gratuitously mean teacher

Parent Cafe
1

<p>I’m just venting. D hasn’t asked for help, and I’m duct-taping my mouth. She has a teacher who has a reputation to maintain, apparently, for being just plain ole mean. She is doing well in his class - high A. But before she approaches him about anything, she has to steel herself for barking, sarcasm, inappropriate scolding, etc. She was new this year, and got yelled at for having a blank transcript, for example. He is a “coach” (wrestling? - not sure), and seems to consider teaching students no more than a necessary evil. He has a D my D’s age, who is sweet and friendly and popular (and religious - I don’t know if he is or not). I would love to ask him if he would approve of a teacher treating his D the way he treats mine.</p>

<p>If his method is designed to create as little interference as possible, it’s working. Students are afraid to approach him. As I said, my D’s grades are just fine, and she’s tough enough to recognize the garbage for what it is and not take it personally. She comes home and vents, and makes jokes. But senior year is stressful enough; I just don’t understand why people have to be this way.</p>

<p>Caveat: I definitely don’t mean for this to degenerate into a teacher-bashing. But I would love to hear how other poster’s kids have dealt with this kind of situation.</p>

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<p>Son had two teachers like this during school career. These teachers had been in the system for years with the same yearly complaints but nothing was ever done. Both taught must have courses so there was no avoiding them. Son just kept as low a profile as possible and got through it. At what price I will never know.One mom I know complained and the next day the teacher announced to the class that the students “mommy” had called to complain that they were picking on him. Interesting enough both teachers were coaches.</p>

<p>Our school system has become a mega click of parents of kids in the district who are also teachers. They (and their kids) run the show and woe to anyone who tries to challenge this. So glad this is done and over.</p>

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<p>I’m so sorry your daughter is facing this binx. My son had two experiences with teachers similar to your daughter’s, and they were both tenured teachers. </p>

<p>The first was in elementary school. I kept telling my son and myself that not all is rosey in the world, and however unfortunate, he’d have to tough it out. I started a diary of events though, and seven weeks into the school year the proverbial straw broke the camel’s back. I went to the principal, who it turned out was fully aware of the issues with this teacher, and we moved him to a new class. It was the best decision we ever made. The new teacher was fabulous! </p>

<p>The second bad situation happened his senior year. At his age, he completely handled it himself, using sax’s son’s method of laying low. It worked out fine in the end.</p>

<p>This is definitely not teacher bashing. Between my two kids, they’ve had some average teachers, but by and large they’ve had fantastic teachers. Two bad apples out of the bunch is a credit to the teaching profession! Believe me, we appreciate our teachers.</p>

4

<p>A similar incident happened to me regarding one of my son’s teachers who had a huge ego and tended to make hurtful personal statements to his classes, such as the one reported by sax above.</p>

<p>The teacher (who was also the coach of another sport) came to watch a track meet which my son was participating in (the teacher used to coach track). I saw him and thanked him for his support for the team, and then mentioned that my son was enjoying his class and was putting a lot of time and efforts into his essays for the class (which was true). </p>

<p>The next day, the teacher told the class that “Tommy’s (not real name) mother must write his essays for him because she knows everything that is going on in this class.” From then on, I avoided the teacher - if I happened to see him from a distance, I made sure to stay far away. </p>

<p>Another time, the students were assigned to write a practice college essay for the same teacher’s class. My son wrote about his difficult decision to give up playing soccer, which had been the focus of his life for many years but which he did not enjoy in high school, to join the cross country team. (FWIW, this did turn out to be the actual topic of his personal statement for his college applications, although it was revised quite a bit from the version he turned in for the class assignment.) The teacher told another section of the same class that my son was cut from the soccer team because he was not good enough to make it, and then he wrote an essay about how he decided not to try out. (This was absolutely not true - he decided not to try out at all that year, and the teacher had nothing to do with the soccer team anyway so he wouldn’t know anything about who was cut.) My son was in tears over this when he came home from school, as many people had been asking him why he wasn’t playing soccer and now they were doubting his response that he decided not to play, and thought he was lying to avoid saying he had been cut.</p>

<p>All of this happened almost 6 years ago, but I am still upset when I think about it.</p>

<p>I have no advice for the original poster except to leave the teacher alone, especially since your daughter is doing fine, does not seem to be traumatized, and is likely aware that the teacher treats everyone like this and it is nothing personal about her.</p>

