So it sounds like maybe in retrospect sports wasn’t a great experience for your Sports Son in particular. Obviously in retrospect, some decisions we make are not the best decisions, and possibly in retrospect, this was not the best decision by Sports Son.
But while I am sympathetic to your feelings about that, as I understand it, Sports Son is already admitted to both Texas and SMU. There are many, many kids in both the US and the world who will not have any opportunities for college at all, let alone two opportunities at such excellent colleges. And Sports Son is therefore in an excellent place to learn from whatever mistakes he might have made–as we all have to do–and live a great life from here. Which will involve more mistakes, but that’s OK.
So . . . maybe give Sports Son and yourself a little break on all this. His life is not over, it is just beginning. And while it may have not been perfect so far, perfection is not a reasonable goal.
And this is totally different than college admissions. I highly doubt your kid feels like his time was wasted. Maybe because I am old but I don’t regret any of the EC’s I did in high school. It made me who I am.
Sports twin deserves to go to a school that fits HIM.
Not sure I completely understood the impact this had on Sports Son’s schedule, but seems like it had a big impact. If so, the impact on rigor b course restriction seems like it may have made a difference. Did he play a sport every season? Otherwise, why would a fall sport require blocking of time in the spring? Agree with the others who said you need to give him and yourself a break. He will find his way, even if he had to major in something other than business or chose a different college.
My kids did different activities and all required a fair amount of time, mostly after school. Band son during the fall had practice very day, games, and competitions and was required to be in a music class. It was intense but he also did other ECs. Theater kid similarly had periods of time when he was at school until very late at night, especially during tech week and performance times. Sports kid had practices after school in season, and had to leave early a few times for games when the days got shorter. He also played on a travel team and did other ECs. We never thought that their ECs would get them into college (although it did help one).
It could be that even if Sports Son did debate, he might not have been as into it as Debate Son. He might not have developed the same skill set so that his essay would still not have been as polished.
The travel team coaches did not ever suggest that playing on the team was the path to a top college. Most of the kids did not even play in college, although my DC played Club and continues to play in an adult league. Loves the chosen sport.
I agree with a lot of what you’ve said in this post, and agree with a lot of the points you’ve made that align with some feelings I’ve had about the overemphasis of sports in college admissions, as well as the opportunity cost of kids doing sports at a high level. To bolster your point there, my own son started off high school doing two sports (and that was all he did) and when he decided to drop one, he was able to pick up two school activities that were incredibly fun, valuable, and -yes - helpful in college admissions. But, the first two benefits - the fun and value - are most important in my view.
But, I also think you’re beating yourself up a bit too much - it’s always pretty easy to look back on prior parenting decisions and think that things might have gone better if you went the other way. I do it all the time. But, first, you have no idea what might have happened had you put your foot down when Sports Son was recruited for the travel team and said “no.” First, I’m assuming he was all for it as well? If you intervened and said he couldn’t do it, he probably would have been resentful, damaging your relationship with him. There’s no guarantee that he would have chosen to do other activities like Debate Son - maybe he would have just continued on on the less competitive team and done nothing else, depriving him of the pride and accomplishment of achieving in his sport at a high level. From the way you’ve posted, it sounds like you feel this one decision was determinative of your kids’ two somewhat different paths in high school, when in fact, their own natures, talents, and inclinations were likely much more responsible than one decision about a travel sports team when they were eight! If both kids had done the travel team, or neither, they likely would still have had different paths and experiences in high school due their own innate differences.
But, to return back to your initial more overarching point, I’m sympathetic to the overall point of view that sports may loom a bit too large in our American school culture and in our kids’ lives, as the be-all, end-all for accomplishment, excellence, and future success. And, I think sports can lead to those things, but they can tend to overshadow other great and less publicly-acclaimed ways of achieving excellence and future success.
I can understand where OP is coming from, but even with twins there were probably more variables than just Sports or Debate. It’s impossible for us to say if that was the differentiator here. It’s also impossible to say if Sports son would have done well in a different extracurricular activity that he did not like as well and that would have made a difference. This is an n=1 sample size.
There are problems in youth sports, but I think it comes from this general idea of using extracurriculars as a means to an end versus a pleasant diversification activity for kids to enjoy as they grow up. I think the extreme focus on winning in sports leads to some of the observed behavior where coaches control too much and don’t allow the kids to fail and learn in doing so – that should be taken into account.
