<p>Several threads recently have weighed the issue of whether the right “fit” is worth the cost of a selective private college. In another thread, I mentioned that finding the right fit for a high-achieving student comes at a cost – some people seemed to agree with this. I know that S1 is thriving as a freshman at his selective, expensive school. Would he have adjusted as well to the very large public university in our state – one that we could have more easily afforded? Maybe. We’ll never know. But as we face the prospect of repeating the process with S2, I know we’ll do whatever it takes to make sure he ends up in the right growth medium for him. </p>
<p>To me, nearing the end of the child raising process, I feel that raising these bright, but somewhat high-maintenance kids has been more difficult than it has been for some of my friends. They’re not geniuses, by any means – please don’t think I’m boasting. But the emotional issues always seem to be harder with bright kids. An article on gifted kids mentioned a mom who said something like, “my child feels that anything worth doing is worth doing to excess.” That sure sounds familiar to me. What do you think? Is it harder for find the right fit for gifted kids? Or am I just having a bad day with S2?</p>
As Dizzy Dean once said, “It ain’t bragging if you can do it.” Yes, they’re hard to raise, they’re high maintenance, and they absolutely benefit from everything you can throw at them, including an amazing college experience. I don’t think it’s harder to find the right fit…you have a pretty good idea of what the right fit is…it’s just a challenge to keep them on the right track. The right track being that which causes them to utilize–and more importantly, realize–their gifts.</p>
<p>I am unclear what you mean. Whether it is an IVY or LAC or State school most have an honors track and if you have a high achiever one would think you also had the option of merit money at some schools. I am not a parent so perhaps this discussion about intangibles but I don’t think that finding a school for a high achiever is any more difficult and probably easier. A student in the top 1% of the population is not that hard to place…really now.</p>
<p>I’m really talking more about emotional/subjective issues. I agree that a motivated, bright student can do well academically almost anywhere, particularly in an honors college. But I’m wondering if others feel that an intense kid (which usually is a corollary to giftedness) will be happy or feel at home in such an environment. I’m beginning to think that this side of the equation will be even more important with S2,who is academically bright, but maybe a little more creative than S1. I think the wrong environment – too large, kids who don’t share values or interests – will not help him to become the person he’s meant to be. It just seems harder to me.</p>
<p>Autistic kids are intense…I just don’t get what your issues are. That’s okay I just have been in programs with many “gifted” kids and not seen what you are worried about. I guess I have not much to add. Good luck in your search.</p>
<p>I see more clearly what you were driving at in the other thread. S1 was a more typical above average kid (if that is not an oxymoron) and therefore could have attended a large number of LACs throughout the country, some less expensive than the one he eventually chose.
S2 is more unusual and the range of schools that provided a fit was dramatically reduced. All LAcs were out. Only some state Us have great math departments (but he did not care for large universities). So the application process was in fact more anxiety-provoking for S2 than for S1.
He could not be happier than where he is now. While his suitemates are from diverse backgrounds, several share his academic interests and others share his non-academic ones. Without much effort on his part, he is among peers.
