Foreign Gig Fiasco

Parent Cafe
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<p>S2 is learning a lot about contract negotiations, if nothing else.</p>

<p>He is due to leave this Friday for an 8-day gig in Korea, and it has been nothing but trouble from the beginning. This has been a great lesson in many ways for him. About asking questions. Reading carefully. Holding firm.</p>

<p>On of the girls in his quintet is Korean, and her family is involved somehow with a non-profit agency in Korea. Last year, she performed at their annual convention. This year, they decided they wanted her whole quintet. She brought it up to the other kids last fall. It was to be an “all expense paid” trip to Korea. S2 said he was interested, but it depended on the dates because he would be applying to some summer programs. Depending upon what he got accepted to, and what dates they started, he may or may not be available. He was told certain dates, and planned his summer accordingly.</p>

<p>They kept promising the contract “soon.” It finally arrived in March, months after it was first promised. The contract promised airflight and hotel only. The kids were told to bring several hundred dollars for food and recreation. Some of the kids don’t have the money, and are frustrated that it was supposed to be “all expenses” back when they first agreed.</p>

<p>The dates were different from what they were originally told and conflicted with S’s plans. He wouldn’t sign it. They (S2 and the Korean girl) argued for a couple more months. He was the only one who didn’t sign right away, and she made life very hard for him. I think that she really, really wanted to go back to Korea, so wasn’t willing to hear anything negative.</p>

<p>It is very hard for S2 to be the “bad guy.” He would much rather trust everybody, and just hope for the best. He and I got into some difficult phone calls over it. He even visited the career office at Juilliard, to see if they had anyone who could help him understand the contract. All they did was commisserate, and agree that foreign contracts were difficult.</p>

<p>S2 finally told them he wouldn’t sign it until he was guaranteed that he would be flown directly to California on the day he needed to be there. He was eventually given the flight dates, and then signed.</p>

<p>The flights leave from NYC, so S bought a ticket to get back there the day the flight leaves. Then he got a call from the girl last week, telling him that the flight had changed, and they were leaving earlier. He got mad and told her that he wouldn’t be going then. Then she called and said the flight was moved back a day (from the original). She gave him the flight info, and it was exactly the same as what they’d originally planned! When he pointed this out, she said, Oops, I told you the wrong day the first time! She is an airhead. But she is the one who speaks Korean and who is their contact for the trip.</p>

<p>He told her he wouldn’t be going until he had positive confirmation of flights. She sent him confirmation numbers, but the webpage won’t let him on without a password or something, which he doesn’t have.</p>

<p>Then last night, one of the other kids who is going discovered that the contract, in one place, says hotel is paid for, and in another place, specifies the dates – which does not cover the first night they are there. So now they are all scrambling for a place to sleep their first night! The Korean girl, her mother, and the other girl are going to stay in a bathhouse. The boys aren’t interested. They don’t believe they’d be comfortable or safe. (The Korean girl plays piano, so she doesn’t have an instrument to protect!!!) They are frustrated at having to come up with still more money for their “free” trip. Being alone in a very foreign country (in Seoul), being separated from the only people who speak the language.</p>

<p>His cell phone will not work in Korea. The group is planning on renting one, but the mother of the girl will carry it!</p>

<p>My S has a few friends from school who are in Korea, whom he is asking for help from. </p>

<p>He is supposed to leave tomorrow, and we are very scared what else is going to happen! Mainly we are concerned about his horn being stolen, his flight home being cancelled, etc.</p>

<p>Although this is mostly vent, if anybody has any suggestions, I’d like to hear them!</p>

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<p>binx, this is really a hard situation, and I know that neither you nor your son want to be the bad guy, but - don’t go! There are way too many red flags thrown up here. If this is what is happening when you’re still on your own turf, what are they going to do when they’re in Korea and the girl says, “Oops, we meant that you’d pay for the hotel and we’d reimburse you” or “You have to figure out how to get from the airport to the hotel and you have to pay for it” or she’s not there to translate Korean for them, or a dozen other things that could go wrong? The girl has proven that she’s duplicitous and out only for herself - that she doesn’t care about your son or his welfare.</p>