IDK, I get the urge to help your kids resume build, but it’s something that should be fought against IMO. I think giving kids a certain amount of freedom will lead to longer term success and healthier, happier adults, even if it means not optimization the college admissions process.
Also, I’m not picking on OP – I expect he’s just venting about what is a disappointing situation for Sports Son, which is super understandable. I’m just kind of piggybacking on one of the themes.
Yeah, I think my regret comes as much from his less-than-great high school experience as the effect it had on his college admissions process. Ironically, Debate Son is gay, but fortunately had a good social experience, with a big group of accepting and supportive friends, mostly from his extracurriculars, but Sports Son was the one who faced chronic low-key bullying from his supposed “friends”/“team mates”, including being mocked for having a gay brother.
Thanks for your kind words, you and everyone else who gave supportive feedback. My wife and I definitely stress to both my sons they should be proud of their accomplishments and not compare themselves to anyone, including each other, and they both have great options for next year already. I worry less about Debate Son, he already has so much confidence in who he is, so try to encourage Sports Son to not dwell on high school and think about how much bigger his world will get next year no matter which school he chooses, and with competitive sports behind him, and even rediscover his enjoyment of playing sports in intramural and club sports, while still having time to try new, different activities, and meet different kinds of people.
One other point mentioned I totally agree with is that a sport can lead to a better mental and physical health if one wants to play.
My son was on competitive teams from a young age. He thrived in them. We never felt he was going to play in college (did consider college polo). He played soccer (hated it one season and done). Ice skated for 4 years, baseball, football, basketball, archery, golf, polo and polocrosse.
Today he plays golf, handball and pickleball with his professors. He runs and stays healthy. Several of his classmates burned out in undergrad or professional school after years of pushing for the top academics and academic clubs from middle school on. He came in much more relaxed and thrived.
Know your student, know their limitations physically, put them in situations in which they thrive and don’t burn out no matter if it is sports, debate, art, dance, etc!
Sounds like the exact right message, and I am sure what is going to happen. In fact, I know various people who were recruited in their sport for college, and then either decided not to pursue those options and go somewhere else, or even voluntarily stopped once in college. And for so many it was a huge relief. Again, not to say that is all kids, but it sounds like your kid is well ready to be done with this, and I am very confident it is going to work out great.
Both kids got into the same schools, so seems like sports and debate were treated equally. Only difference is debate son got more scholarship money, but he also went to nationals in his EC, and sports son did not. Maybe that checked a box that allowed more scholarship money.
Hugs to the OP. Parenting is just so hard, and I think many of us are still waiting for the crystal ball showing us the best way forward. All you can do is your best at that moment in time, and I think you’ve done that.
As an aside, I grew up spending lots of time on ECs, swimming in particular. It was a part-time job and my high school USA coach would probably now be considered abusive. I was good, but no colleges were knocking on my door. But I was so burned out by HS. I wanted to quit, but didn’t want to be a quitter. So I quit when I went to college. To this day I can’t enjoy being in the water, and I could never have a coach again. (I did toy with the idea many times as an adult runner)
But do I regret doing it and staying with it? No. All experiences - good and bad - become part of who your are. You’re never going to get rid of all the bad. While I never expected or wanted my kids to be Olympic swimmers, it WAS important to me that they learned how to swim well. Except I live in an area where there isn’t an easily accessible program. So when mine were little and the tiny program we had was going under, I had the ability to take it up and do everything (and I mean everything) to get it running for several years. I taught many kids in my area how to swim well - all 4 strokes correctly. Some were even pretty fast. One was nationally ranked, though they came to me great. My biggest aim was for the kids to learn how to swim and have fun. And I think they did. And that would never have happened if I hadn’t spent all those hours in the pool. Unfortunately, once I quit, the program folded again.
Travel soccer is now part of your son - all of the good and bad. And the bad will hopefully make him stronger in the long run, or fade with time. Just don’t look back. Always forward.
P.S. Swimming also taught me more than the above. Grit in particular. Determination… Not minding getting up at 4am to get in your training because that’s the only time slot as a full time working mom!
