Guidance for French citizen with Master in Engineering

Graduate School
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Hello everyone,

I’m hoping to get some guidance and clear up some doubts about my future career path. Here’s some context:

Background

  • I’m a 25-year-old French citizen with a non-academic family background.
  • I was the first in my family to attend high school and chose a scientific baccalaureate for its opportunities.
  • I then pursued a computer science degree in university.
  • After graduating, I felt unsure about pursuing a PhD or academia due to workload and income concerns in France.

Work Experience

  • I took a software engineering job at a tech consulting company, but it wasn’t my dream role and lacked the learning opportunities I craved.
  • I left after two years, partly due to recommendations from university mentors and partly because the job wasn’t fulfilling.
  • Despite this, I still see tech companies as a last resort and am open to climbing the ladder in that field.

Self-Discovery

  • I volunteered abroad in a non-English speaking country this year, learning the foreign language (A1 level) as a challenge to myself and to help connect with the people as to facilitate my job.
  • This experience helped me connect with new people, learn about other cultures, and test my interest in training others.
  • While I enjoyed training teenagers and young adults, I was left wanting to make a bigger impact.

Current Situation

  • I doubt my skills and knowledge at times, which impacts my self-confidence.
  • I’m interested in areas like model engineering, symbolic systems, formal methods, and cybersecurity (though my math proficiency is lacking) for their applications on the real world.
  • My family can’t provide financial support: my mother doesn’t work, my father’s income is low, and our relationship is strained.
  • My brother is currently pursuing a Master’s degree, another dropped out of high school, and the youngest is finishing high school this year (who I want to encourage to pursue higher education).

Additional Interests

In addition to my academic and professional pursuits, I’ve always been drawn to the many form of arts. While I barely qualify as a fan or amateur, I’ve found solace and inspiration in creative expression. I believe that exploring this aspect of myself could also contribute to my overall well-being and personal growth.

Future Goals

  • My volunteer experience abroad fueled my desire to study abroad formally.
  • I’m committed to further education, specifically in computer science or mathematics (although I acknowledge my analytical and calculus skills need improvement).
  • My positive experience with mathematics in my bachelor’s degree, along with resources like Khan Academy, motivates me to explore this field further.

Action Plan

  • I’ve started refreshing my math skills with “Pure Mathematics 1” and Khan Academy.
  • I narrowed my search on Common Application and Master Portal to computer science and mathematics programs.
  • Stanford (inspiring campus visit) and MIT are top choices, with University of Southern California as another option.

Doubts and Questions

  • Financial Aid: I’m looking for maximum financial aid, especially from Stanford and MIT. Open to other colleges without needing loans. Considering scholarships like Fullbright. Any recommendations?
  • Transcripts: How should I handle official transcript and report translation/certification for US universities (e.g., recommended service in 2024)?
  • Letters of Recommendation: I haven’t maintained strong connections with professors, but I recently connected back with a high school math teacher. Any advice for overcoming shyness and requesting recommendations?
  • Transfer vs. International Student: How do I categorize myself for applications?
  • Standardized Tests: Do I need to take the GRE, SAT, ACT, TOEFL, IELTS ? Scored 130 on DET.
  • Seek a PhD: How does it work in the US ?

A few words about me

While I believe living abroad will contribute to my personal growth, my overall career path remains unclear. I question if pursuing knowledge and contributing to society, seeking a philanthropic future are overly simplistic goals. Regardless of my financial situation, I want to ensure a secure future beyond my current age. Anxiety about the future is overwhelming, yet I’m taking time to plan and chart my course.

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So why do you want a PhD? I am concerned that your goals in general are unclear and that is not a good way to approach a PhD program. This is a good six years of your life (or potentially even more - mine took eight and a half years!). Six years of your life, doing nothing but research and making basically no money. If you don’t have a passion for it and don’t have some clear goals, it’s just not going to work. This is why many who start PhD programs never finish.

They are not simplistic, but they are unrealistic. What kind of philanthropic future do you believe obtaining a PhD will bring?

Then a PhD should be just about the last thing you are considering, in my opinion.

And what has since changed? It will still be an enormous workload likely for very little pay.