<p>If he does go, I think he should check in with the American embassy ASAP and see if they have any suggestions on where to stay & how to protect his instrument - at least they speak English! And under no circumstances should the mother hold the cell phone. He should either get his own if you can afford it, or one of the English-speaking crew should hold it. </p>

<p>Good luck - I know you’ll be sitting on pins & needles until he gets home.</p>

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<p>Thanks for your advice! I wish he wasn’t going, and I think he feels the same way. His contract has heavy penalties if he doesn’t follow through. I have no idea how to enforce an international contract - from either direction!</p>

<p>I have tried to stay out of this, being a good mom. We have had a few arguments along the way over this. He seems to be appreciating our input now, though. </p>

<p>He called the airline (Asiana) this morning, and they are supposed to be emailing him the itinerary and confirmation. I just hope they don’t bump him or something.</p>

<p>One thing that makes me feel a little better is that he told me he has a good friend who is Korean and lives in Seoul. So he has an English speaking resource other than this girl and her mom. That friend has recommended a particular hostel for the first night. But we are leaning toward paying the big bucks for the Hilton for that night. That is the hotel they will be staying in the rest of the trip. So he won’t have to move around, and maybe his instrument will be more secure there. And maybe they’ll have transportation from the airport? The catch is that, according to the website, there is no room available for 3 people that night.</p>

<p>I really like your advice about the embassy. We hadn’t thought of that. I will look them up on the Internet, and see if we can make contact before S leaves.</p>

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<p>Although he should not have signed the contract without completely understanding it, by doing so he placed himself under an obligation to both the agency that booked him and to the other members of his quartet. I think he needs to go or find a suitable replacement for himself (unlikely when the plane leaves tomorrow.) A musician without a reputation for reliability when it comes to showing up for gigs is a musician who is not going to get a lot of gigs in the future. Word will get around.</p>

<p>I presume he has more than one horn. If I were him, I would use the least valuable one he has for this gig. If it is insured, check with the insurance company to see if it is covered in this situation. If not, find out whether they will issue a specific rider to cover it and how much that would cost.</p>

<p>He needs to have some means of communicating when in Korea. If the group is planning to rent a cell phone but has not yet done so, they need to make sure that they can all get to it should they need it. Perhaps they need to rent more than one. At the very least, the four members in Seoul should have one on the day they are on their own.</p>

<p>Checking in with the US Embassy is an excellent idea. In addition to going there in person the day they arrive, they should call or send email today with their planned itinerary.</p>

<p>If he does not already have the return plane ticket in hand, he needs to get it ASAP. If things really fall apart once there, he could try to get an earlier flight back home.</p>

<p>Edit (crossposted with binx’ earlier response): The heavy penalties for non-performance should have been a big red flag. Are we talking more than the cost of the flights plus his share of the hotel bill?</p>

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<p>“…the Party responsible for the cause of the cancellation shall compensate the other Party for the entire amount of money already paid and verified by documents.”</p>

<p>They are performing at a fundraiser / publicity event, and there has been much advertising. </p>

<p>He is taking his “best” horn, but it is also his cheapest. He does have world-wide insurance on it.</p>

<p>I got a PM asking about his visa. He was required to turn in some various info to receive the appropriate visa in order to “work” there. I don’t know how visas work. Can anybody clue me in. He doesn’t have anything in hand - should he be showing something in writing when he arrives? The girl and her mother are Korean, and probably know a lot more than we do, and just are not good at sharing the info! </p>

<p>He is learning a lot of lessons the hard way here.</p>

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<p>Call the Korean Embassy in the US for information about Visas. Also, do some online research. Some countries require your passport to issue the Visa and it can be a several week process. You need to mail the passport with the Visa request. All countries have different rules.</p>

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<p>About a month ago, the sponsoring company asked for some personal details, including passport numbers, in order to obtain work visas. That’s the last we’ve heard of it. So I assume they have the visas, but I don’t know WHO has the visas.</p>

