Someone I’m very close to was recently divorced because of this, and through the divorce proceedings is discovering that the financial cheating was colossally worse than previously revealed. It’s awful. Mountains of debt that the innocent spouse is responsible for.
@ Gluttonforstress Ditto here… (except we are not 1%ers) …
Sometimes we talk about personal things here, but the only harsh words my wife and I have, and they are pretty harsh, over money have to do with the fact that she feels my father was more generous to my siblings, their ex-wifes and their children than he was to me. And without going into great detail, he probably was. A lot of it had to do with need. They were divorced; their ex-wives needed housing; they needed insurance.
I understand my wife’s irritation over certain things, and in fact I made this mistake of complaining about them. But I didn’t know it was going to result in repeated episodes of screeching. If I could go back 20 years and change one thing, my wife would never have so much as a scintilla of knowledge about my business or financial affairs. Nothing.
Wow, I’d be unhappy with screeching but I couldn’t be in a marriage where we both don’t have full knowledge about each other’s finances, to the extent it affects both of us. Now, the extent to which any of us should know about finances of others (like parents and in-laws) is a whole different issue. A lot of grief occurs when folks “count other people’s money,” which many threads about expensive “dream colleges” will demonstrate. I feel my folks and in-laws have the unfettered right to spend their money and bequeath it as they choose (tho hopefully they will have enough resources to pay for all their needs). It isn’t MY business, my spouses’s business or even my siblings or their spouse’s business.
@EarlVanDorn I have had similar familial incidents where our parents have helped out siblings because they needed it and we haven’t. As my husband and I have discussed, thank goodness our parents were there to help out our siblings, otherwise the siblings probably would have come to us for help! (We actually have been in that spot once or twice and have helped get them out of a financial pinch, as well as said “no thanks” to a sibling wanting us to invest in a business.)
I personally don’t have a problem with a parent helping a child more unless maybe the adult child is in need because of spendthrift or other irresponsible behavior.
I have told my Dad not to leave me any money. My sibs would need it much more than I. He probably won’t comply, but I already know he loves me equally.
That’s a complete over reaction. Sure, reasonable in retrospect to keep your parents’ financial affairs and how they distribute money confidential. But if you live in a community property state, or if “your” financial affairs affect your wife one iota, then you have no business keeping this a secret.
@Nrdsb4 I don’t life in a community property state and I had a modest but still substantial estate when we married, since I was able to work and travel as a bachelor. It’s a long story, but it’s very frustrating that any time I make a dollar the first concern is that somebody else might have made a dollar, too. Perhaps not all women are like this.
Yes, there have always been and likely always will be people who enjoy counting other people’s money. To me, it’s an illness. I’m glad so far, I don’t know many who are afflicted with it.
Of course not all women are like this. First of all, I think reasonable people understand that (even in a community property state) all assets made before a marriage belong to the person who acquired them. Doesn’t mean that person cannot share, co-mingle, what have you, but generally those assets are protected. So are many inheritances which are distributed in a trust. Again, nothing to keep you from co-mingling that if you wish. My personal beliefs are that marriage is not only a religious union (and isn’t always that), but more importantly, it’s a legal union. What’s the point of legally recognizing a union if there isn’t some sense of the union being a “team” in more ways than emotional/sexual? That’s simply a personal belief, not saying everyone else does or should view it this way. But if you are married, I believe each partner has the obligation to be transparent with regard to money, even if they choose not to share their assets.
I don’t blame you for your regret about sharing the details of how your inlaws choose to distribute THEIR money. If your wife is “screeching” about money, you have my sympathy, as that is not the norm for dealing with conflict, at least not in my experience. Sounds like maybe you and your wife could use an unbiased “referee” who could point out what is reasonable and what is not as it relates to dealing with not only finances, but how to best handle the disagreements inherent in that kind of partnership. It’s never too late. My DH and I are having a significant difference of opinion on another subject, and I’m thinking it might be helpful to get input from someone completely unbiased and experienced in helping people navigate these differences in philosophy. There’s no shame in seeking out this kind of help and doesn’t mean that the marriage is bad or that either of the parties is necessarily in the wrong.