You need to have an interest in a clear area of research, then you look for professors who are doing research in your area of interest who would potentially serve as your research advisor. It sounds like you have a few ideas about areas of interest, but you should refine those ideas first, before submitting any applications.

You will need university professors to provide letters of recommendations. You will need someone who can speak to your academic achievements and potential to conduct original research.

Most graduate programs still require the GRE, but you will need to check the admissions requirements for each university you apply to.

All PhD programs should be fully funded. Often you will be required to teach or perform research as part of your financial aid package.

So, really, WHY do you want a PhD? What area of research are you passionate about?

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Your subject says you are a French citizen with a masters in engineering. But your posts don’t sound like that is the case.

Can you please clarify?

@eggplant107

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Do you currently have a bachelor’s degree from a university in France? Do you currently have a master’s degree, or are you thinking of getting one?

Are you aware that universities in the Province of Quebec provide a tuition break for citizens of France? I think that this is equivalent to charging the same that they would charge a Canadian citizen. However, for a Canadian citizen, a master’s degree at a Canadian university is often fully funded, possibly via some form of assistantship. I am not completely sure how this would work out in your case, but I think that it is worth considering. There are three universities in Quebec that teach in English. McGill is the best known, but Concordia is very good (and is also in Montreal, just up the street from McGill). The third English language university in Quebec is Bishop’s, but it is a primarily undergraduate university implying that it has very few graduate programs. There are also multiple very good French language universities in the Province of Quebec, with Université de Montréal being the largest, highest ranked, and best known.

I think that you should check out the universities in the Province of Quebec.

Stanford and MIT are very high reaches in general. You could apply and see what happens. My understanding is that master’s degrees at Stanford are usually not funded (I got my master’s there) but Stanford does have some one year master’s degrees. I am not sure whether or not MIT offers a terminal master’s degree, meaning a degree that is not intended to be part of a PhD program but that ends with a master’s degree. I did at one time know a few people who got a bachelor’s degree and a master’s degree at the same time at MIT, but that is different from what you are looking for.

If you have already gotten a bachelor’s degree in France, then you would be applying as an international student to be a graduate student in the US (or in Canada).

First students get a bachelor’s degree (but this does not need to be in the US). Then there are two choices. One is to apply for a master’s degree program with the idea of later applying for a PhD (or stopping at the master’s, which is what I did). The other option is to apply directly for a PhD after getting a bachelor’s degree. Typically admissions to PhD programs is very competitive, and is significantly more competitive compared to admissions to a master’s degree program. It is also very common for students to have some work experience after getting their bachelor’s degree before applying to graduate programs (whether master’s or PhD), and this is often helpful.

To get graduate admissions at the level of MIT, Stanford, or the University of Southern California is very, very competitive. PhD admissions would be particularly difficult at this level.

This I do not know. One daughter got a bachelor’s degree in Canada and applied to PhD programs in the US. They just accepted her transcript as is. I would expect that universities in Quebec would be fine with a transcript from France (even the English language universities will have a majority of employees who are fully fluent in French). For universities in the US you might need to ask the graduate admissions staff at each university that you are considering.

These will matter quite a bit. You can ask professors that you had when you were in university. You can ask a boss or senior staff from a job that you have had after graduating university. Both daughters used both of these sources for references when they were applying to graduate programs. I think that a high school teacher would not be ideal. Many years ago when I applied to graduate programs I only used my boss, my boss’s boss, and another senior manager at the place where I was working. However, fortunately for me two were PhD researchers and all were associated with a university.

You will need to check with each university. Some require the GRE, some do not. The SAT is for high school students applying to university, so it is not likely to apply in your case. I would expect that some proof of proficiency in English would be needed (except of course not for the French language universities, whether in Europe or in Quebec).

There is a very, very wide range of high tech jobs. There are organizations doing research that need some high tech to get the research done. As some examples, nuclear physics research needs mathematicians and software engineers (no one aligns the beam on a cyclotron or analyzes the data from a radio telescope by doing hand computations on a piece of paper). Some medical companies will need software engineers (robotic surgery systems do not program themselves). There are huge numbers of other examples.

There is also a wide range of software jobs. Writing a computer game versus an accounting system is quite different. Car’s need software (eg, think about how a self-driving car might work). Again there are huge numbers of examples.

It is possible that you just haven’t found the right high tech job yet.

