full scholarship quesitons to ask

Parents Forum
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<p>D has won a “full cost + travel opportunities” scholarship at a school she would love to attend. She is a semi-finalist for what seems to be a similar type scholarship at another more prestigious school. Additionally, with two in college, our EFC is low enough that if she gets into one of the Ivys to which she’s applied, it would be a bargain.</p>

<p>She only applied to schools she loves and is trying to make a cost-conscience decision. She is also trying to get beyond the prestige factor. She plans to study global health/pre-med. We’re not sure if a pedigree is necessary in her future career plans working with a non-profit.</p>

<p>What are some questions to ask about full + travel scholarships to determine true cost over four years in order to adequately weigh options, especially against generous financial aid schools? </p>

<p>One thing we learned about the in-the-hand scholarship is that students are allowed to bank outside scholarship money. A friend says her son’s outside scholarship money was absorbed at another school with a similar type full scholarship.</p>

<p>I would appreciate insight from those who have studied the fine print and know the questions to ask. The decision is ultimately D’s but as a family, we’re all involved in fact-finding. (Please no lectures :))</p>

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<p>That’s lovely.</p>

<p>Does the full scholarship cover all fees, and if not, which ones aren’t covered. (Massachusetts seems to do something nasty where they promise kids full tuition scholarships, but it turns out tuition is very low and fees are many thousands of dollars.)</p>

<p>Will the scholarship cover future cost increases as tuition is raised or new fees are added?</p>

<p>What gpa is required to maintain that scholarship? Is there a grace term if she falls below in one term?</p>

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<p>Thanks Arabrab. </p>

<h1>1 - It is actually a set stipend amount that approximates full cost of attendance. Looking more closely, it comes up about $2500 short with expected tuition increase. She would have to maintain a 3.5, but grace is offered. The travel component is somewhat flexible and some kids managed to visit all 7 continents over four years using group travel plus individual travel allowance. The program also supports two terms of study abroad. This is a state school with a top notch honors program and is a good fit for her study plans. In fact, a recent Rhodes Scholar she met has done what D hopes to do there. Med school placement is admirable; some are top, but many are mid-level schools. Internship opportunities seem respectable and abundant for these scholars.</h1>

<h1>2 - Her second scholarship possibility is at a T20 private. The scholarship has more inflexible travel which will conflict with D’s beloved summer employment as a camp counselor. The scholarship only requires maintaining a 3.0 and provides a computer. We won’t have the nitty-gritty on cost benefits unless/until she wins - she’s still in the semi- round. The school perfectly fits her study plans and has more medical school top placement. Not sure about handling of outside scholarship money, but based on what I’ve learned, it would probably be absorbed.</h1>

<h1>3 - I think an Ivy, if she gains admittance, would cost us about 5K/year. Truly a bargain, but again, outside scholarship money would be absorbed - used to replace financial aid grant money or offset self-help/loan components. Travel would be limited to study abroad, not at all bad, but not as extensive as the two scholarships.</h1>

<p>D can only fully engage in her primary extracurricular activity at school #1. She has many friends that she’s met from across our state in this activity going to school #1 and bonded exceptionally well with scholars at interview weekend. She would be a huge fish in a very big pond at school #1.</p>

<p>At school #2 she is considered in the top 2% of applicants based on their definition of those receiving a likely letter. Winning a full scholarship would put her in the top 1%. At Ivys she would be an average student.</p>

<p>Incidentally, S is at an Ivy. He likes, but does not love it. Unlike D, he has no idea what he wants to do. D has the intrinsic motivation and drive to open her own doors. S will need the Ivy diploma to help him.</p>

<p>We are committed to paying for D’s school whichever she chooses, but helping with medical school will be dependant on the cost of undergrad. (And we would like a little $ left for retirement!) She realizes that to do non-profit work, debt from medical school must be minimized. Putting this in writing is helping me see things I need to ask and frame for D’s understanding and consideration, but I covet additional insight from those who have gone before me :).</p>

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<p>arabrab mentioned two of the important considerations, dollar value of scholarship if tuition and fees increase and academic requirements for maintaining the scholarship.</p>

<p>Perhaps in your case another consideration is the future of your EFC; you mention you will have two in college, but is one graduating while the other is still in school? How will that impact your EFC and your costs?</p>

<p>Congratulations to your daughter, and to you for raising a child who is willing to carefully weigh the costs and benefits.</p>

<p>EDIT: oops, crossposted with your response.</p>

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<p>excellent point midmo - in my excitement of a lowered EFC, I forgot that during her last two years, she SHOULD be the only one in school. Thank you.</p>

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<p>The problem is that few here have ‘gone before’ you in all of the specifics, and no one person can compare the results of choosing all three. </p>

