<p>Buying a beer and getting on a plane are not constitutionally protected rights.</p>
<p>The fact is that voter fraud – i.e., imposter voting – is [virtually</a> nonexistent](<a href=“In 5-Year Effort, Scant Evidence of Voter Fraud - The New York Times”>In 5-Year Effort, Scant Evidence of Voter Fraud - The New York Times). A miniscule number of cases is not a good enough reason to raise hurdles for millions of people who only wish to exercise their constitutional right.</p>
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<p>True, of course, the US population is big, but it is only 4-5 times greater than in the big European countries (UK and Germany). In most countries, police very rarely kill people. </p>
<p>For example:</p>
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<p>(<a href=“http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/01/opinion/ghitis-police-shootings/index.html”>http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/01/opinion/ghitis-police-shootings/index.html</a>)</p>
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<p>In my state a study found that with voter ID implemented up to 300,000 people would be disenfranchised. This includes a lot of elderly people who live in rural areas and have voted for 50 years or more without needing an ID. (And as saintfan said, they may not have their birth certificate or understand how to replace it. Plus, there’s a cost.) Not everyone needs to buy beer or take planes, but if they do and they don’t have ID, well–they’re out of luck. They DO need their right to vote protected. </p>
<p>Busdriver, I don’t want to derail the thread, but your comments on voter ID, while perhaps true for your own state, are completey untrue for most states with such laws. Airlines and banks are only interested in making sure you’re who you say you are. My mom didn’t drive after the age of 85, but she opened a bank account and took several airline flights with her expired driver’s license. Voter laws usually are not intended to identify the person, they are intended to make voting difficult for a certain segment of people. That’s why an ID card held by a 20-year employee of a state or federal agency doesn’t meet the law, but hunting licenses do. Expired drivers’ licenses don’t meet the law. Her expired passport doesn’t satisfy those laws. Everyone else, including banks, airlines, everybody, accepted her expired passport, but these voting laws don’t. </p>
<p>I have voted without ID my whole life. I have lived in precincts where the election workers knew me and others where they didn’t. You go up to the table, state your name and address, and they look you up in the voter rolls. As they issue your ballot, they check off your name and write the ballot number beside it.</p>
<p>So for someone to commit voter fraud, they’d essentially have to know the details of a person in that precinct. They could show up and say “I am Jane Smith” and hopefully remember the address they were pretending to live at. When the real Jane Smith came along, she’d find that someone had voted in her place and have to report the fraud. BUT THIS NEVER HAPPENS. Why would anyone commit a felony crime for the very small personal benefit of casting a vote?</p>
<p>Now I don’t remember if it was this thread or the other one, but for the record it was the officer who radioed in the Cleveland shooting who said that the 12 year old victim was “maybe 20” - I had thought earlier that it was the original 911 caller.</p>
<p>You need a Washington State Driver’s License of valid photo ID card from the WDL office. In order to get that you need proof of residence, SS #, and identification documents which can be found in the link provided.</p>
<p><a href=“WA State Licensing (DOL) Official Site: Proof of identity required to get a driver license or ID card”>WA State Licensing (DOL) Official Site: Page not found;
<p>“I have voted without ID my whole life.”</p>
<p>Same here. You are not required to show ID in NY. You just give them you name and sign the book next to it. </p>
<p>You do have to show some form of ID to register to vote, but it’s been a long time since I had to do and I don’t remember what type of ID was needed. Possibly only something like a bill showing your name and address. I probably used my DL since I have had one since I was 16. </p>
<p>If you do not have a WDL or official ID card you must show up in person or mail in your identifying documents. After you are registered you are presumed to be who you say you are. There is a signature match process and verification. When vote by mail started I was contacted for verification.</p>
<p>At any rate . . . my original point was that many of us (myself included) coast along without realizing some of the institutional stumbling blocks that others face. I had a little window into that with my judge/trooper encounter as others have had with voter verification in recently in some states. It doesn’t really resonate until it happens to you.</p>
<p>7 years after my father passed away, he was reregistered to vote. He was registered in the opposite party from what he had been registered for over 50 years. There’s no voting fraud–yeah, right.</p>
<p>As much as I would enjoy discussing voter fraud, we are distinctly off-topic.</p>
<p>“7 years after my father passed away, he was reregistered to vote. He was registered in the opposite party from what he had been registered for over 50 years. There’s no voting fraud–yeah, right.”</p>
