<p>Past history of being a bigot duly noted, but if the grandmother is saying “Isn’t it a shame grandaughter won’t be getting married in a church?” she may have come to accept the marriage and like the young man, but be focused on the ceremony. It’s not clear to me that this particular remark means that she views the groom’s religion negatively, only that she views her granddaughter not getting married in a church negatively.</p>
<p>If she says this over and over again, you can remind her that everyone already knows her views on church weddings and that if she continues to repeat this it will likely get back to the couple and be destructive to her relationship with them.</p>
<p>True, roshke. The fact is that the young woman may well not share the religious beliefs of the rest of her family. In fact, it seems likely.</p>
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<p>Some years ago, I was amazed when a coworker who belonged to a Conservative temple told me that grandchildren of members were not recognized if their mother wasn’t Jewish. They had some sort of congratulatory ceremony for those with “approved” grandchildren. Yes, I know that Jewishness passes through the mother and all that. But the sheer pettiness of deliberately ignoring the birth of some grandchildren while celebrating others stunned me.</p>
<p>OP stated in her first post
"When my mother makes comments in a disparaging tone about the groom’s religion, another niece, the bride’s cousin, will say, “Don’t say that, Grandma, it’s anti-semitic.” </p>
<p>it seems clear from this post that this is not simply her commenting on the wedding…but about the groom’s religion</p>
<p>Your niece is absolutely doing the right thing. When people we love say things that are overtly offensive to most people, we really should do the kind thing and gently let them know those comments are not socially acceptable in the world we live in today.</p>
<p>Consolation, Non- Jewish people can’t receive Torah honors or even stand on the bimah in some Conservative congregations, but I’ve never heard of something like you describe unless you are referring to a bar mitzvah, where only the Jewish family members, for example cousins, can participate ritually.</p>
<p>I am with roshke, I have never heard of something like that. </p>
<p>I did however had to exclude my nephew from honors at my son’s bar mitzvah, because he was not Jewish (his mother is not Jewish). I personally did not care, but the synagogue did. </p>
<p>However, it is really not that different if I decide to attend catholic mass and then is asked not to receive communion. Rules are rules. If people want join religious activities of the religion they don’t belong to, they should convert.</p>
<p>How old is Grandma? If she’s not super old and senile, then she’s not too adle-brained to learn how to behave.</p>
<p>BTW…seems to me that the bride has chosen not to marry in the Church. We’ve had several Catholic/Jewish weddings in our family and a good number have been in the church. this isn’t a new thing.</p>
<p>I am guessing that Consolation is referring to a “naming ceremony” in a Conservative synagogue? Or perhaps a congratulatory message to a family celebrating a bris?</p>
<p>It is also my understanding that if the couple were to announce their intention to raise their children as Catholics, a church wedding would be permissable. Someone on this board must have the answer to this one.</p>
<p>Also, our family has a few elders who find mixed marriages objectionable, but they seem to know when to keep their mouths shut.</p>
<p>If the children are not Jewish, then there is no bris or naming ceremony. It is reserved for those who belong to that religion. As I stated before, if you don’t practice certain religion, then you should not expect to participate in religious activities.</p>
<p>is also my understanding that if the couple were to announce their intention to raise their children as Catholics, a church wedding would be permissable. Someone on this board must have the answer to this one.</p>
<p>The catholic bride or groom is asked if they intend to raise the children Catholic. I think the non-Catholic bride or groom is told of the other’s intention. The non-Catholic bride or groom isn’t asked (anymore…they used to have to sign a paper).</p>
<p>Consolation, wow. Just wow. Foolish on so many levels. More and more, conservative synagogues are finding ways to welcome intermarried families because it’s how you get people involved with the community, sometimes to the point of conversion. </p>
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<p>These are home ceremonies, so it’s entirely the family’s choice. As for the children “being” Jewish: Reform uses patrilineal descent and intent to raise the children to be Jews. Orthodox is strictly matrilineal, sometimes with strict requirements about the mother’s conversion if she was not born Jewish. Conservative is all over the map. Mohels (the people who perform ritual circumcision) are generally more inclusive than not.</p>
<p>I no longer recall the precise nature of the thing from which non-Jewish grandchildren were excluded, but I do know for certain that it wasn’t a bar mitzvah or a bris. It was some means by which that congregation acknowledged the birth of members’ grandchildren. Specifically grandchildren. The parents didn’t need to be members. I <em>think</em> it involved some kind of mention in a service, not an established ritual that would obviously be reserved for Jews, such as the bar mitzvah or bris. It is possible that it wasn’t in a service, but in a congregational newsletter. The general point of the thing was apparently to recognize the joy of grandchildren…but only Jewish grandchildren counted. That’s why it seemed so needlessly mean to me.</p>
<p>Despite to what I wrote previously, I do understand where you are coming from. I did not have a good time having to tell my SIL that her son cannot participate in honors. </p>
<p>That being said, I also understand where the synagogue was coming from. The lifecycle events are important in Judaism, so it is understandable that they wanted to only announce those events for members of Judaic faith. It is really not a birth announcement, but announcement of a lifecycle event.</p>
<p>Being born is part of grandchildren lifecycle.</p>
<p>Judaism and the Jewish people embrace key moments in our lives, moments of transition that mark both an ending and a new beginning: ** A child’s ** birth or naming, a son or daughter becoming bar or bat mitzvah, a couple’s marriage, one’s conversion to Judaism, or a member’s passing.</p>
<p>lerkin, the only religious official needed for a brit milah is a mohel, and there are certainly mohelim who will work with families that want a brit for their son, even if the child doesn’t meet the orthodox definition of being Jewish. </p>
<p>No religious official is needed for a brit banot/naming ceremony for a daughter. </p>
<p>Big difference between having a non-Jew (as defined by the congregation) not take part in a religious ceremony and not acknowledging that a baby has been born. Being born isn’t a religious ceremony. :)</p>