Because we can’t predict the future, there is no decision that you could have made that would have guaranteed any particular outcome. We chose not to allow our kids to do travel sports until middle school, and then only local travel for a while. Our older chose to stick with only local-ish travel. This has likely hurt kid’s playing time on the school sports team, but it freed up time for other things in the summer (it took a lot of schedule-wrangling over the years, but kid just earned his Eagle scout). Kid is also homeschooled, which possibly also cuts down on playing time for the sport (he plays on a high school team), just because he gets less face time with the coach. But, the sport is a good experience. My younger is able to play on a competitive homeschool team for her sport, and the coach is affiliated with the same club where she plays travel ball, so everything aligns well. Same choices, but different circumstances that are all outside our control.
One quirk of homeschooling is that schedules are more flexible so it’s possible to do activities that might otherwise conflict. Both of my kids participate in Science Olympiad, and my older’s team has advanced to Nationals a few times. When we were there, the kids were talking with other teams and we learned that at schools that are truly competitive (the teams place in the top 5), the kids sign contracts committing to doing no other extracurricular activities. There is often a class period devoted to SO, and there are thousands of dollars invested as the kids fly around the country to competitions. By comparison, our families invest a few hundred dollars for hotels when we go to a couple of competitions within a 4-5 hour drive, and while kids are encouraged to come, most of our kids also play a sport, do theater, or play an instrument and sometimes have conflicts…and that’s OK. Same activity, but very different standards from one place to another.
All parents want what is best for their kids, but it’s impossible to predict the long-term ramifications of every decision. Maybe if my older had played on more competitive teams earlier he’d be a starter instead of a backup player due to years of better coaching. Or maybe he’d have quit, as many kids did after getting burned out. He probably would not have as many Science Olympiad medals. He probably wouldn’t have an Eagle, since the only way he was able to do the camping was because we would sometimes pick him up, run him to a ball game, and then take him back…only possible because the ball was local. But maybe he’d be playing ball in college. There’s no way to know, but kid did what gave him the balance he wanted at the time. For both kids, we sit down 2-3 times/year and talk about how everything is fitting together. Both kids have dropped and added activities over the years. None of it is done with an eye towards college admissions, although my older got lots of essay material from extracurriculars. I have no idea what helped with applications, but since some of kid’s schools didn’t consider anything but classes/grades/test scores we knew that at several schools the extracurriculars would have no effect, for better or worse.
I’m sorry you are dealing with a dissapointed kid. I hope college is a good experience for him - a lot of kids use college as a time to reinvent themselves and try new things, or do old things in a new way - and I hope that happens for him.
Part of it is, his high school uses a block schedule, where you go to most of your classes every other day, but because coaches want their athletes to have in-class practice every day, athletics is double blocked, ie two out of 8 classes on your schedule are athletics, every semester of every year. And basketball starts in late fall, so you have to be enrolled in athletics all fall semester, even before you make the team, and then the season continues into the spring semester. And then soccer is mostly spring semester.
I’m not saying Sports Son should have done debate, that was Debate Son’s thing. Sports Son always liked science, and is better at math than Debate Son, might have excelled at Mu Alpha Theta, but because of sports that wasn’t an option. And yeah even with Mu Alpha Theta his essays still probably would not have been as polished as Debate Son’s, but I think if he had pursued his love of science more deeply, he would have had a broader knowledge and interest base to write about. Unfortunately, sports teams do have a not completely undeserved reputation for not being the most intellectually-minded social groups in a school, and peer pressure can influence a kid not to develop a part of their identity that could subject them to ridicule.
Well, maybe it’s got something to do with being here in Texas, the “Friday Night Lights” culture invading all sports, I don’t think youth sports here in Texas has the healthiest mindset.
Please do not feel like you let SportsSon down. There is no crystal ball to say SportsSon would be happier had he had focused on academic ECs and there is no crystal ball to say that he would have had a different college admissions outcome.
It is time to take a deep breath and look at the big picture. It sounds to me like you have two happy, healthy, smart, well-adjusted sons. You have done a great job allowing each of your sons to pursue things that interested them. Both of your sons will go to college and move forward with their lives. You are blessed. There should be zero regrets. Be sure both boys know you are proud of them, you love them, and you are excited for their futures.
