Gay Parade In Jerusalem

Parent Cafe
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<p>Does anyone feel that having a gay parade in jerusalem is very wrong and disrespectful to many people and that this will ultimately will hurt the causes of gay people because it seems that this parade is being thrown in Jerusalem to spite religion, to spite tradition and such. </p>

<p>I personally am disgusted with the gay orginization that is putting this on and the Jerusalem Municipality for allowing it. Jerusalem is not New York, its not Amsterdam, Its not Tel Aviv. Jerusalem is also not Sodom. Imagien how awful a gay parade would be in Vatican City.</p>

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<p>“Imagien how awful a gay parade would be in Vatican City.”</p>

<p>That has actually been the norm for a very long time, at least under the 11 gay popes.</p>

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<p>Shhhhhhhh! It’s a secret!</p>

4

<p>“The times… they are a changin.”… with props to Mr. Dylan.</p>

<p>I am truly sorry this would upset you so much. Just like you, I can’t tolerate intolerance.</p>

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<p>I do not think that is proper to have a gay pride parade in jerusalem. Perhaps you have never been to the city, and you just do not understand what kind of place it really is. But its disrespectful to have have thouands of gay people marching through the holiest city in the world for jews, and non catholic christians. I am not telling them to not march, but to be open minded about what jerusalem is and what it represents. Again I want to reiterate that Jerusalem is not new york or Paris or even Tel Aviv. It just seems that this march in J’lem is meant to be a shot at traditionalists and religous people.</p>

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<p>Wait a minute, rewind, rewind – 11 gay popes?</p>

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<p>Read John Boswell - that’s just the openly gay ones; there were probably others. (In the early period, there seem to have been even married ones.) </p>

<p><a href=“http://www.amazon.com/Christianity-Social-Tolerance-Homosexuality-Fourteenth/dp/0226067114/ref=pd_sim_b_1/102-0207768-5411361?ie=UTF8[/url]”>http://www.amazon.com/Christianity-Social-Tolerance-Homosexuality-Fourteenth/dp/0226067114/ref=pd_sim_b_1/102-0207768-5411361?ie=UTF8&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Of course, Boswell ends in the 14th Century; there were later ones. Pope Pius II, besides keeping catamites, was a well-known author of erotic literature. He was succeeded by the very heterosexual Innocent VIII, with 8 illegitimate sons and likely as many daughters. The Papacy turned gay again with Sixtus IV who made his lover Petro Riario - who was also his nephew - a cardinal. He was soon followed by the elderly gay Pius III (who had a longstanding live-in relationship with one of the Cardinals), and the switch-hitting Pope Julius II, condemned by the Council of Pisa as ‘this sodomite, covered with shameful ulcers.’” Though the Council of Pisa, controlled by Julius’ enemies, was obviously prejudiced, it based its conclusions on “Julius’ fondness for Federigo Gonzaga, Francesco Alidosi, and other young men.” The Vatican diarist, Girolamo Priuli, “reported that Julius disported with Ganymedes ‘without shame’ at Ostia and Città Castellana.” </p>

<p>Julius III is an interesting one (ruled 1550-1555). Famous as a skilled expert in canon law, and a patron of Michelangelo and Palestrina, Julius also “created one of the most notorious homosexual scandals in the history of the papacy.” Just before he became pope, then-Cardinal Giovanni Maria del Monte fell in love with a 15-year old ragamuffin named Innocenzo. Two years later del Monte, now Pope Julius III, made young Innocenzo a cardinal and his “chief diplomatic and political agent." The young “Ganymede” “shared the pope’s bedroom and bed.” The “Cardinal-Monkey” Innocenzo’s glory days ended when his papal partner died in 1555. </p>

<p>Hester Thrale (Madame Piozzi) wrote about Cardinals who openly brought their catamites with them to the College of Cardinals electing a new Pope in 1800.</p>

<p>The Child-Pope Benedict IX (actually held the papacy three different times without dying, quite a trick!) was held in the lowest esteem by Dante (in the Inferno), seems to have been bisexual, sodomized animals, and was big on homo/hetero orgies. To be fair, he was a long time ago. (11th century). </p>