This is a very good question.

I have to admit that there was something bugging me about the original post that I did not express above. A PhD allows a person to become very, very expert at a very limited and very specific subject. This might not be the right degree for someone who does not know what they want to do.

I have a daughter who just started a PhD program, and therefore just went through the admissions process. One thing that admissions did was ask her a lot about what she wanted to study and why. She had worked in research for a while (perhaps three years) after getting her bachelor’s degree, and had carefully studied the related research that was going on at each university that she was applying to. This allowed her, when talking to a professor at any particular university, to intelligently discuss the professor’s current research and compare it to what my daughter wanted to do. This sort of understanding of your own desired path going forward matters a lot for admissions to a PhD program.

To me the two most obvious paths would be to look for a job that is a better fit, or get a master’s degree in an area that is interesting to you.

If your math background is weaker than you would prefer, there might also be an option to take a few math classes at a college or university near you. This is definitely possible in the US. I am not sure whether it is possible in France.

Having a big impact is something that sort of sneaks up on you a bit at a time. Of those who did have a big impact, few started off with this as their intention. Instead they did something that seemed like it was a good idea, and it worked out (or at least this was my experience).

When I was 25 I had no idea what I wanted to do with my life. This worked out okay. It takes some time for many of us to find our path in life, but I expect that you too will figure this out over time. You are asking reasonable questions. That is a good start.

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Here is something you need to understand with regard to masters and doctoral programs. The way aid is awarded is NOT like undergrad. Programs will accept you, and maybe award you aid because they want you to be part of the graduate cohort. Very often, engineering programs are not fully funded.

Aid for grad students comes in the form of scholarships, grants, assistantships, sometimes work study, and loans.

Do not expect your graduate studies to be fully funded in the United States. Your graduate program will likely NOT be fully funded.

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Depends on the major, the college, and the strength of the applicant.

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Hi everyone, @thumper1 and @DadTwoGirls,

I’d like to clarify my situation and background.

Education

  • I hold a Master’s degree in Software Engineering (Bac+5) from a French university, following a Bachelor’s degree in Computer Science (Bac+3).$

PhD Aspirations

Thank you, @worriedmomucb, for raising important points. While some aspects might be better suited for close friends or family, I value the guidance a wider community can offer.

My passion for Computer Science keeps drawing me back. While I may be idealistic about fame, financial security, and breakthroughs, CS is the field where I feel most comfortable and knowledgeable. It also offers job security.

A PhD would allow me to become a professor, a career aspiration despite the realities you’ve highlighted, @worriedmomucb]

Teaching and Learning Experience

Sharing knowledge and helping others in need to learn is important to me. During my bachelor’s, I tutored undergrads in hardware architecture. I also volunteered at my university’s science events.

Research Interests

I’m particularly interested in optimizing or making breakthroughs in hardware and software architecture. However, I recognize the depth of knowledge required, and some areas, like physics, might be out of reach without significant effort. It’s unrealistic to be an expert in everything, but I strive to connect the dots.

Philanthropy and PhD

@worriedmomucb, your point about philanthropy is thought-arousing. As Wikipedia defines it, it’s about improving public good and quality of life. While the financial benefit might be debated, historical philanthropic actions have undeniably improved lives. Does this suggest a PhD isn’t ideal?

Financial Security vs. Passion

Perhaps you’re suggesting I prioritize financial security to alleviate my anxieties. While a valid concern, my experience after graduation hasn’t been fulfilling. Compared to pre-university construction work, many jobs feel unfulfilling. This fuels my desire for higher education.

Refining PhD Goals

I agree with you. A clear research area with professors aligning with those interests is crucial. While I have areas of interest, I’ll refine them before applying

University Options

I didn’t, I appreciate learning about tuition breaks for French citizens in Quebec. I’ll definitely investigate McGill and Concordia. While Stanford and MIT are ambitious for international applicants with my chance being less than 1%, I’ll still consider them.

Career Path

You’re right, the tech industry is vast. While I’m still figuring out the “right” path, I’ve applied to various jobs from cars to energy to games, all related to software engineering without success. I might need to refine my approach as to sell myself.

I can imagine that it takes time to find one’s calling, and your support helps. Thank you for your encouragement, and for understanding my desire to ask these questions.