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<p>Work Visas and Entry Visas are different and issued differently. If it was my child, I would want all the details before he left. In my experiences traveling, Entry Visas are issued first. Best of luck sorting this out!</p>

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<p>As near as I can tell from the Korean Embassy website, an entry visa isn’t needed for stays of less than 30 days as long as they have proof that they’re leaving before then (tickets). The website also talks about the work visas, and says an internal company can obtain the work visa (which is what I think has happened.) I have an email to the mom in charge to verify this.</p>

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<p>Not safe in a Korean bathhouse? Hmmmm…is it like a Japanese ryokan? I’ve stayed in those and they are amazing.</p>

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<p>Cheers - I’m listening! Please tell me about them. I really have no idea. You think the kids’ luggage and musical instruments would be safe there, even while they sleep?</p>

<p>I had a very uncomfortable phone call with the friend today. She cried and accused me of “yelling” and said I didn’t trust her, and that I was insulting her mom because I was questioning the plan. (I’ve never met her or her mom.) She has since sent a very sarcastic email to my son, with lots of caps. </p>

<p>Every concern I have about the requirements posted on the embassy website gets met with a “We don’t need that.” “You don’t trust us.” “It’s not my fault.”</p>

<p>I am hoping this is the low point, but it’s pretty low.</p>

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<p>BINX–try tripadvisor.com forums. They frequently have local experts online
who will even comment on specific lodgings. Example–when I was looking for practice space in Florence, a local posted me exact addresses and phone numbers within one our. Goodluck</p>

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<p>woops --one hour not one our.</p>

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<p>Gosh. With enough lead, I could have helped with housing, with folks who would have loved to have him. SERVAS has some 500 hosts in South Korea, begging for visitors, and last year had only four travelers! They would have welcomed him with open arms. </p>

<p>Oh, well. The experience of international travel “gone wrong” and then the serendipities that go with are likely to be what much of his life will be like, so this sounds like a great (if trying) trial run.</p>

<p>I think in Korea the ryokan is called a “yogwan”. I’m jealous!</p>

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<p>I hadn’t thought of checking Tripadvisor. Thanks for that.</p>

<p>I was hoping you’d stop by, Mini! I wonder if you have any clue about the requirement that arts/cultural people who will be performing publicly need to have HIV testing? I found this little nugget on the Korean Embassy site in DC, but S’s friend says it’s not necessary. She’s says she’s performed there before and never needed it. I certainly hope not, since none of them have it. I suppose some things get lost in translation, but why would they put it on their website? I’m a bit afraid to ask anything more, and stir up more trouble. </p>

<p>I asked if the work visa had been received – and she took offense. I explained that I wanted to make sure they were going to be legal. We’ve been overseas, and understand the repercussions of working without a visa. Now she is sending my S sarcastic emails about that, and my other questions. I expressed concern about them splitting up, going different places, and she’s being nasty about my S needing to be babysat.</p>

<p>The girl now tell us they have friends who had already agreed to store the luggage and instruments that first night. They don’t understand why we feel the need to hear about these things. Everytime we ask a question, we get accused of not trusting them.</p>

<p>She finally sent S’s e-ticket to him after our phone call. She only received it today from Korea. But she doesn’t see the big deal about only getting a confirmation of the flight the day before! She says, “E-tickets are usual.” Yes, but not the part about getting them the day before.</p>

<p>I guess I’m just too old and inflexible. Before my kid flies half way around the world, isn’t it reasonable for me to ask for his flight itinerary and where they are staying the first night? I realize he’s 21, and I have stayed out of the whole shebang until today. Now everyone is mad at me for causing “drama.” And I’ve been informed that the mother is very upset about my treatment of her, after all she’s done for this trip. (I haven’t spoken to her at all; she doesn’t speak English. I can only imagine what her D is telling her.)</p>

<p>But, Mini, you’re right. This is a “learning experience” which will give my S stories to tell his grandchildren. And if he wants to be a performer, I expect that this is only the beginning.</p>