I think the issue here is not sports in general but the outsized influence that competitive/club sports have more recently had on sports. My kids all enjoy sports, but they just play them for enjoyment through school and have had time to explore other interests. I think people need to understand that most kids won’t get a full college scholarship from sports or go professional, so it’s important to understand that and have a balance.
I agree with all of the posters saying they let their kids do what they enjoy, but it also seems to me that what bothers you about your own kid’s sports experience is very much reflective of the culture of sports in the US (and I say the US only because I have no idea how sports are treated in the rest of the world).
From my perception, sports/athletics receive and seem to demand an outsized level of attention/resources/commitment compared to the benefits they impart. We have this weird culture where kids are pushed into very competitive programs very young, where exploration or just plain recreational play is difficult (if not impossible) by the time a kid is out of elementary school, and where high school culture revolves around athletes, while leaving kids in other activities unacknowledged and (sometimes) under-resourced.
And it’s all well and good to say that families can seek out less competitive leagues, until the competitive kids start using town or parish recreational programs for their “off season training,” and suddenly your fun skills clinic or rec team is dominated by kids who are dead serious about winning and don’t particularly care who gets hurt in the process (and whose parents are absolutely comfortable blaming the less-skilled kids for being in their own kids’ way). As a parent, I went out of my way to seek out recreational leagues for my kids, and in three separate sports over multiple seasons, that experience was a constant. Two of my kids decided to try again in middle school, only to learn that the school teams were highly competitive with no options for kids who just wanted to learn something new or play to be part of a team.
Meanwhile, in our local high schools, it seems that only athletics matter, at least as far as administration is concerned. I had thought it was only my kids’ school (our principal makes a point of attending as many sporting events as she can and shouts out athletes on the daily, but might possibly attend an arts performance once a year, if that), until I visited another school for their drama club production and found life-sized posters of senior athletes lining the halls. (do I even need to mention that there were no such posters for seniors in any other activities?).
I sound like a bitter sports-hater, I know. Trust that I am not – I do think it’s important to encourage kids to be active and to find joy in exercise. I love the concept of recreational sports and I appreciate what kids can learn from playing on a team. But I think we as a society sometimes act like sports are the only activity that matters, at least through college. And I think that’s regrettable.
Thank you for the kind words. In answer to your question about whether sports son was into joining the travel team and whether saying “no” would have damaged our relationship with him (my wife was less inclined than I was to let him), that’s where I struggle. Sure, he was excited, and wanted to be on it because some of his friends were also asked, but he was 8. There were all sorts of things that my sons wanted from time to time that my wife and I said no to, they were disappointed, I think we got an “I hate you!” once or twice, but they got over it. Even one of his friends who got asked, his parents didn’t end up letting him do it. I also feel like the choice to let him do it played a role in him and his brother growing apart, not being as close as they could have. Sure you want siblings to be their own people, and my brother and I (not twins) were close despite not having all the same interests, but I think there were enough overlapping interests that we could still relate to each other, despite even an age difference. I feel like with my sons, their worlds seemed to become rapidly different, to where they couldn’t relate, even before Debate Son came out. And I think Debate Son coming out as gay was harder for his brother to accept than it should have been, because there is still so much homophobia in boys’ sports, hence Sports Son being bullied by his teammates because of his brother’s sexuality.
This is exactly what I was going to say. My neighbor’s kid is throwing fastballs at an ivy. High achiever in sports, average to slightly above average in academics. @TwinDadinTex both your sons sound like great kids. Simply put, your sports son is not a recruited athlete for a revenue sports. If he were, I can guarantee that he would have received a lot of financial love.
As they say, the only perfect vision is 20/20 hindsight (and that probably isn’t perfect either).
Please don’t go down the rabbit hole of second guessing your parenting choices. You can’t live life over and over taking different paths to determine the optimal outcome. All you can do is make reasonable choices and move forward.
Again, to me it sounds like you have two wonderful sons who will both find their way and do great.
Your kids sound great and you sound like a great dad… they’re in good shape. Enjoy these last few months with them at home!
My S23 was a pretty good soccer player but didn’t play on his high school team b/c he thought there were a lot of jerks on the team. He liked his travel team, so just did that. I can totally see how being on team with less than supportive teammates would be a downer.