Additional Point

One thing that drives me crazy is witnessing many people settling into unfulfilling jobs after graduation. They often realize their assumptions were misguided and they could have taken a different path. This fear of regret motivates me to pursue a PhD and avoid a similar fate.

A feedback I received from a social work counselor is that I might be fidgety after explaining her my plan to study and work abroad. I links this behavior due to feelings of insecurity. I am working on it and will take time.

Next steps

Your daughter experience to carefully research each university’s research areas is invaluable. it is reminding me to be patient instead of rushing.

Regarding the concept of “intelligent discussion,” I believe it means demonstrating a deep understanding of the professor’s research and how it connects to my own goals. For instance, ask about specific challenges the professor is facing ?

Thank you all for your insights.

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You already have a bachelors degree in Computer Science. Get a job in that field.

Where are you planning to do this college teaching?

You are hoping that the grass will be greener on the other side of the fence.

I think you need to find out why you are dissatisfied, and you think so many others are. I don’t happen to agree with you. You may find that you have used 5-7 years or more of your life getting a PhD and are still not satisfied. Or that you can’t find a college teaching job (not easy). Or that you aren’t any happier with this additional degree.

My opinion…helping to train and guide the future is a VERY important way to have a big impact.

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I feel you may be idealizing a PhD to some degree. There are plenty of people who get PhD then can not find fulfilling work in their field. The academic job market - at least in the US - is abysmal. Are you interested in eventually working in the US or returning to France to work?

I suspect the academic job market for a computer science PhD is relatively good to other fields, however, because most people with computer science degree choose to work in industry, not academics, as they can make significantly more money in industry. In that sense, you may be in luck and able to find a job in academia with a CS PhD. But please don’t idealize what this really means - it often means spending more time navigating university bureaucracy than doing the work that you love. It is not easy work. It can be fulfilling. It can also be very frustrating. If this is what you are passionate about, I certainly wish you luck. But I do caution you to be realistic about what this path is really like.

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This is one of the things that worries me.

My wife is a CS professor and receives a large number of emails from aspiring PhD students. Something like this on an email would be a serious red flag.

A PhD is primarily a research degree, and for that, you actually need to have a far more focussed idea of what sort of research you would like to do. More importantly, you need to know what research in CS actually looks like. Based on your response, you still don’t even a vague idea of what interests you.

How much have you read - publications, conference proceedings, PhD Theses, etc?

Was your masters a thesis masters, or was it primarily course based?

A second issue is this:

You need very strong letters of recommendation from people who are familiar with your abilities as a potential researcher. That means that high school teachers are out. You need to have LoRs from professors that taught you in university, and from your master’s adviser. A letter of recommendation from your present supervisor can be good they can provide insight to your abilities as a potential researcher.

Your entire application for any PhD program is about how well you will perform as a researcher. You will get a PhD after you produce a research project/s that is/are both original and impactful.

Look at what you wrote in your first post and ask yourself: “what here tells me that this person has the experience, skills, and talents to produce original research that is impactful?”

I’m not trying to be mean, I’m being realistic. Admission to PhD programs is not easy, and the burnout rate is extremely high.

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Just saw this and thought of this discussion…

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I’ve known more than one person who regrets getting a PhD, including in the UK where the time and financial commitment to do so is a lot less than the US. I think it needs to be something you are very clear about the reasons for wanting to do it (as opposed to wanting to avoid something else).

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OP- don’t make your life choices based on other people’s unfulfillment. That’s a sure fire way to be unsatisfied in your OWN life. And fyi- it’s the human condition to have misguided assumptions. It doesn’t mean you made a mistake, it means you need to recalibrate.

I graduated from college into a recession and took the only job offer I got. Big corporate training program- I knew by Day 3 it was a bad fit. But- so what? I was self-supporting, living in a great city even though I couldn’t afford to take advantage of everything. And I learned a lot working a job I hated, and I learned a TON about how to live a full life on a budget (i.e. which museums were free on which days or after 5 pm; how to get cheap or free theater and opera tickets; who to befriend to get your drinks comped during Happy Hour, etc.) Bad economy meant that you couldn’t just quit your job and know you’d find another one.

