Everything You Know Is Wrong

College Majors Theater/Drama Majors
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<p>I feel the need to issue a warning to rising seniors and their parents who are looking into a serious auditioned theatre program: Everything you know is wrong.</p>

<p>Last year when this process began for my actor son, I thought I knew all about applying to colleges. After all, I attended a selective university myself, and later in life I actually worked in the admissions office at another selective university. The guidance counselors at my son’s high school had been sending out monthly newsletters on the subject. The testing services had been spamming us for years. </p>

<p>What I thought I knew: The most important factors would be the “holy trinity” of college applications, namely grades, test scores, and curriculum. What’s the GPA, how are the SAT scores, how many AP classes? Then there are recommendations, extra-curricular activities, and application essays. Maybe an interview, either on campus or through an alumni network. I thought I knew that you can make a fair prediction about what’s a “safety” school based on the published statistics. I thought I knew that the Ivy League schools are the most difficult to get into.</p>

<p>For the overwhelming majority of college applicants, that’s how it all works. </p>

<p>For theatre students? Not so much. </p>

<p>You won’t get appropriate advice from the guidance counselors or the e-mails from the Educational Testing Service. Chatting with the other parents in the PTA won’t help you either. You’ll find that your experience will have virtually nothing in common with the process everyone else is engaged in. </p>

<p>There are a few books that can help you – perhaps others can recommend some. Sometimes the school drama teacher can help, though not as often as you might think. You might know local theatre professionals. Also, there are coaches who do this for a living.</p>

<p>For me, the #1 source of information and support has been College Confidential. This forum and the Musical Theatre forum can be your friends and your lifeline. Read and read and read. Don’t post clueless questions on subjects that have been exhaustively discussed on multiple occasions. Realize that everyone has biases and agendas, and keep an open mind about everything you read, and note the dates of posting because things change every year, and check everything with the school websites. Don’t ask people to “chance” you, because with auditioned theatre programs, there’s no such thing. Don’t ask “what’s the best school,” because there is no answer to that.</p>

<p>This time next year, you’ll be a pro. But what can you do with all that hard-won expertise? Why, dispense advice to others here on CC, of course!</p>

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<p>Great post, Prodesse. :)</p>

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<p>Thank you for this thread, prodesse. I think it is very timely. I’ve been reading CC since February and I agree it’s invaluable.</p>

<p>Because the “holy trinity” of my D is not very impressive (at least in comparison to her former classmates), I am extremely nervous. In fact, I have already went through all the stages (denial, anger, bargaining, depression etc) and finally accepted the outcome that my D will not get into a University this year and will take a gap year. My D is very excited about the upcoming process though. Especially about the auditions.</p>

<p>What you say gives some hope that she is right and I am wrong. Maybe the parents who became pros by now will share their feelings. What is the “holy trinity” or “2-4-5nity” for our rising seniors whose dream is theater?</p>

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<p>I, too, would have been so stressed about college if the only factors influencing my son’s future were grades and GPA. His mediocre academics do limit his choices, but at least he can try to win some school over with his audition. All this I learned from CC . . .</p>

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<p>Based on what I read over the past year, the kids who are entering BFAs this fall run the total academic gamut. There are National Merit scholars with tons of APs, and there are students with sky-high SATS and 3.0 GPAs, and just about every combination. </p>

<p>There’s just about every combination, also, in terms of what the schools want. Some schools have an “academic admission” process that is completely separate from the audition for the theatre program. </p>

<p>There are great schools for theatre, very highly regarded in the industry, that you otherwise might never have heard of, such as Ithaca and Otterbein and SUNY-Purchase. They may not be very selective at all, academically, though fiercely so for the BFA. </p>

<p>And there are schools that are very selective academically, but not as much for the theatre department, such as Carnegie Mellon University, where theatre is part of the arts conservatory and isn’t included in the GPA/SAT statistics for the university. CMU is one of the most difficult to get into by audition.</p>

<p>Then there are schools like NYU and Michigan, that do pay attention to grades and scores.</p>

<p>I think you will find a number of threads on CC about schools that don’t have high GPA/SAT requirements, but are terrific for theatre.</p>

<p>Rumor has it that Juilliard doesn’t even care if you’ve graduated from high school!</p>

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<p>A bit of a tease-very little advice about what to do right (For theater majors)?</p>

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<p>Sosomenza, there are lots and lots of threads on this forum about what to do right for theatre majors. Part of Prodesse’s point was that many people don’t know to come here and really read through the posts and learn.</p>

<p>I would say the Holy Trinity for students applying to auditioned theatre programs is: the Audition, the Audition, and the Audition.</p>

<p>One might also say that three very important elements are:</p>

<p>-Some degree of prior training and/or experience.
-Choosing great monologues and preparing them well (some students use coaches to help with both these things).

