Do I have a problem child or a normal college kid?

Parent Cafe
21

Thanks for the suggestions all. Before things spiral, I do want to push back a little on the alcoholism suggestions. Although it does not run in our family, both H as an MD and I as someone who spent many years in social work know quite a bit about the disease, and although D’s drinking is certainly a problem we’re not concerned that this is alcoholism. Alcoholism is a physical dependency on alcohol; our daughter’s problem is social–it isn’t that she can’t not drink, it’s that she’s prone to making poor decisions when she’s with people her age who are drinking. My problem is that I don’t know to what extent I can insulate her from that without removing her from the college environment altogether, and I don’t know what more I can do to change how she acts while away from home.

I don’t doubt that the three incidents here are the “tip of the iceberg”–I’m sure that she drinks as much as many other college students do. I’d love for her to give it up altogether until she’s 21, but H and I aren’t sure how to do that without resorting to threats we’d be uncomfortable following through on.

22

OP, not all college students drink, and certainly not all drink in places and to the extent that they are ticketed/arrested three times in a year! If you believe that, there are some folks selling bridges that want to talk to you! Every week or two some parent or student is on CC asking about “sober dorms” or looking for colleges where drinking isn’t allowed. They are out there-we toured a couple last summer. Though they are HBCU’s, I know for certain there are more traditional schools where even a single incident of drinking could get you banned from dorm living or even suspended. Maybe your D needs such a place? Or maybe she needs to live at home and commute to a “lesser” school…something where she has fewer opportunities to make poor decisions, since she is apparently not able to make good ones when alcohol is around.

I get it-kids drink, even on alcohol free campuses. But to assume that “all the other kids” are doing it isn’t necessarily accurate. SOME of them are NOT. And yet they still have fun on campus. Only your D-not you-know whether she is someone with a problem. I say again, not everyone who is an alcoholic is an obvious drunk.

23

Isn’t it self-evident that she has two drug problems (alcohol and nicotine) already?

24

I think she needs some sort of counseling. She needs to figure out why she makes poor,decisions. This hasn’t happened once…it’s happened three times. Most kids would be a lot more careful. Is it possible she wanted to be caught…and maybe needs more help,than anyone actually recognizes?

I would allow the process to move along. But if I were paying for this kid to go,to college, a condition of her return would be some kind of counseling.

25

Hmmm… when most of us were in college at 18, we were all legal drinkers. They raised the drinking age I don’t recall when, but… I remember being a freshman and going to frat parties and drinking and it was all part of having fun and growing up. We, the older crowd, never really had to navigate the fear of getting caught in underage drinking. I am not condoning it, but I think a lot of people may be jumping the gun to call a 3.9 GPA student an alcoholic. Get her a lawyer, but make her pay for it. You don’t want that on her record. Watch all her movements at home and moniter her actions. The smoking IS an issue. Cigarettes are expensive. Tell her if she is going to spend $ on cigs, she doesn’t need your help with tuition. I would make that mandatory that she stops if you are paying for school.

26

I agree that you should consider that she might be using harder drugs. If she’s social drinking and social smoking it would probably be a good idea to talk to her about “social” drug use. My child is Greek at a large school and says that most members who are heavily into the party scene are also using drugs.

27

Here’s a cc thread in which cc students defend their smoking.
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-life/1682771-why-do-so-many-college-students-smoke-cigarettes-p1.html

28

It seems to me that it IS that she can’t not drink. If she could have not drunk, she should have exhibited this ability before she got arrested for drinking for the third time in a year.

29

ZBD-I for one am NOT calling the OP’s D an alcoholic, but was pointing out that a outwardly successful person can ALSO have an alcohol problem. I am related to one of them. But I’m going to agree with Cardinal Fang again-I DO think that this girl can’t not drink-and has done so more than once, in settings where law enforcement was more likely than not to be present. If that isn’t a setting to NOT drink, I don’t know what is.

