>Whatâs an average HS student? If its a 3.2GPA/22 ACT, then my friendâs kid was BELOW average with barely a 2.7 and a 0 SAT because he didnât take it. He attended a cc for two years and was accepted to state flagship with $$. Now, in his senior year, he is applying to med school. So, there are always exceptions.</p>
<p>^^^^I define average as basically having a B average in high school and having a 22-26 ACT. I am impressed with your friendâs kid, I believe he is definitely an exception. I understand it is difficult to get into medical school - I wish him luck.</p>
<p>A kid with a 26 is at the 83rd percentile. I think weâve got a pretty skewed view of âaverageâ here on cc.</p>
<p>Most people donât talk to people who growl at them, so even if youâd theoretically listen, in real life (as opposed to TV), doctors who growl donât get the information they need to be good doctors. </p>
<p>My general belief about scary smart doctors is that, at least in residency, they spend way too much time searching for the mysterious illness theyâll be able to write a case report about, and not nearly enough time treating the patient in front of them (who might have boring needs). So, in general, I donât see âscaryâ smart (and, whatâs scary about being smart, anyway) as a qualification for an average doctor. </p>
<p>I think average high school students can become doctors, but only if they are not average college students. Kids who donât peak in high school might not get into the top schools, but thatâs not a requirement for going to med school â great grades and the right experiences from a solid undergraduate institution will do it, too. If the question was do average college students become doctors, Iâd agree that itâs unlikely and they are working themselves up from a significant disadvantage.</p>