  • The best audition possible.</p>
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<p>Great post prodesse, and even better title. Who could not read the thread with a title like that?
The first time I found cc I think I read straight for about 6 hours!
I’d add to the important elements and say that the interview that goes along with the audition is also important. Every second in the room is probably important!
Ok kids, no stress there…</p>

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<p>No teasing was intended!</p>

<p>What to do right now? Research. School research, and monologue research.</p>

<p>Make a list of possible schools, read about them, and make a spreadsheet with the basic info. When we did this, our columns included such elements as:
BFA or BA
Auditioned or not
Common App or not
Application deadline
Audition requirements
Pros and cons
Tuition
Distance</p>

<p>Then you start narrowing down the list to decide where to apply. Many BFA applicants apply to a dozen schools or more. We started with that many but dropped a few along the way. You can use the same spreadsheet to track the progress of the applications.</p>

<p>A lot of schools use the “common app” but some still have their own unique applications. We also found that all my son’s “common app” schools had unique “supplements” so it didn’t save as much work and hassle as we might have hoped. There’s also an “arts supplement” that is an optional part of the “common app” that some schools want.</p>

<p>Meanwhile the student needs to be working on application essays and, most importantly, monologues. As you will see when you do your research, a whole arsenal of monologues will have to be prepared. Classical, contemporary, Shakespeare, one-minute, two-minute, dramatic, comedic, every possible combination. To make it more difficult, they want the monologues to be age appropriate. Do you know how few decent monologues there are for teenage boys? Monologue selection is a huge, huge, huge chore. There is not much the parent can do to help with this. It’s an extremely personal choice. A coach of some kind can be helpful. Most kids do not want their parents to coach them with their monologues. In fact, many of the BFA parents I know have never heard their kids’ audition monologues.</p>

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<p>Beautiful post. I am also really grateful for all the information and support from this board over the past year. We are leaving tomorrow to drive my son to Roosevelt and embark on the next stage of this crazy, unpredictable process. No one who hasn’t gone through this has any idea what they’re getting into, and my sense is that the crazy (and intermittently wonderful) stuff continues, as long as our kids are on the stage.</p>

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<p>I absolutely love the provocative title of this thread and the content of the original post. Well said prodesse.</p>

<p>In the spirit of the provoking further discussion, here is something that you never hear in this forum and I expect to challenged for it: When it comes to college admission, prospective theatre applicants in some ways have things easier than most. The very nature of auditioning means that college evaluators get a rare and personal glimpse at a prospect’s skill set within the context of their chosen major. It’s among a handful of college majors where you get the chance to show your stuff as part of the admission decision. And on top of that many theatre programs are willing to relax their reliance on the academic assessment as a primary admission criteria – a relief that is seldom afforded other applicants to other majors.</p>

<p>I speak from recent experience just two years ago when I went through the whole audition admission thing with my older child. Things went well and there were many choices in the end and I have absolutely no idea if her variety of options had more to do with being a good student or talent. I’ll never know. Neither will the poor student who ends up with few options or the poor student with lots of options or the good student with no options. Or any combination along either spectrum. It’s useless to speculate.</p>

<p>I’m also the parent of a rising senior and back in it. He’s not a theatre major. You know what? I wish there was a personal mechanism similar to an audition for him to be evaluated in his chosen path. For the most part, there isn’t. You don’t get to demonstrate your ability to split atoms, or launch a successful business or engineer a more fuel efficient car or research ancient biblical text in depth. Schools kind of just have to hope that by virtue of your grades and other academic achievements and essays that you have an affinity for that stuff and go from there. There is no audition for any of those pursuits nor for the undeclared and little if any forgiveness for lackluster academic performance at top programs in those fields and many others. </p>