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</p>

<p>My response: Yes, I don’t trust you. You haven’t proven yourself trustworthy. Now answer my questions.</p>

<p>Yes, binx, I know you can’t say it. But I bet you were thinking it!</p>

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<p>Actually, I pointed out that I didn’t know her or her mother, and therefore was not in a position to determine anything at all about trust. (I am not known for tact, but I do try.)</p>

<p>I asked my S if what I said was really that bad. He said that he thought I said what needed to be said, but she seemed determined to take everything in the worst possible way.</p>

<p>I truly believe the only thing I could have said that didn’t offend her would have been, “Thank you so much for arranging this trip. You have done such a great job. S will bring a blank check to cover anything you forgot. Don’t worry about a thing. We’re very flexible and rich.”</p>

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<p>“I asked if the work visa had been received – and she took offense. I explained that I wanted to make sure they were going to be legal. We’ve been overseas, and understand the repercussions of working without a visa.”</p>

<p>I’m betting there isn’t an E-6 visa, but we’ll see. The E-6 visa does indeed require an HIV test, but not one done in the U.S., but in Korea (as I understand it) before one starts work. The reason for this is quite fair, actually - many of the “hotel entertainers” are in fact sex workers. I imagine the bureacracy could make it rough if they choose - but I suspect they’ll be bending over backwards to do the opposite - the Koreans (in my very, very limited experience) are trying to do everything possible to facilitate cultural exchanges (especially as it is rare for non-Asians to come to Korea to share western culture). Anyhow, is it an E-6 visa that he expects to be traveling on? (They are usually for six months.) I think more likely a C-3 or C-4, which wouldn’t require a test.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.moj.go.kr/HP/ENG/eng_03/eng_306020.jsp[/url]”>http://www.moj.go.kr/HP/ENG/eng_03/eng_306020.jsp&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>But, other than that, I am outside my expertise.</p>

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<p>It seems to me that what you have here is mainly a failure to communicate. The important stuff is getting done, albeit very late in the game. The tickets, visas, lodgings and safe storage of belongings have all been taken care of. The ensemble is finding that they will have a net financial loss on the trip, but the time to negotiate that was before signing the contract and now they have only themselves to blame on that score. You have done about as much as you can, other than perhaps making sure that you and your son have a way to get in touch with each other in the event of an emergency. He is 21 now and you have to trust that he will be able to handle anything less than an emergency on his own. </p>

<p>Stop worrying about what this young woman and her mother are saying about you behind your back. There is nothing you can do about it at this point if they do not realize that trust is something that has to be earned. Looked at from their viewpoint and since you have only been involved starting today, nobody but your son may have seen any need to keep you in the loop.</p>

<p>It is certainly reasonable that you know your son’s travel plans, but it seems to me that issue is between you and him. Ask him for what you feel you need and let him worry about contacting the people who are organizing the trip.</p>

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<p>Thanks Mini and Bassdad.</p>

<p>My S has kept us in the loop pretty completely. He took our advice several times about insisting on certain details of the contract. It was a stipulation of his that the plane flights get him to California on the right day. That’s why we panicked when they changed the flight a few days ago.</p>

<p>I actually got involved at this late date because another student’s parents were getting upset. He sent several emails asking for details of the trip, and the answers weren’t very detailed. We then received an email, ostensibly from the mother (although I’m sure the D wrote it), with some more details. She said to feel free to ask any other questions. I sent back a very polite and appreciative email with my questions, which resulted in the phone call.</p>

<p>We have explained to our S that we want him to do this as much as possible alone, but that we do feel a certain level of “entitlement” since it will be us he asks to bail him out! This is the S that has all the nutso things happen to him on trips. So he does have some experience.</p>

<p>I am glad to hear that Korea is so welcoming. My ignorance here is very large. I got a bit nervous reading the Embassy site and traveler’s tips. 3 of the kids are Asian in appearance, so my S and the other girl will stand out.</p>