I LOVE the work I do now- which I’ve done for 35 years. I cannot imagine a better way for me to earn a living; I make more money than I’d ever thought I could working with stimulating and smart and fascinating people solving problems every day. I loved the travel (pre-Covid, not much travel anymore), I loved having talented colleagues all over the world who made every day a steep learning curve and an adventure.

So did settling in to an unfulfilling job after graduation mean I was doomed to a terrible life? You tell me… it was a building block to a much better career.

And no PhD!

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I agree with the previous posters that say that you need to narrow down what you intend to do. In other words what area of research in CS are you talking about?

My daughter and my son are CS professionals working in the field. My son attended Caltech. Daughter attended SUNY Buffalo and double majored in Electrical Engineering/CS.

Both have been asked by their employers to consider further education, at any US college, with all costs paid by their employers.
Our daughter tried it, but realized that she was happier and a more effective employee working in the industry. She takes courses and brings back that information to her team and trainees.

She trains and hires CS and EE staff. She wrote a training manual that went companywide at one of her corporations. And she’s constantly head hunted as well as being very talented at what she does.

She didn’t want to spend time applying for research grants to fund the CS programs at the university. She didn’t mind teaching and conducting research, because she does that at work, but was shocked at the pay levels in academia vs. industry.

Our son, who attended a research institution, has realized that he really is not professor material because he loves what he does and is well paid. He has an identic memory and recalls every formula off the top of his head. (his sister is very similar in this area).

He has a crew that he leads and he’s an exceptional trainer, but he doesn’t have to teach five sections of courses at a college. He doesn’t have to “publish or perish” in order to keep his job at a university. He has an active social life and volunteers at community events.

Unless you know specifically what area of CS that you hope to enter, and research and study, then you need to hold off.

You need to be very familiar and specific with the current research, at various universities in CS, and find a professor that’s doing what you are interested in, and then see if you can apply and if they are accepting candidates.

I completed a masters thesis in my field. I was only a few units away from becoming a PhD, based on my research.

My professors kept begging me to continue, but I didn’t see the point. I didn’t want to teach at a university because I could get that in my occupation, and I didn’t like the pay; it was too low. Would I have been happy being a professor at a college? Yes probably but then I wouldn’t be able to buy a home in Southern California and help to support my children.

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Same here. But everytime I even considered getting a PhD, I realized there were excellent challenges for me to undertake at my job…which I loved.

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Do you have a Master or a Master Grande École? Did you attend a CMI program or is your a licence? What university or École ?

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Many universities offer tuition as part of their employment benefits (and many list their staff openings online). CS is very employable and universities have large IT departments and they also know how to navigate the visa system.

If you could get a staff position at a university you could test the waters of living and working in the US, have access to the Physics classes you need and connect with professors to build a set of references while you figure out what research area you want to pursue.

Many community colleges have strong ties to flagships and often they only require a Masters to teach so you could also expand your job search to community colleges as well.

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However, if I understand correctly what you are suggesting, this is going to require the college to sponsor a work visa for OP. That adds a whole other layer of difficulty - not only looking for a job but finding one where they are willing to do this for someone who only has a masters degree and no teaching experience.

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Moreover, community colleges are almost all public, which means that it’s another mbarrier for a non-citizen. For Universities hiring somebody with a PhD it’s easier, since there are around 4,800 new CS PhDs every year from USA universities, and the majority go into industry, and at least half aren’t American citizens. However, more than 50,000 people graduate with a masters in CS every year in the USA.

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Columbus State has some positions that just need a Masters and two years in software industry (no teaching experience) and “edit: I think they will sponsor.”

“edit: wrong link, I’ll need to update this”

I’m not sure if Ohio State classes are included in employment benefits, but their students do have cross registration privileges so it’s something to explore. Even if he’d only have access to Columbus State, they have Physics and Math classes which are part of transfer assurance, so those classes would be recognized by all the Ohio publics as well as nearly all of the privates here in Ohio as fulfilling pre-requisites.

Plenty of people that want to teach in higher ed start there or other community colleges and move their way into Ohio State positions.

Maybe this is unique to Ohio?

I wouldn’t look in markets where there are lots of CS grads to compete with, I’d look where there is demand and no supply. CS teaching jobs don’t pay well compared to private industry, so it’s very hard for these organizations to fill the positions.

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