So, to answer your question, “fit” may be more important for gifted or unusual kids than for others.</p>
<p>I agree in a way. Certainly a lot of effort has been needed with our fairly bright, but extremely disciplined and determined D2. Now that D2 is off to college, I can finally sleep in on Saturday morning. For the past two years, Saturdays have started at 5:30 am in order to get the commuter train for Saturday music classes. Then there was the 7:30 pm pickup. Not my idea of the best way to spend 2 hours of my Saturday. Then there were 4 years of summer camps where the family vacation money went to the camp and our vacation was driving back and forth. Then too there were several weeks of college visits. Finally I wonder if I ever get to retire after the tuition bills.</p>
<p>This past weekend we visited D2 at college. It is clear that the whole process has been worth it. She is extremely happy and knows she is very fortunate to have this opportunity. She is making the most of it and working hard. She has all the stimulation and challenge she can handle. Would she be doing as well at State U? Unfortunately, I know the answer. State U is fairly mediocre with a poor environment for undergrad students. We know State U really well. D1 graduated from State U. She got a decent education and was reasonably content. D2 would be miserable there. She just needs a lot more.</p>
<p>Most parents in my neighborhood send their bright kids away to private high schools. I sent all my kids to a large, mediocre public high school with the intent of saving money to send them to good private colleges. </p>
<p>I’ve talked to students who have attended our state honors program and there is no comparison between their experience in the honors program and that of students at top private schools. For one thing, the level of academic challenge is not the same. There is no substitute for being surrounded by highly able and incredibly talented students both in the class room and out. Professors expect more of students at the top schools and students have to struggle more to meet those expectations. The private schools also have a more diverse student body and students bring more varied viewpoints into the classroom. I know from my own experience that having to compete with the best and the brightest inspired me to work harder and gave me a self confidence that I never would have developed at my state school.</p>
<p>For those who live in Michigan, Virginia, California, and a few other states, this does not apply. However, for the rest of us…</p>
<p>You are the only one who used the word “fragile.”</p>
<p>I think high maintenance fit better. Sjmon also mentioned that emotional issues could be harder. I would agree. My intense kid has a good outlook and disposition, but you don’t want to see angry and frustration when it does happen.</p>
<p>Selective private colleges also have honors programs. My D just called happy because she has a B- in honors calculus. I got so used to hearing about A’s that it took me a while to put it in perspective.</p>
<p>Quote from Cookiemom:
“I’ve talked to students who have attended our state honors program and there is no comparison between their experience in the honors program and that of students at top private schools. For one thing, the level of academic challenge is not the same. There is no substitute for being surrounded by highly able and incredibly talented students both in the class room and out. Professors expect more of students at the top schools and students have to struggle more to meet those expectations. The private schools also have a more diverse student body and students bring more varied viewpoints into the classroom. I know from my own experience that having to compete with the best and the brightest inspired me to work harder and gave me a self confidence that I never would have developed at my state school.
For those who live in Michigan, Virginia, California, and a few other states, this does not apply. However, for the rest of us…”</p>
<p>You should transfer this to the other thread entitled: “…schools where tuition fees are lower”</p>
<p>Every so often one of these threads crops up and some number of posters jump in to try to help the OP sort through some issue related to “gifted” children. I am always left with the same question: “what is a gifted child?”. Is there a test? I understand there are loose definitions. But, those definitions seem to cover so many kids and seem to indicate that gifted kids aren’t really rare (especially amongst the CC crowd). However, when I read these posts, I am left feeling like there is more to it…something more than a very bright child…something that is emotionally different. I am asking because I am really interested in understanding what you all consider gifted and why it seems to be beyond academic performance. Are these kids different emotionally? Are we really talking about the top 5%, top 2%, top 1% (I’ve heard all of these % used to define gifted - and wonder if we are talking about a %, is this based on a standardized test of some sort?) What if a kid perfoms in the top 1%, but isn’t emotionally impacted? Is that kid not gifted?</p>
<p>I remember an older thread on giftend children explaining that “gifted” is also a term for used for children who have learning differences which can make them perform below their grade level is some areas, which excelling in others (an imbalance). </p>
<p>I wonder if the term gifted isn’t ebing used too loosely and sometimes as a “catch all” for kids who aren’t average.</p>
<p>Maybe there was a thread that explained this and I missed it. If so, just point me there. If not, it might help for this term to be better defined so we all know what we’re talking about. These “gifted” kids seem to have very special needs that extend beyond a high-achieving environment. I’m trying to understand what and why.</p>
<p>momsdream, I would agree that the term gifted is used loosely. A definition probably would not fit my D. She is probably only in the top 10% for raw IQ, but in the top 1% for drive and determination. I only knew 1 person who was a genius and he was an emotional wreck.</p>
<p>I personally prefer to think of my S as having unusual characteristics. He is actually as emotionally well-balanced as anyone I could think of. His interest in math meant that we had to do quite a bit of research into appropriate classes, I had to do quite a bit of advocating, my H had to drive him every Sunday for classes… But then, if he had been an athlete or a musician, we would have had similar issues. So I don’t think of him as being more high maintenance than others.