30

You do not have a problem child…but in my opinion, you do have a child with a problem.

31

so glad my kids took a gap year.

I haven’t had direct experience with this as a parent, but my gut feeling tells me that unless this degree of poor decisions was exhibited in high school, (& I assume it wasn’t), she seems to be over her head w something and is positioning herself so that help will be gotten for her.

32

From our experience (limited as it admittedly is), having come to the attention of the authorities 3x in 1 term for alcohol is highly unusual and time for the parents to step up and get the kid some counseling and interventions to help her make better, safer choices. We have two kids, lots of nieces and nephews, and they all have a lot of friends. To our knowledge, none of them came to the attention of any authorities for any activities they were engaged in related to alcohol during their college careers.

OP, in your gut, you know this is NOT “normal,” or you probably would not have started this thread. Listen to your gut and get your kiddo some help–Al-Anon would be a good place to start, I believe.

33

@"Cardinal Fang"‌

I think it might be early enough where they can scare her with photos! Most teens are very looks conscience and the thought of a huge, disgusting , cancerous tumor growing out of her mouth may stop her.

34

Maybe I missed something, but I didn’t see any reference to the OP’s D using a phony ID. Believe me, a charge of using phony ID is much more likely to mess up future career plans than a MIP charge.

I would be more concerned about the smoking than the drinking. It sounds as if her recent arrest was more indicative of “felony stupid” than alcoholism. I don’t think she had to be drunk or doing anything wrong other than drinking to get arrested when the cops came in and did a sweep asking for ID. But you do have to be dumb not to know that you’re more likely to get arrested for this on NYE.

My D came within an eyelash of getting arrested once. Was in a pizza place with a group of friends and they had a pitcher of beer. Friend came in, said he’d just seen two cop cars outside and the cops had pulled into the parking lot. They threw enough $ on the table to cover the bill, and walked out the back door. They were walking, not driving, and walked right by the cops. Everyone underage inside was arrested. . The point of this anecdote is that it’s possible to get arrested even if you aren’t drunk or acting out in any way if the police are conducting a raid. Raids are usually focused more on closing down bars that serve underaged drinkers than anything that’s actually going on at the bar.

IMO, it’s a very, very dumb idea not to get an attorney–especially if most of those arrested are doing so.

Yes, the young woman MAY have a drinking problem. But was she intoxicated when she was arrested? Was she breathalyzed? Of was it simply a matter of a cop saying “I saw her with a drink and asked for ID?” I’d react differently to those two scenarios. If she had had a couple of drinks but was not intoxicated at 2 or 3 am on New Year’s Day, I personally don’t think she has a drinking problem.

35

I’d encourage your daughter to attend some AA meetings. Maybe you could go with her. I have a daughter and four nephews in college. They happen to be hanging out together right now for the holidays. Two of the boys are in a fraternity and I’m sure they have all done some drinking. There are here right now and we talk openly about this kind of stuff. I just ran the scenario in the OP’s initial post by them and they all said that the only kids they know who have repeatedly gotten in trouble over drinking have very obvious drinking problems.

36

Could your dd be feeling pressured to drink? Sometimes they don’t want to feel like the odd man out which can get teens into trouble. I would sit with her and have a heart to heart about her friends and ask if she really enjoys drinking or is it to just fit in with the crowd.

Things that I discuss with my own dd on a regular basis…

When you are out partying, can you trust your “friends” to keep you safe/get you back to your dorm safely should you need them? The answer is probably NO, so always be in control of yourself. Never place yourself in a position where you are at the mercy of other teens who are also inebriated. Being in control is key.

Getting into a car with someone who has been drinking, even one drink…is a NO NO! She should always have money for a cab, tucked away so she can get back to her dorm safely. Safety is of paramount importance.