5

<p>When my Ds had the same mean teacher, we weren’t sure what to do. So we talked about and decided to look at it as a kind of phycology experiment</p>

<p>Study the teacher, see what makes him tick, approach her about their interests, ie wrestling, or whatever and congratulate on a victory, or fib and say, my cousin is interested in wrestling, and wonders about some good books…blah blah blah…what Ds learned was that it wasn’t personal, some people are just horrid people, but unfortuneately, you need to learn to deal with them, so finding coping ways helps</p>

<p>We also talked aobut in life having to deal with jerks and learning what makes them tick</p>

<p>Even if person was still a jerk, the lessons learned in how to “play” them will help in other situations with other jerks- ie a boss</p>

<p>It does have to do with the age of the student, though, but in HS, so long as her grade is okay, so do some phsych stuff to learn to deal</p>

<p>Why they are jerks, some people are jsut unhappy, or mean, or clueless…</p>

<p>PS- years ago we went on a sports tour with D team, the coach what an A)#*@$@, halfway through the trip, we left…yep, I was a chaperone, and as soon as another one joined the tour, I took my girls out and we went to visit relatives…best decision I ever made…sometimes knowing when to cut and run, and doing it is invaluable…</p>

<p>But if you are “stuck” with someone who is bad, but not bad enough where you can claim harrassment or bullying, well, trying to figure that person out and “working” them gives the “victim” some power back</p>

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<p>Wow - this reminds me of a teacher my youngest D had last year (also a coach though not any sport my D plays in). </p>

<p>She took an Honors History Class. This guy always taught AP classes and I think was a little p.o.'d that he had to teach honors and (heaven forbid!) CP classes in his last year at the school. So, he taught the honors class as if it were an AP class. My D struggled and early on told him she didn’t think she could handle it and was asking to be allowed to drop to a CP level. He told her not to sweat it, that it would get easier and he would help her out. Well, it didn’t get easier and she was really stressing over it. So, she went to him again and told him that she had my permission to drop to a CP level. So, he went off on her big time and told her that if she went to the G.C. to change levels, he would make sure she would get in one of his classes again - that he would stick her at the back of the room and make her do AP work. She came home in tears. Now this is a guy who should have retired years ago - such a bitter, nasty man. Thankfully he retired at the end of last school year.</p>

<p>After talking with her, I said I would take care of it - but she said, no, she would handle it. She went to her G.C. and told her all that was said and the G.C. told her not to worry and put her in another class with a different teacher. I don’t know what the interaction with the teacher and G.C. ended up being, but I heard (from someone who works at the school), that the G.C. just went up one side and down the other.</p>

<p>I think in this case letting my D take care of it gave her a satisfying feeling - though my first thought was to go up to the school - all 5’ of me - and take on this 6’5" guy!</p>

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<p>No man wants to take on a tiny, angry mother. You’d win.</p>

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<p>Teachers are people too. I guess we’re stuck with both the good and the bad.</p>

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<p>I notice in this thread that most of these teachers are male, and are sports coaches. I wonder if this behavior may be part of the sports/military model: Tear them all the way down and then re-create them. (The “mommy” comments are apparently very frequently used in this model.)</p>

<p>And I too am very sorry that your d has to deal with it, binx. Changing schools/countries is hard enough!</p>

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<p>Sometimes teachers seem to have a bad year or snap or something. My older son had a wonderful teacher in 5th grade gifted class. By the time my younger son got her a few years later she was awful. She was always trying to put them down. She totally confused my son in math and made him convinced he was no good at it. I hoped it was temporary and didn’t complain, but I wish I had as I heard many of the same complaints from the next year’s set of parents.</p>

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<p>I don’t think that something like this should be tolerated nor do I think that students should be expected to be able to defend themselves from adults in authority positions who are bullying them.</p>

<p>This really is a situation in which I think that parents need to get involved and climb the chain of command until an acceptable situation is reached. Because of the power imbalance, I think that it’s rare that students are able to solve this kind of situation on their own. </p>

<p>The only reason that bullies like those teachers get by for so long is that parents don’t fight them and some people with distorted senses of what education entail somehow think it’s a benefit to students to be torn down. I don’t believe in that kind of coaching: Indeed, I think the viewpoint that having to tolerate such behavior “makes men out of boys” is what leads to men in our society being the gender that is most susceptible to becoming things like serial killers, murderers, spouse abusers, etc.</p>