<p>My son happily accepted a scholarship that covered full tuition, some fees, computer, and university-sponsored national merit stipend to attend a private “top 20” (Vanderbilt). However, he cannot say he chose it over an Ivy because he refused to apply to any. The result has been outstanding. His particular program allowed him great flexibility in course choice, including enrollment in graduate courses. He had the opportunity to do research from the start (for pay, starting at the end of freshman year), which has been a great help to him in obtaining internships and job offers. In his case, it is hard to imagine a better outcome. Like your daughter, he is extremely self-motivated and focused. </p>

<p>I hope the offer from school #2 comes through, so you have the “problem” of deciding among several great opportunities.</p>

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<p>If she loves all schools and is planning to go to Med. School (you mentioned pre-med), then the answer is very simple - cheapest one wins. Med. Schools do not pay too much attention to the name of UG, one need very high college GPA and reasonable MCAT score. My D. did not even apply to Ivy, she went to state school on full tuition Merit scholarship, that has been increasing from year to year so that some R&B ended up also covered. She had no problem getting accepted to few Med. Schools, some in top 20.</p>

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<p>Maybe not a question for the financial aid office, but be aware of what the tax burden will be with the scholarships. From what I understand, the part of the scholarship that covers tuition, required fees and required books is tax exempt. But if any part of the scholarship goes to room and board or travel - that is taxable.</p>

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<p>For medschool GPA + MCAT is what counts, so any school will work.</p>

<p>One point to be careful about is the GPA cutoff for the scholarship. In college usually A-=3.7, so 3.5 is pretty high for premed, as far as I understand (none of mine were premeds…)</p>

<p>If it is a stipend at school #1, and there are other scholarships in play, it may turn out to be the best deal by far financially.</p>

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<p>^^this is important.</p>

<p>With some full tuition merit scholarships (unrelated to financial need) it is possible for the student to earn other scholarships which could pay for room & board, books, travel home, … and any other expenses which may not even have to be justified. </p>

<p>possible scenario:
full tuition merit from university
$$ from parent’s employer scholarship which will be used by student to cover room & board
or RA position which covers room and board
Robert Byrd which will be used to cover books, travel home
and then any outside scholarships (which aren’t need based) are “free money”</p>

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<p>You guys are great! The tax implications may negatively affect S’s EFC for his last year. I’ve got to figure this out. </p>

<h1>1 is a stipend that covers all of R&B with the rest toward books and fees. The state merit program funds tuition - and that’s another can of worms. Both have a 3.5 threshold to maintain.</h1>

<p>We agree that cheapest is best, but don’t know yet how to figure that out!! So many variables are still up in the air, predominately #2 and #3 which are only possibilities! The EFC picture looking out four years, tax implications, possible outside scholarships - she has quite a bit already with more likely, and then there are the nuisances of how different scholarships work. </p>

<p>I’m the first to admit that we don’t know if there’s even a decision to be made, but once options are on the table, D has only two weeks (of which she will be away traveling 10 days) to decide without filing for an extension from #1. She wants to have a good idea of how to weigh these possible options, so that if she doesn’t take #1, she can let them know without extending and alternates have time to consider their options before May 1.</p>

<p>I applaud (and encourage) her consideration of others, but am feeling the stress of helping her make what might become a less than fully informed and quick decision.</p>

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<p>one more thought since she is looking at med school and is obviously a stellar student: when mine were at this stage I didn’t realize there are full tuition merit award MD/PhD programs.</p>

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<p>I would really worry about the 3.5 gpa. DS turned down a pert-near full-ride deal at a state college that would have necessitated maintaining a 3.5. Even though he will graduate with a 3.5 or very close to that, there were a few semesters where his grades dipped lower at his current school. I think it would be an additional stressor to know that so much rides on grades. I would have very strongly discouraged him from taking that scholarship. DD had a merit scholarship at a top20 private U that required a 2.8 gpa to maintain it. That takes all the pressure off!!!</p>

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<p>“so 3.5 is pretty high for premed, as far as I understand (none of mine were premeds…)”</p>

<p>3.5 is on low end for pre-meds, it is OK for URM, though.</p>

<p>“tuition merit award MD/PhD programs”</p>

<p>-Extremely hard to get into even for very top pre-meds with very high MCATs. In addition, one should be interested in research vs clinical to do so. There are Merit $$ at Med. Schools and couple Med. Scools are free: Cleveleand Clinic and Mayo (maybe more, but I do not know). They are also close to impossible to get into even with very stellar stats (like college GPA = 4.0 and high MCAT). And again, one needs to love them enough to apply. D. was waitlisted at Cleveland Clinic, but she also mentioned that it was not her top cnoice. She has been accepted to few Med. Schools, she has very good options.
GPA = 2.8 is not good enough to apply to any Med. School, unless URM.</p>