There are various definitions of giftedness. You could start with hoagiesgifted.org, where there is also a discussion of dual exceptionalities.</p>
<p>If you’re defining “gifted” as the top 1% nationally, there are an awful lot of gifted kids out there–just by using the NMSF you’d get 16K for the top 1/2 of 1%, then you’d double that to get around 35000 “gifted” kids–just by the one measure, which leaves out music/art/sports, and the academically lopsided.</p>
<p>Some kinds of giftedness are easier for schools to accomodate than others. The mathematically gifted are often accelerated (as Marite points out quite accurately, while musically gifted students may have little trouble finding facilities. Some colleges seem to have entire student bodies of the “gifted”–CalTech’s class of all-800-SAT-math-scorers comes to mind–and yet even there some students do better academically and socially than others.</p>
<p>Finding the right fit for your kid seems to me to require a fair amount of self-knowledge, an unblinking judgemental look at the colleges, and a generous dollop of luck. But amazingly, most “gifted” kids–regardless of definition–do seem to find a community that works for them.</p>
<p>Its funny, my S is academically “gifted” (along with being intense, sensitive, picky and very funny.) My D is, academically speaking, closer to “high average” than gifted, but I often think she is the one who got more gifts. She is gifted with patience, moderate expectations, reasonableness, steady habits, and sweetness. </p>
<p>It is a little like the tortoise and the hare… BTW my not technically gifted D is doing fine (so far) in challenging classes at a hard LAC.</p>
<p>Marite, that makes sense and your son’s situation has always made sense to me - he is gifted in a certain area (math) and you had to find a program in which he could thrive and continue to build upon his talent for math. That makes sense. </p>
<p>I guess what I am confused about are the posts that seem to allude to the fact that the student is generally gifted and needs a special environment because the emotional issues are harder- and that got me thinking about the connection between emotional issues and giftedness. Perhaps the OP (sjmom) in this thread explained specific gifts in the other thread, which I didn’t read. But, I’ve seen more of the general “my child is gifted” threads before and always came away confused. </p>
<p>Then I read sjmom’s post where she wrote “I think “gifted” just means “more”. More questions, more abilities, more confidence, more self-doubt. Just more of everything, good and bad.” and that really confused me…as that sounded more like it was general, and not related to a specific talent. </p>
<p>I guess I’m just looking for a definitive answer on how one separates a high-achieving kid from a gifted kid. I assume a kid with a 4.0 gpa in a rigorous high school program and a perfect score on the SAT isn’t necessarily gifted. It sounds like if we’re talking about being academically gifted, a certain IQ test score and other characteristics need to be present…and being gifted may have nothing to do with academic performance or success. Rather, an intense interest and ease of ability in a specific area - measurable by more than performance in school and on standardized tests. </p>
<p>It is all very interesting. I’ll check out the website. Thanks marite, edad and dmd. Hearing the terms gifted used interchangeably with “bright” and “high-achieving” is making me think that either too many kids are being categorized a “gifted” (erroneously) OR more kids are “gifted” than we realize because we think they’re just really bright and interested.</p>
<p>SBMOM, how do you know that your Son is “gifted” and your daugter isn’t? Was your son tested in some way? Maybe I am over-analyzing this and it really isn’t scientific. But I wonder where a student crosses the line to being gifted and who decides.</p>
<p>Can you all tell I really want to know? Every time this comes up I wonder, but hate to sidetrack the parents who seem to be so desperately searching for answers. I just can’t stand not knowing how this works.</p>
Every time this comes up I wonder, but hate to sidetrack the parents who seem to be so desperately searching for answers. I just can’t stand not knowing how this works.</p>