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<p>How do you explain shows like Oz, The Wire, Treme, Boardwalk Empire, The Number 1 Ladies Detective Agency, In Treatment, Six Feet Under, or the upcoming True Detective being shown on HBO?</p>
<p>I think Lena Dunham is an amazing talent. And very brave! Last nights episode was almost hard to watch, because i found myself thinking “no successful doctor living in a beautiful ny brownstone would want anything to do with a fat hannah horvath”…exactly her point! </p>
<p>Sent from my DROID X2 using CC</p>
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<p>What I think is part of the “train wreck” aspect of the show is that Hannah is plump and unattractive yet viewers see her without clothing as often as possible. I’m probably wrong, but I have to hope that those ugly tattoos are not real permanent tattoos. They make an unattractive woman hideous looking.</p>
<p>They are real tattoos. I’ve read that they’re mostly illustrations from children’s books.</p>
<p>She’s not unattractive in real life, but she deliberately dresses awkwardly and makes herself less coventionally pretty on purpose for the show. I certainly don’t think she’s fat; she’s just not the typical skinny actress we’ve come to expect on TV. I find that refreshing.</p>
<p>I just cannot stomach the show being hailed as “the voice of a generation.”
Like, you’re kidding. I’m glad there isn’t a token, loud mouthed, sassy black girl making a fool out of herself (Glee, anyone?).
But Lena’s snide comments with racial undertones don’t work for me.
God, the liberal hipster is just too much. Like when she inserts her liberal perspective into her black bf’s beliefs? “Oh, why so Republican? You’re black.”
He even hinted she dated him to fulfill a fetish. She responded with the predicable “I don’t see color.”
I died.
Sad thing? I went to school with girls EXACTLY like the Girls characters. Hipster racism and everything. How excruciating.</p>
<p>Who brought up Tyler Perry? What trash.</p>
<p>Just finished the most recent episode, and I have to say Lena Dunham’s exhibitionism is starting to wear me out. Fine, she’s making a point, but it’s been made, over and over. Her constant revealing of her breasts is like a little kid showing off a toy. Yeah, you have breasts, we see them, now put them away where they belong and show us what else you can do. </p>
<p>alexissss, the show is satirical comedy. Hannah isn’t being held up as a role model; she’s a “type”. If you went to school with girls exactly like her, then I’d say Dunham is hitting the nail on the head. I find the show amusing and revelatory of a certain generation in a certain time and place. If you can’t stomach it, why are you watching?</p>
<p>As she (well, Hannah, not Lena) stated in the pilot, she is hoping to be “A voice of A generation”. I think that statement was also Lena’s intent.</p>
<p>It is <em>A</em> story about <em>a few</em> young people. It isn’t <em>everyone’s</em> story. </p>
<p>Funny how often parents here on CC tell young people how important it is to find their own voice, to tell their own specific story in their own way, in their essays and in their writing. And yet, when a professional writer does just that we are annoyed.</p>
<p>I think one of Dunham’s goals is to create discomfort and discussion. The fact that there are multiple online articles and discussions following every episode, and even the existence of this thread, are proof that she has hit the sweet spot. Or rather, she has hit an uncomfortable, sour, unlikeable, narcissistic spot.</p>
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<p>I agree, booklady. She is far from fat and she’s very cute in person. </p>
<p>Didn’t you watch the Grammys, razorsharp?</p>
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<p>Exactly. That has been misquoted by many people who do not enjoy the show.</p>
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<p>Beautifully explained, eastcoascrazy.</p>
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<p>alexiss, you seem to know a lot of detail about a show you don’t watch. ;)</p>
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<p>No, what did I miss?</p>
<p>Lena’s boyfriend, Jack Antonoff, and his band won Best New Artist and Song of the Year Awards. Lena was there sitting next to him, tattoos and all, looking very cute.</p>
<p>I don’t watch the show. I investigated it because all the mindless girls at my former hs were raving about it as “totally new and individualistic.”</p>
<p>I watched one scene, the breakup between Hannah and token Negro, but I mostly read about Lena’s comments and the controversy (I like controversy).</p>
<p>Really good observations on HBO, alwaysamom. You have me rethinking not subscribing. I may need to be supporting their programing in a more direct way. I’ve seen everything you mention, one way or another, and am impressed with all.</p>
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<p>Ugly Betty was an interesting sort of character but still a fantasy, right? Is Hannah a “totally new” character on tv? I have been wondering about that. On tv - not in some movies or in real life. </p>
<p>We have Hannah’s nudity which is so different from that in Sex and the City or in any other tv or most movies I can think of… will she continue till her body type looks like the (or <em>A</em>) media norm to us?</p>
<p>There is always the debate over whether something this provocative is art or not. I certainly admire her willingness to open herself up to the criticisms she knows will come from other young women, like alexissss. Pretty brave for someone her age imho</p>
<p>She has been very successful - but there is a lot of extremely harsh criticism. She is 24, right?</p>
<p>My D and I watch. I guess we enjoy it for what it is and don’t spend time thinking about what it could have been. I definitely don’t spend thinking about what it should have been. The breakup with the boyfriend didn’t seem to have anything to do with race. Is that what people are claiming?</p>