We’re not.
My husband’s parents have helped out his two younger siblings enormously over the years financially. Am I jealous? No. I would not trade who I am for either of those two for all the money in Fort Knox. They’re not bad people, but we don’t roll the same way.
My MIL (bless her heart) has plenty to drive me crazy about without adding money into the mix. H feels the same way.
Money is never free. Any largess that randomly floats our way from them immediately goes into the kids’ 529.
We tried the two separate accounts plus a joint account when we first got married…that just led to confusion and late payments.
Everything is in one place. We are both capable of handling the bills, but she does it right now. We we both do it, there are arguments and missed payments.
Rarely use cash. Everything goes on a card and back off within 30 days. Autopayments are great.
When H and I went for premarital counseling with our pastor and his wife, they gave us one piece of advice - don’t keep separate bank accounts. Thirty years later, we’re still following that advice. We both keep each other apprised of any financial transactions. Fortunately, we have the same spending habits and goals, so we’ve never argued about money - even when we didn’t have any. And we decided long ago that I would be the bill payer. H tried to take it over once and we ended up with late payments. He’s not a real detail guy. But we manage our investments together and consult each other about major purchases.
My impression is that a lot of couples have a mixture of separate and joint accounts, especially in dual income families. I don’t have the stomach for my H’s risk tolerance so I like to maintain my own investment account. I think the key is full disclosure of those accounts and access to statements by both parties. I tend to be a person that plans for “the worst possible scenario.” Having a certain amount in my name only gives me that peace of mind.
As far as money matters relative to my spouse’s family - I make it a point to stay totally out of it. I really just don’t see where I have any standing to weigh in. As far as I know, inheritance received during a marriage is not considered marital property (unless commingled). And I think that is right, an inheritance is money that is meant for one specific individual. We recently had a situation where a distribution was made in H’s family that was equally divided among the 5 siblings. It was not an insignificant amount. Two of his sisters sent an email floating the idea that H should assign his share to one of the other brothers who had a rough couple of years financially. H ran it by me and I said it was totally his decision. I have no idea what he decided and really have no burning desire to know. That’s an area where I am fine with him making executive decisions. I retain that same right with my own family.
."H ran it by me and I said it was totally his decision. I have no idea what he decided and really have no burning desire to know. "
While I completely agree it’s his decision, how can the ramifications of that decision NOT be something that affects your own financial planning? Especially if it’s substantial? I’m not talking - he won a $20 bet down at the bar.
@HarvestMoon1, I know you don’t mind but I wonder if your H’s sisters willing to give up a portion of their money or just your H’s.
My husband gets his cheating-with-money ways from his dad. Sigh.
You may be surprised of instances where in a divorce, even though the inheritance was only in the name of one spouse, it was figured into the settlement by a judge, whereby the one who received the inheritance, had to give some to the spouse, even though the inheritance was not in that spouse’s name, nor commingled, and that spouse’s own parents were still living and so that spouse would ultimately receive an inheritance in the future, that would not have to be shared.
Even though my husband and I don’t share accounts with most of our money, we still share information, and make decisions together. For example, back when the stock market crashed in 2008ish, we lost about 1/2 of our 529s. After that he really didn’t want to put more college money in those accounts. So from there on out, we saved cash, which with hindsight was clearly a silly thing to do. But in that case I felt like the most conservative person should “win.” I decide how to invest my retirement account, and he decides how to invest his. But I have “made him” put the max into retirement accounts for the last several years. Even though he might rather have that money now, he knows it’s a good idea.
Someone up thread asked about buying a very significant present. For “normal” presents, such as graduations, birthdays, etc., we usually just pay for our side of the family. But for major presents, we would likely split the cost, if consulted ahead of time.
" I don’t have the stomach for my H’s risk tolerance so I like to maintain my own investment account"
Is his account a margin account that allows short sales? One can easily lose way more than the principal in certain investment busts. The margin interest is usually comparable to that of a credit card. Just an FYI.