<p>oldfort - I’ve been thinking the same thing. I haven’t responded because I have a daughter who is very thoughtful - just figured I’m lucky. However, I do think boys are cut too much slack and it does them no favors. Waiting until college is a little late though to correct the rudeness. It needs to start when they learn to talk - “please and thank you.” It needs to continue through those years when it’s easier to give up. Remember that unappreciative sons make unappreciative boyfriends and husbands.</p>
<p>But see, that’s why it’s all so disconcerting–he had wonderful manners as a child and teen! We were always complimented by other parents, teachers, total strangers. I can see why you’d read all of these boy comments and think they’ve been indulged and rude behavior has been tolerated so a precedent has been set. If he’d lived here as an uncommunicative and unappreciative kid then I wouldn’t be so surprised and at a loss now. It may seem crazy that the NYU mom lets her kid set the rules because she’s afraid of pushing him farther away–but is it really that hard to understand? Can you lecture and punish someone into spending more time with you? You can’t parent an 18 year old young man the way you parented a 15 year old boy–and it’s a lot trickier than you’d think. If communication with males were so easy and effortless then all the women’s mags would be out of business.
It all sounds like the worst sort of gender stereotyping. In my case it also happens to be true. I think in this time of huge transition most of us are trying to tread lightly and move slowly. My s is on full scholarship so I can’t play the money card, but not entirely sure I’d want to because my mom did it all the time to me and it really did some damage to the relationship. That’s a tricky subject to use a leverage. </p>
<p>As my friend said on the phone tonight,“Oh, I’m so thankful I have a daughter!”</p>
<p>What type of behavior caused your mom to “play the money card”?</p>
<p>Helenback - if the basics are there, then I would think this is the result of this period of transition - of exerting independence - a “stage.” I don’t have any problem with backing off but I don’t have any problem with letting any of them know - boys and girls - when they’re being rude, even if our arsenal of leverage is all but empty. Part of it too is peer pressure - boys are a lot tougher on boys for any appearance of the apron strings or “mama’s boy.” You never even hear those terms used with girls.</p>
<p>Hey my son goes to NYU and loves the Palladium gym - in fact that is where he is doing all his work study (and will be there alot over winter break)
[NYU</a> Palladium Athletic Facility](<a href=“http://www.nyu.edu/palladiumathleticfacility/]NYU”>http://www.nyu.edu/palladiumathleticfacility/) this is state of the art. I can’t imagine this not being good enough for someone (it might not be convenient depending on where you live though)</p>
<p>So S just called as he walked to his Sushi restaurant. I asked about upcoming finals and a got lots of info about what he has to read/write and do before the semester ends. I love it when he talks to me! He always sends me his papers to read (not like I can critique them for content!) but he does appreciate it if I feel there is a grammar issue. I love the way he writes even when I have no idea what the subject is. That 3 minute call made my day and made me smile :-)</p>
<p>Posted by Helenback ~ "As my friend said on the phone tonight,“Oh, I’m so thankful I have a daughter!”</p>
<p>I have one of each, and they each have their strong points and less strong points (different in both of them), traits that I rejoice in and traits that drive me nuts - some probably related to their gender. But they are who they are. I’m glad I got to experience both. It kind of balances me out, lol!</p>
<p>I can relate Helenback. I’m sure all of these sons and daughters were raised to be courteous and well-mannered. I still get comments from other parents when they see my S around town when he is home: “What a nice young man. So personable.” And he is. Just not when he is wrapped up in the college bubble, far from home and thinking his insular surroundings are all that is important in the world. He does not say this. I infer it from his actions. I don’t think boys are given more slack. But we do need to recognize that boys and girls are different, especially in their relationships with their moms. My friend’s D calls her and shoots her camera-phone photos of outfits she is trying on for the winter formal. My son calls to ask how to launder the shirt he plans to wear to the winter formal. Which is that evening and which I had not heard about before.<br>
As for money leverage. I would not stop paying tutition. But his weekly money for food has stopped. He will be home for break before he even notices as it will only be two weeks and he has plenty of money from his summer earnings which is earmarked for books and his study abroad but will certainly cover anything he needs until we have our talk.<br>
Several posters, as sueinphilly and me, have noted our boys with their walking phone calls. It is an interesting study in behavior.</p>
<p>One major difference I’ve noticed between my son and my daughter. She’ll talk when nothing’s new. Small talk… she’s good at it. S, otoh, usually calls when there’s a reason. Like something good, or bad, happened at work, or about a sports trade, that kind of thing. When, in college, S didn’t call us as often as we’d have liked, we drew comfort from rationalizing that he wasn’t trying to be mean. Rather, it just didn’t occur to him to call us. It didn’t cross his mind. Which matched his sometimes ‘out of it’ personality. And we knew he was busy, and happy (very social kid).</p>
<p>Interestingly, as a middle aged man, I probably don’t call my parents as much as they’d like. My sister no doubt calls them every day, probably several times a day. My brother and I don’t. We love our parents (late 70’s) as much as sis does.</p>
<p>It’s all a question of degree. Beyond real rudeness–not acknowledging gift, hanging up on someone–most girls just tend to be more communicative than most guys. As 2331clk points out, girls are often better at small talk. Sons often don’t think we’ll be interested in details that girls love to recount when frankly most of us don’t care what they talk about, anything about their life at college interests us.</p>