<p>I don’t see having to tolerate such behavior as being preparation for the adult world because when one is an adult, if one has an abusive supervisor, can leave the job or one can turn to other remedies (such as suing, etc.).</p>

<p>Parents who hear about their students’ being bullied by an abusive teacher are lucky that their kids tell you. Some kids don’t tell because they fear that it’s their fault or they are babies for not being able to take it. I learned that my older S had been bullied only several years after the incident occurred. long after the man had moved away and my S had graduated. </p>

<p>Believe it or not, I heard about it from the head of his program who told me that another student, who taped the class due to a learning disability, was so distraught at how my S had been treated that the student tearfully complained to the head of the program.</p>

<p>My S, though, never told me. Indeed, I had thought that the man was very nice and also had been supportively encouraging my S, not screaming at him in class, which apparently was what had been going on. The man’s behavior in parents’ conferences was very different than what he had done in class.</p>

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<p>How odd…my D is a junior taking pre-calc, and beginning to struggle. She’s always been a math head, so we’re surprised. Her teacher is also the football coach. He has been rude, demeaning and unhelpful. He has laughed at her questions and expressed doubts about how hard she’s trying after refusing to explain something. She’s asked to step down to advanced algebra, but I don’t want her to. I am going to get stuck paying for a tutor to make up for what this man is unwilling to do. Really annoying! What an attitude on this guy! (and the football team is doing lousy this year—so there’s no redeeming value! LOL)</p>

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<p>My mother went back to school when I was a lad, and then started teaching when I was 12 (with three kids at home – kind of a rebel for 1967). She had some unusual perspectives on teachers, one of which was that there are just as many incompetent teachers as there are incompetents in any other field. Whenever I hear the “underpaid saints” argument I don’t know whether to laugh or argue. (Some teachers are underpaid saints, others should just be glad they aren’t fulfilling their natural destinies as stable cleaners or roadkill removers.)</p>

<p>[soapbox]
One of the problems with public schools is that it is taxpayer funded, without any choice of providers. The reason I get such great service at Tully’s is that I’ll go to Starbucks if I don’t like the product or price. Same with Hondas and Fords, Blockbuster and Netflix, and DSL vs. Cable Internet. I’d be a bigger fan of public schools if there were some reasonable economic linkage between the payer (me) and the provider (the administration and the teachers). The US public school system did a good job of educating the masses to work in factories in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. I think the time to re-imagine the whole system is way overdue.
[/soapbox]</p>

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<p>The only time I’ve ever had to intervene in my older daughter’s behalf was with a math teacher in her senior year. She was coming home daily complaining that the teacher was making misogynistic remarks which she felt was directed to her. I didn’t think much of it until she said he remarked “your SAT scores were quite high, who’d you sit next to?” At that point, protective dad mode kicked in, so I called him and confronted the situation. I think I said something along the lines of “Did you accuse my daughter of cheating on the SATs?” He immediately backtracked and explained that he intentionally made these remarks to the bright girls in his class to motivate them since it’s a male dominated world out there, in fact his daughter’s an MD, yada, yada, yada. After that discussion, he suddenly became helpful and complimentary to my daughter in class. I told her to make sure she did particularly well on his exams, which she did.</p>

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<p>Be careful, very careful! <em>Flashback mode</em></p>

<p>I ran into a very similar situation myself. He made up his own ‘special world’ where in it if a student fell out of line, lasers would come out of lights and shoot them dead (not kidding). He used this world to intimidate his students. </p>

<p>I had him for health class in 10th grade. I was upset because he marked half off on an assignment we had a prior agreement upon that would be worth some other amount of points. Well, after class I went up to him to ask what was going on and to see if the grade could be changed per our agreement.</p>

<p>Well, I got frustrated, this teacher was nothing but a big bully (and a football coach), so I flipped my paper at him and proceeded to leave. As I was leaving the room, he told me I had assulted him (?) and to go to the principal’s office. I went straight to the office, they said they hadn’t heard anything about it, so I left for my next class. </p>