<p>[‘Girls</a>’ Writer Is Learning There’s No Such Thing as Ironic Racism - Entertainment - The Atlantic Wire](<a href=“http://www.theatlanticwire.com/entertainment/2012/04/girls-writer-learning-theres-no-such-thing-ironic-racism/51338/]'Girls”>http://www.theatlanticwire.com/entertainment/2012/04/girls-writer-learning-theres-no-such-thing-ironic-racism/51338/)</p>
<p>My opinion is that there are layers of meaning. And that Lena understands what she is doing. I can well imagine young people like Hannah from schools like Oberlin spending untold hours discussing what the get-together and the break-up really mean, including the possibility of racial fetishism. Ugly ideas to deal with but it seems to me she is deliberately doing it? Maybe she is really teaching how not to be? </p>
<p>Of course, I may be reading waaaay too much into it.</p>
<p>I first thought that perhaps she’s poking fun at how many girls (white, black, Asian, Hispanic) are like in 'Murica. </p>
<p>I dunno. The show just seemed so…painfully awkward so I assumed it wasn’t meant to be taken seriously.</p>
<p>eastcoastcrazy, I think you hit the nail on the head. </p>
<p>First, Lena is what, 25 years old? Let her tell her story and don’t watch it if you are uncomfortable or don’t like watching white girls in their young 20’s. </p>
<p>I have a young D in that demographic and when she was home for break she watched all the shows from season 1 over a few days, and so I joined her. Yes, I was uncomfortable in a few scenes, but my D loved the fact that Lena was not ashamed of her body, even though it was not a conventional model shape. For that alone I thank Lena as a mother.</p>
<p>Of course writers are going to write about what they know; as Hannah is doing with her cocaine experience, you have to have experiences in order to write an interesting piece. Perhaps after her 2nd or 3rd season she can reflect back and determine whether or not she wants to add a new spin of experiences to this show, or perhaps break off and start a new show with other writers to write their versions of sub-stories intertwined with each other to get a more diverse view.</p>
<p>So, I will continue to watch this show, be uncomfortable occasionally, but see perhaps of my own D’s life from an angle I could have never imagined.</p>
<p>If its painfully awkward well so is life for many young women. My daughter and her friends are this exact age living in NYC. My daughter says, sure some of the stuff is over the top, but that’s tv, but the relationships, the conversations, the jobs, the clothes, omg the clothes, apartments etc are spot on.</p>
<p>And as for her body, she has the shape of many young women, if you want all pretty, go watch friends and their unreal lives, apartments, bodies, hair and clothes.</p>
<p>To me this show is much more realisitic than many out there. And if it makes one uncomfortable, welcome to young adulthood. </p>
<p>The tattoos, somewhat, not what I like, but that too is very real. Look around. I appreciate the fact Lena/Hannah loves her body. Sure, she could be fitter, but right now, thats who she is.</p>
<p>^^I agree with this. It is refreshing to see a woman with a “normal” body. The massive amount of tats disturb me, but then massive amounts like that disturb me regardless of whether it’s TV or not. At first I wondered if they were there for the show but later I saw pictures of her with those tats growing out of her real life clothing.</p>
<p>My problem with the show is the relentless narcissism of the characters. I rented Dunham’s movie “Tiny Furniture” from Netflix and it was also stulifyingly narcissistc, as were all the characetrs (her real-life mother and sister). So I will take a leap and say Dunham grew up in a privileged, self-absorbed family where everything you have to say and all your art is so special and important, the “voice of a generation” stuff. Those characteristics infuse the characters on “Girls”- perhaps that’s why they are so insufferable. And all they do is obsess on relationships. Is that really what 24-year-olds do? They don’t think about the larger world at all? Yes, she’s brave to show her body, warts and all, on camera, but enough already. She’s kind of like a yound female Woody Allen, pairing herself with fantasy men on the show the way Woody Allen paired himself with fantasy women. And it worked for him (kindof). I appreciate her boldness and embrace of her unconventional figure, but that seems to be the only point of the show, that a bold, normal-looking woman can attract guys much better-looking than herself. She’s never with a chubby guy! The guys are all hot. Only Marnie picked up a schlub at Jessa’s wedding, and that was shown as a joke. So there is a double standard regarding attractiveness. The girls can be dorks, but not the guys.
Anyway, I guess a show about a normal-looking young woman who works for Teach for America or the Peace Corps and doesn’t hook up every week with someone new wouldn’t get picked up. But that would be the woman I wuld rather know.</p>
<p>People are debating online whether this past Sunday’s episode was a “fantasy” episode - kinda peeking into Hannah’s subconsciousness. Although, I didn’t think it was that far-fetched. An unattached hetero man suddenly is confronted with a quirky, young and willing girl right in his kitchen - who wouldn’t go for it. And then when he figures out that she’s a neurotic, self-absorbed nut, he quickly exits. </p>
<p>My D and her friends really like this show. They relate to the self-absorbtion, the self-consciousness, not really knowing what or who you are supposed to be, trying on lots of new identities, etc. And, sad to say, the sexual promiscuity is not that abnormal. While many kids this age are centered, driven, ambitious, etc., many are not - especially in the artists world that my D and her friends are in. </p>
<p>As a parent, I watch this show as a train wreck. I like to shout at the TV “No, Hannah, make better choices! Call your mother!” But I am 50 years old - I am not the target audience.</p>
<p>Ok - racism? Because there are no main characters of color? Eh, not only does that mirror a lot of other hit TV shows - it also mirrors many people’s real lives. For most people, your closest friends are similar in race/socio-economic/political views. Call that racist, but it seems to be true across races.</p>