<p>So sure, the auditions are a pain and perhaps make admission less predictable by traditional academic standards but by the same token, prospective theatre majors are so fortunate that the effort is made by the colleges to take a close look at their ability in their chosen field. I suggest looking at it as a big advantage and something to embrace rather than something to dread. It won’t ease the burden of the work to prepare, but it might ease the stress.</p>

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<p>actually, halflokum, there are plenty of ways applicants in other areas get a chance to be judged on the basis of other talents. Recruited athletes. Arts supplements. EC accomplishments – for the most selective schools, that’s often what will give the edge to admissions. Research achievements. Writing awards.</p>

<p>For schools that do holistic reviews, they are looking very carefully at the whole picture and students do get to make the case for their particular talents.</p>

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<p>I think I would prefer to deal with the “normal” admission process that has certain logic and certain rules. Or maybe it would be easier for me and parents like me but not for the future artists.</p>

<p>My D gave me her artistic essay. My first reaction was-- this is awful! No structure, no reasoning, no sequence. Lots of feelings and lots of pictures, tons of small details that are not needed at all. </p>

<p>I wanted to go over it with her but then I thought-- I just read on CC that everything I know about the admission process is wrong. People recommended me not to hear my D’s monologues because it may do harm not help. Do you think it applies to the essays too? Anyone got a feeling the theater BFA admission has a different criteria when evaluating essays and personal statements? </p>

<p>I am just scared now that I will give my D my opinion and then her essay will look like one for a law school, not for a BFA in theater. Any advise?</p>

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<p>Great post and I loved the title. It sure made me open it. Fortunately, my D goes to a performing arts high school so I would hope that the counselors would be of more help to her than at a traditional high school AND the school has an honors only curriculum. Students are asked to leave if their grades are not up to par (it’s a magnet school that you apply and audition for in order to get in). The holy trinity is still in play to a certain extent. What I am finding out is that after all these years as a stagemom going through the audition process and thinking college auditions would be more of the same, I DON’T KNOW JACK!! It’s like a whole 'nother world and language! CC has been SO helpful. I have learned so much in the the few weeks I’ve been on here.</p>

<p>So for all those parents who were in our shoes a year ago, if at all possible, please continue to share and chime in when you can. I’m going to need all the help I can get!!</p>

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<p>Not actingmom- Your daughter should have someone proofread her essay for grammatical or spelling errors. Also, if her order of ideas is making it difficult to understand her point, the proofreader should make general suggestions about how to re-arrange the piece for better understanding. If you do this hopefully the essay will still have her “voice,” yet not have any errors which would reflect poorly on her. Good luck!</p>

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<p>I was not impressed with my daughter’s essay and did not say a word, but handed it to a close friend who writes a lot and reads all sorts of resumes… for her work. Her blunt words, “This has none of the passion of your daughter.” spoke volumes and so nights before the essay was due, she began again, and it rang true, and she got in. BUT it was not the essay that did it… in the end as NJMom said, it is the Audition baby…</p>

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<p>Everything you know about essays is still valid, just their place in the hierarchy is different. If a student is applying to a lot of schools, some will pay more attention to the application essays than others. </p>

<p>It’s almost always a good idea to get someone to look over the essay. Some kids will even be fine with it being the parent! But these are young adults on the brink of independence, and parental authority can be unbearable, and just set everybody up for a power struggle.</p>

<p>At my son’s high school they worked on application essays in English class.</p>

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<p>Well, this is pretty much what I have been saying here on cc for as long as I have been participating.</p>

<p>It’s sometimes a struggle because so many parents have been indoctrinated by the “cult” of the “holy trinity” that they cannot believe it might not be true. But for many students it simply isn’t. Theatre students are one example. Another example that I discuss in another forum on cc is foreign universities, who can have completely different criteria.</p>

<p>I remember the stress I had as a young person trying to deal with the “holy trinity”. And the belief (drilled into me by my parents) that if these numbers dropped too low, my life was over. I couldn’t handle the stress, and so I dropped out of school.</p>

<p>I don’t want to see other young people go through what I went through. That’s why I try to tell people that there are MANY MANY alternatives to the “holy trinity”.</p>

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<p>For the non auditioned BA theater programs…are the requirements not as stringent?</p>

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<p>For non-auditioned BA programs, the “holy trinity” still apply.</p>