37

Eventually, when my brother and I found my other brother with drugs in our home, we decided the worst thing we could do is tell our parents instead of the cops. Note that he also started smoking in college, which was quite odd as none of the other siblings and neither parent smoked, plus we had relatives who died from lung cancer before their time. Our parents forced him to live at home instead of on campus, and he knew enough not to drink and drive, or do drugs and drive. He basically quit a lot of stuff cold turkey, and though he never quit or was thrown out of his fraternity, he did not go to the house ever again. He barely graduated in five years. But he did get bad grades because of his issues.

I have no idea how bad your daughter’s problem is if the only symptom is getting caught, and on the other hand she is kicking butt academically. Which is very hard if you have true drug abuse or alcoholism.

To be honest, it sounds like you have no idea what the college is going to do about a criminal conviction. And you probably have no idea about whether she will lose her drivers license or not (depends on the state I believe whether you lose your license for underage drinking).

I would say for now, grounding her and letting her go back to college with a few extra rules, at least some of which you should be able to enforce, would be better than just taking her out of college, if she has the choice to stay in college. Things like less spending money, not paying her cell phone bill over a certain amount, and so on.

Psychologically, either she is purposefully making stupid choices to drink in public, or she is going along with the crowd. I would say as a parent, who assumedly is paying for her college, you have a right to try to get to the bottom of the situation. Are there problem drinkers in her sorority? Is she just a pledge and getting caught when being “inducted”?

I do not think the drinking is the issue, getting caught is the bigger issues. As others said, it is normal to drink in college, even if it is every week for some people and even if you are getting drunk on occasion. But getting caught so much - is it a cry for help or an indication that she doesn’t have it under control? Or is she a patsy for others?

I am not sure if AA or similar would help, she needs to admit she has an issue. I just randomly found info on NYU’s site (I was watching a Neil Simon movie LOL):
http://livewellnyu.com/drinking-drugs-resources/

Her college should have similar resources, and it sounds like she had been forced previously to avail herself of them. But it doesn’t sound like she learned anything from the mandatory courses or maybe she is drinking less but still getting caught.

However, just to get the issue back to her and what she feels, I don’t think just taking her out of school would be best right now, if she is allowed to stay until if and when she gets convicted. Read up on the college’s policies though.

Good luck, I’m sure it is heartbreaking somehow she needs to see that without being shamed but learn enough to stop.

38

This isn’t normal by any stretch of the imagination. I went to a huge party school and sometimes, sometimes people were popped with an MIP or something in their first year and they learned to be much more discreet about it afterwards.

She should be handling her legal fees and anything else. She clearly doesn’t think the consequences are very severe.

And as for smoking- ugh. Just ugh. Disgusting. At the very least, make it clear that she is not to smoke in your house. It blows my mind that any college-aged student is dumb enough to take up smoking in 2010s.

39

As someone said upthread, use the bad stories of others. What does she want to do for a career? Will she have to pass a security clearance? Will she ever want to work in a science lab? Travel to Canada? Get a law license? Yes, you can do these things after you have an arrest record, but it take a lot more work. You have to ask for an exception, you have to file more paperwork, you have to relive the events over and over. Should she ever want to adopt a child internationally, she’ll have to report all these arrests. Yes, the arrests, not just convictions.

On CC alone, there are stories of kids who lost their financial aid because of drug arrests. One recently was trying to get into a grad school and wondered if the arrests would be a problem. It’s time to pull out these stories. I’m sorry others had to experience the bad things so that I can use them as examples for my kids, but I do. “Oh look, this kid went out drinking and threw up in his dorm, and now he can’t live there anymore. Oh, how sad, this freshman was drunk and ‘just borrowed’ something from the dining room and was arrested for theft.” My daughter was visiting her high school friend in his dorm and smelled pot. She left immediately. I’ve not threatened her, but she knows if she loses her scholarships I can’t afford the school.

The cigarettes? NO more spending money from me. I might also consider not paying the sorority dues or something like that.

40

“The cigarettes? NO more spending money from me.”

This.