<p>In modern times, there have been debates about the sexual orientation of Paul VI. Whatever is true, he seems to have been discrete about it, and is not included in any of the counts.</p>

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<p>What is your point</p>

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<p>Just answering Venado’s question regarding gay “parades at the Vatican.”</p>

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<p>Mini was answering my question which was a bit off topic – sorry.</p>

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<p>oo, because there are gay popes there should be a gay parade in jerusalem?</p>

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<p>agreed. Its one thing to do this in New York , but Jerusalem is not Sodom and they have no right to do it there. Imagine the uproar if i threw a straight pride parade</p>

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<p>“oo, because there are gay popes there should be a gay parade in jerusalem?”</p>

<p>No, but just because the people of Jerusalem have more tolerance in their hearts than you do, does it make them wrong?</p>

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<p>The people of jerusalem are against this parade, so is the mayor, it was actually the district court that is forcing them to allow it. But let me ask you this why do you think that Jeruselamites should be subjected to this. You have probably never been to Israel, let alone Jerusalem? So if you havent you would not understand what a special city this is and what kinds of people live in it. You would not understand the holines of it and the feeling of holiness that almost every jews sense s even for a moment. Jerusalem is not a place to hold a gay pride parade. Jerusalem is not a place to strut around scantily clad gay men kissing eachother.
Jerusalem is not a place where you can parade the fact that you have no family, that you are gay and missing out on one of the most important basic and important tenets of life in Judaism-the family with children.</p>

<p>I am not intolerant to gays or a gay pride parade. But everything has its time and its place, and believe me Jerusalem is not the place for a gay parade. If they want to have a parade why dont they go 45 minutes east to Tel Aviv, a bigger city at that. But this gay parade is more than just showing pride in your behavior, but its a spit in the eye to the religious establishment and the traditional establishment that prays facing jerusalem, that cries for the strength to return to jerusalem.</p>

<p>I am disturbed that the moment I voice opposition to a gay parade in J’lem, you label me as intolerant. Please be more open minded and maybe encourage gay rights groups to be more tactful.</p>

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<p>YOU asked us to imagine a gay parade in Vatican City. And so I did, and noted that this would not have been at all uncommon.</p>

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<p>oo now i see because vatican had gay popes, a gay parade under the popes nose right now would not be objected to by anyone. Then it was my mistaek to bring up the vatican. Lets stick strictly to j’lem</p>

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<p>Allowing a gay parade - any lawful parade - has something to do with democracy, golani89, and freedom of speech in Israel, and that includes Jerusalem.</p>

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<p>“oo now i see because vatican had gay popes, a gay parade under the popes nose right now would not be objected to by anyone. Then it was my mistaek to bring up the vatican. Lets stick strictly to j’lem”</p>

<p>People can object to anything they like. That’s what democracy is about (or at least used to be, before the Hate America crowd eviscerated the Constitution.)</p>

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<p>Right, it is such a shame that you are misunderstanding what Jerusalem is. You are absolutely right lawful parades are an inherent part of democracy and Israel like any other western free nation should not stop free speech. But both you and I know that not all permits are granted to people who want to parade and hold a rally. Alot of things are considered. What if someone proposed a gay parade at the Western Wall plaza( for those of you who dont know what that is, its the big square where the western wall stands) or worse a prostitutes parade. Certain things are just not acceptable in certain places. Your mistake is that you are viewing Jerusalem as a regular city, which it is not. Jerusalem although 45 min away from Tel Aviv is in no way similar to Tel Aviv in feel, in culture, and in holiness</p>

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<p>It’s a lot less offensive than armed Israeli troops at the Dome of the Rock. </p>

<p>As for the prostitutes’ parade, I assume you know that not more than 100 yards from the Western Wall, in the First Century, was an entire street of brothels? Didn’t seem to bother them, then.</p>

<p>(Threw out the bait…now it’s time to reel in the fish…;))</p>