<p>S2 came home for Thanksgiving and prompty got sick. He ate dinner and then went upstairs and slept all afternoon. When he woke up he was feverish and stuffed up. I was watching TV downstairs and I heard my cell phone ring with a text message. I looked at it, thinking maybe he had gone out without my noticing, and the message was “water, pls.” I took him some cold medicine and a bottle of water and teased, “You’ve got some nerve…” His response was, “I said please!”</p>
<p>Thread synopsys:</p>
<p>**Boys = Bad</p>
<p>Girls = Good**</p>
<p>No surprise coming from CC posters.</p>
<p>^^^ absolutely untrue. We will say that boys and girls are DIFFERENT.<br>
I think woman have come to that conclusion thru years of being parents and spouses. there is no denying it. We’re just sharing our experiences and providing support to one another. That is the point of this board, right?!</p>
<p>Toblin- I think you will have quite an argument from the mothers of sons on your postulate. As sueinphilly said: DIFFERENT is the word. My bet is that all the moms and dads posting here think their sons are great. We are just complaining a bit. In a way we hope will not hurt anyone, especially our children. But will allow us to express our selves in an unedited manner. Frankly this has been very freeing for me and cheaper than therapy. When you think about it, any parent on these boards is very supportive of their children, we all are way beyond college years and came across cc when we were trying to help our terrific kids get into the best college for them.</p>
<p>PS- the text from inside the house is too funny. Do you think his dormmates would have rushed in with water? It is nice to be needed and nicer still for our children to appreciate it.</p>
<p>busyparent–I probably shouldn’t even have mentioned my mother and the money card because she came from a wealthy family that used the money like a weapon–so she doesn’t have a normal attitude about it. I think it’s fine for parents who are paying thousands of dollars a year to point that out if their student needs the reminder–I just don’t have that option. </p>
<p>Geez Toblin! I don’t even know what that means! </p>
<p>O.K. My friend thinks I should wait until s is home, wait until after Christmas, and then just set him straight about returning phone calls and acknowledging packages. I know he needs to here it, but I also hate to have this bouncing around my brain for so long. So tell me what you think of this:</p>
<p>I took my two boys to a neighborhood Mexican restaurant last night and they gave us a calendar–which turned out to a have an artful drawing of a Mexican couple in a passionate embrace–and she is wearing a very diaphonous shirt–in other words–her nipples are somewhat visible. I opened it and laughed out loud because it’s just such a perfectly inappropriate thing to hand a woman with boys ages 13 and 9 sitting right there.</p>
<p>I knew my college boy would really appreciate the humor of this.</p>
<p>I was thinking I should send the care package and calendar, along with a funny note mentioning that while I understand he’s busy, he doesn’t live in a black hole, and therefore must respond when packages arrive or risk never getting any more semi-pornogrhaphic material from his mother. I thought if I kept it light I could still send the package–which I know he would like–but also get this annoyance off my chest. Then when he’s home we can talk about phone ettiquette.</p>
<p>I know he loves getting the food–but maybe overall the care packages are an unwelcome reminder that he’s not completely independent yet.</p>
<p>We are very different. I speak with my parents a lot more. My brother will call when he has something to say. But when he comes home to visit, now in his 40s, he will still tag along with my dad to help him fix things around the house. He’ll take my parents’ cars to get new tires or a new tune up (my SIL says he doesn’t work that hard at home). My dad will say to my mom, “Lets wait until (my brother) is home, he’ll help me with it.” It would be months before my brother is due for a visit. With Christmas just a few weeks away, my dad is counting the days.</p>
<p>Most parents on this board have put a lot of care and love into their kids. It just bothers me that some kids could unintentionally be inconsiderate to their parents. Both Jewish and Chinese parents are very good at making their kids feel guilty, maybe some WASPy parents should get some pointers from us.:)</p>
<p>Just as less can be more, bad can be good. S is coming back on Wed and he hasn’t asked for money all quarter long.:)</p>
<p>a while back someone mentioned sending a card with a check enclosed and the card says “have a pizza party on me”. Then asking (after much time had passed and if check remained uncashed), asking the kid about how he enjoyed the ‘pizza party’. </p>
<p>To the poster who wants to know WHEN to ‘confront’ son about unresponsiveness, I know it’s the first thing you want to say to him when he comes home, but don’t do it, yet. Find the perfect moment, like when kid is opening up about other things and mood is jovial, then ‘casually’ work lack of responsiveness into conversation.</p>
<p>When my S was in HS, we would often IM each other, him in the basement, me upstairs. He liked that better than me opening the basement door and shouting down to him.</p>
<p>curious77, I thought it was hilarious, too, and have saved it on my cell phone, along with a few other pithy messages that are so S2. The first time he came home for fall break, he REALLY wanted to come home. We had a 2 1/4 hr drive to the airport and he had a connection in Chicago with about a 55 mn. final leg. We tried to time our arrival with his but had to leave home while he was still in the air heading to Chicago. He texted us to say he was in Chicago, and we texted that we were about 1 1/2 hrs. from the airport. His reply, “Drive fast.”</p>
<p>I would not send him the calendar or anything. Definitely bring his communicativeness up after Christmas. We all need to be told if we are behaving like a jerk no matter how old we are, as long as it’s done non-confrontationally. Your paying or not paying for his tuition has nothing to do with it; you are a family and he has a responsibility towards you. When they were toddlers or teens behaving badly we had no hesitation in telling them; it should be no different now.</p>
<p>Confrontation should be done the same way you confront a restaurant manager over a terrible meal or terrible service-face to face. It’s much harder to ignore you when you’re in front of them.</p>