<p>Later in the day, I was called down to the principal’s office for a meeting with the principal to tell my side of the story. I told him what happened and he called my parents to bring them in for a conference. The conference included me, the principal, the teacher, and my parents. At this conference the teacher flat out lied. Told the principal (not looking in his eyes) that I physically hit the teacher. Of course, the principal stood up for the teacher and told me and my parents there were three choices: 1) 10 day out of school suspension; 2) 10 days inschool suspension; 3) 10 Saturday detentions (NOTHING like in Breakfast Club). My parent’s refused to let me miss any school, so I got the most hideous Saturday detentions ever!</p>

<p>My parents knew I wasn’t at fault, I didn’t do anything but restrain myself from calling him an ******* to his face. If they knew the rules before the conference they would have had the principal call the police to come down to check things out. They would have taken one look and knew the teacher was lying and no thin girl would ever attempt to hit a 6+ football coach and laughed.</p>

<p>Funny thing is, if I would have called him an ******* instead, I would have only received 3 days of afterschool detention. </p>

<p>So, make sure you know the rules of the school regarding accidental blow ups in front of the teacher. Also, know that the school will defend a teacher, no matter how crazy they may be! Too bad I was the first child or else my parents would already have known the law of the high school.</p>

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<p>Most of the teachers my kids had throughout public school were good - there were just a few like the ones described here. I think one of the reasons people do not complain is they fear recriminations against their child or siblings who may have to deal with the same teachers in the future.</p>

<p>Another different type of example of inappropriate behavior on the part of the teacher was my son’s 9th grade social studies teacher. He was an older man, generally a good teacher, not nasty like some described above, and well-liked by the students. Part of the class involved simulations where the students worked in teams. The teacher allowed the kids to choose names for their teams, and actually typed up and handed out a list of the team names. Being normal “clever” 9th graders, without any constraints imposed by the teacher, many of the team names they came up with were totally inappropriate for a school setting - with sexual, alcohol, and drug-related overtones. I was horrified, but, stupidly, let it go and did not complain to the teacher or administration. I think it was due to fear of reprisals against my kid at the time, but I now realize I did not do the right thing and should have complained.</p>

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<p>From the teachers-who-should-be-scraping-roadkill file: in fourth grade WD Jr. had to deal with a condescending, annoying teacher who told us (with great care and concern in her voice) that there was no reason to have Junior tested for the gifted kids program because he had trouble getting his work done, and that “not everyone is cut out to be in <the gifted=”" kid=“” program=“”>." When we had Jr. tested anyway, and she saw the test report, it suddenly became, “Jr. is such bright boy! I love having him in my class!” Sheesh. If you’re going to be mildly evil, at least don’t be a wimp about it.</the></p>

<p>From the underpaid saints file: My son’s AP US History teacher was the first one he’s had who expected him to write like a college student – and was brutally frank in his evaluations. He’s my hero (although Jr. liked him a lot, sometimes Jr. thought this teacher was “too hard.” Heh heh heh.)</p>

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<p>I learned early on that you cannot win in a public school setting with problems such as these. The deck is so totally stacked against you in so many different ways that you have to work it out for yourself. The politics in the school system are strong and intertwined. Teachers, school board, local politics. Everyone taking care of everyone else.</p>

<p>I find myself sitting here getting so angry thinking about some of the injustices that went on so very long ago. I feel as if I let both my children down as I learned the “system” as a young idealistic parent. Wow…so much unresolved anger. I wonder the true effect it had on them.</p>

<p>Both kids did have the rare awesome teacher, many good teachers and a few bad. It is the really bad jerks and bullies though that stand out in my memory and who had the biggest imprint on their young lives.</p>

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<p>Unfortunately there are always some teachers who abuse their position of authority in the dictatorship that is their classrom. Fortunately, most teachers aren’t this way. Unfortunately, in most public schools there’s almost no way to get rid of the teacher for behavior such as this due to the strength of the teacher unions. When I’ve raised concerns about clearly incompetent teachers to the principals before all they do is give me a knowing look (they know the teacher’s incompetent), basically shrug, and then try to offer alternatives that never includes the possibility of getting rid of the teacher.</p>

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<p>binx…I’m with you baby. I’m in the middle of just such a squirmish now–waiting for the reply to my email of last night. I want a segment of my son’s assessment to be reviewed by an independent adjudicator. The teacher in question is leaving all sorts of communications out on his desk so that students can read them and approach my son to gossip.</p>

<p>High school comes to an end soon. Thank God.</p>