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<p>This is good info. </p>

<p>She’s considered the GPA and in her 17-years of accumulated wisdom, doesn’t think it will be a problem . It does concern me, though. Alternately like you’ve mentioned, without a great GPA, medical school may be elusive. She is not URM. </p>

<p>I wouldn’t necessarily say more prestigious schools are harder, but it reasons that maybe they are, therefore, keeping a 3.5 at a state school may be less difficult than at an Ivy. No one really knows how medical schools scale this difference.</p>

<p>(Our personal experience: S took Calc at local CC, worked slightly and made an A. It doesn’t transfer to Ivy so took it there six months later and busted it for a B-. He said they covered in a day what CC class covered in two weeks. CC class focused on solving problems and Ivy class focused on underlying concepts.)</p>

<p>Thanks all!</p>

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<p>Gotta say, a 3.5 GPA would concern me. Our S who skated through school, includng all APs + marking band his SR year of HS had a tough time GRADUATING with just over a 3.5 GPA in electrical engineering, much less maintaining one at all times. His U only required a 3.0 GPA to keep their merit awards, which was much more forgiving and allowed the kids to take courses to challenge themselves w/o jeopardizing their funding. We do know of some kids who weren’t able to keep their merit scholarships because they couldn’t maintain the required GPAs–one is selling used cars (honestly). </p>

<p>I’d be much more interested in schools that only require a 3.0 GPA, just because you never know what bumps the kiddo will hit in college. I’d also find out if the GPA is per term or cummulative, so you can add that in (particularly if the kiddo does great in the 1st few terms to build a “cushion.”</p>

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<p>Have you read many of Curmudgeon’s posts? Try to find the ones from April/May 2006 when his D was making decision…</p>

<p>His D made a decision between Ivy/Top LAC’s and a full ride LAC not as highly ranked as some of the other LAC’s she was admitted to. Went for the full ride. Now at Yale Med school…where Pops is probably able to help financially since he didn’t have to…at least not much…when she was in undergrad.</p>

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<p>I will look back - thanks, 2boysima</p>

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<p>My daughter accepted a full-ride where the bulk of it requires a 3.0 GPA, but $3500 per year is dependent on maintaining a 3.5 GPA. Even though her costs will still be minimal if she loses the smaller part of the scholarship, her sense of pride is pushing her to not risk it. She is majoring in bio-medical sciences with plans of going to PA school. She knows that she better have a very high GPA to get accepted into PA school, in addition to work experience so she isn’t even figuring losing the smaller scholarship. Is it hard to maintain the high grades? So far, so good, but she is only in her second semester. She is trying to maintain straight A’s as long as possible to buffer possible B’s in later classes. </p>

<p>To keep her grades up she goes to every class, no matter what. Studies all week long, many times with other serious students. She keeps up with her homework and turns it in on time. Even so, she has found time to be very active in a sorority, volunteer work and socialize with friends. Her weekdays are devoted to school, volunteering and meetings. Her Friday nights and Saturdays are devoted to fun and then on Sunday she is back the grind.</p>

<p>A 3.5 GPA is very doable if the child is capable, and industrious. Unfortunately, a lot of freshmen have an adjustment period the first year and their first year grades aren’t necessarily reflective of what they can do once they get settled down. Personally, before I would accept a full-ride with a 3.5 GPA requirement I would take a realistic look at my child, something most parents struggle with, and try to figure out if I honestly feel my child’s adjustment face will be mild or major. If I thought it would be major, I would seriously rethink accepting it.</p>

<p>As a side note, one of my sister-in-laws is a professor at a prestigious university up north. She told me she worked on a study that examined students who did well and who did not do well their first year and it showed that the students didn’t so much struggle with the academic challenges but struggled with being overwhelmed with living away from home and having to completely take care of them selves. Students who were more independent, made new friends easily and were comfortable with the basics (knew how to do laundry and simple cooking) fared far better than those who weren’t as independent.</p>

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<p>Our S did NOT have any issues with adjusting to EE and the work was pretty easy (and he was very well prepared, but so were all the other kids in EE). It still would have been very tough for him to get a 3.5 EVERY TERM (if that’s what the scholarship requires) or be sure he never had his average drop below 3.5. I guess we didn’t want him to have that extra stress to deal with and we’re glad he didn’t. For graduation, he was able to wear the honors cords because he JUST made it over 3.5 (he wasn’t sure until the very end). There are a LOT of very bright, hardworking kids in a lot of the STEM fields.</p>