<p>Did someone go to the polls, pretending they were your father and vote in his name? </p>
<p>OK, back on topic. Here’s another irregularity (that’s the kind word) of the Ferguson grand jury:</p>
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<p>[Missouri</a> atty. general admits Ferguson grand jury was misled](<a href=“http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/lawrence-odonnell-missouri-atty-general-admits-ferguson-grand-jury-was-misled/]Missouri”>http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/lawrence-odonnell-missouri-atty-general-admits-ferguson-grand-jury-was-misled/)</p>
<p>And if you believe that was a <em>mistake</em>, then I have a bridge I’d like to sell you.</p>
<p>That’s irrelevant since it’s not the law they applied. And, the 1985 SCOTUS ruling modified it slightly but didn’t change anything as it pertains to this case, so I wouldn’t call it a mistake but what the assistant DA told the grand jurors was the plain and simple truth. On voting, I have never understood this business about getting an ID to be some insurmountable challenge targeting a particular ethnic group. especially, at a time when there is a hyper-awareness of non-citizens roaming around why wouldn’t we check? I don’t get this. </p>
<p>I hope all those without valid ID’s never need to by Sudafed. BTW…in CA if you stop driving or simply let your license expire it’s a snap to get a CA non-drivers license ID. Both my parents did just that. No idea how it works in other States.</p>
<p>When someone states ‘this class of people, this type of person, this race’ is unable to get an ID do they not realize how demeaning this is? Really, some classes of people are to dumb, low functioning, unaware, too incapable of working through this problem. Even with all the help that’s available…well…THAT is certainly a racist, classist, elitist attitude.</p>
<p>It is a snap for me to do things like that because I live about 2 miles from a big, new DOL location, I drive and I have a work schedule that allows me to do things like this in the middle of the day. Even if I had to take a bus I live 2 blocks from a bus line in a city/county with pretty good mass transit. I also have the $$$ in my account to write a check. My kids are nearly grown up and don’t need to be with me for safety. I do not have any personal mobility challenges. My official birth certificate is readily at hand. No need to order a new one from the County Records Department. It would be just a breeze for me.</p>
<p>“That’s irrelevant since it’s not the law they applied. And, the 1985 SCOTUS ruling modified it slightly but didn’t change anything as it pertains to this case, so I wouldn’t call it a mistake but what the assistant DA told the grand jurors was the plain and simple truth.”</p>
<p>Wow, I am surprised you are more of an expert on this law and what the DA did than the Missouri Attorney General who said:</p>
<p>Quoting from the article LasMa posted:</p>
<p>"Missouri Attorney General Chris Koster (D) admitted that the grand jury in the Darren Wilson case was given misleading information regarding the use of deadly force by police, MSNBC host Lawrence O’Donnell reported on Wednesday.</p>
<p>“Among the problems that Ferguson has brought to light is the need to update Missouri’s use of deadly force statute,” Koster said in a statement read by O’Donnell. “This statute is inconsistent with the Supreme Court’s holding in Tennessee v. Garner. Consequently, it is important this statutue be amended by the Missouri legislature to incorporate the Garner decision to avoid confusion in the criminal justice system.” </p>
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<p>No, it is not. My son lost his CA id (again). To get a new one, he has to take half a day off from work to go to the DMV; DMVs in our area are not open on weekends. He has to wait in a long line, even if he has an appointment, and the first appointment is weeks from now. It’s probably at least half an hour each way by bike. He has to produce identification. And he has to pay 28 bucks. None of these things are a “snap” for a person who has no car.</p>
<p>It’s not a snap for me either but it’s also not an insurmountable challenge. I also have to get my car smog checked for no good reason really in the next week. It sucks, but somehow I will get it done.</p>
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In many families (even extended), one person does the majority of the shopping. That means only one person needs an ID.</p>
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It has nothing to with any of those. It has to do with being poor. It has to do with working the kind of jobs that don’t give time off when the DMV is open. It has to do with limited transportation options and lines that make getting a license or ID an all-day affair. It has to do with people who are so busy working multiple jobs that it is easier to ask the person with the car to pick up the Sudafed than it is to go get your own ID so that you can have them drive you anyway because you don’t have a car. It has to do with being so caught up in getting by that you don’t realize that your otherwise unneeded photo ID has expired until it is too late to replace it in time to vote.</p>
<p>Have you been really, really poor? Have you been on assistance? Had to ration money amongst food and rent and gas and heat and medications? Had to ration time between multiple part-time, no-benefits, utterly unforgiving jobs?</p>