I don’t think they are “incapable of restraining themselves” rather they are using their power and money to ensure they don’t have to do so.
I have never really bought into the theory that women have less of a sex drive than men. Physical differences make assault on men by women less likely, and many more men than women have the kind of power that could be used to persuade someone in that manner… Although in the last couple of years there has been a rash of female high school teachers engaging in sexual relationships with high school boys. These cases I think have a power component.
“Women hear no, and understand no. We’re not obsessed, and we’re not driven to engage in risky sex because of our hormones. Men – even these “old” men, not adolescents – seem incapable of restraining themselves. What’s that about??”
What about the female teachers like Mary Kay Letourneau or that case in New Hamphire (forget her name) who got the kid she was having sex with to kill her husband? I’m sure there are many more like these women out there.
Well, here’s a new wrinkle. TMZ is reporting that Weinstein had a contract with his company that sexual harassment was ok as long as he settled lawsuits with his own money. Wonder how many other companies have such arrangements with their CEOs?
I know zilch about Vitter, but that’s just not true in Spitzer’s case.
His most frequent “escort” grew up middle or upper middle class in suburban New Jersey. (Stepfather was an oral surgeon.) She was working as a cocktail waitress at a downtown NYC hotel while trying to make it as a singer. She met the owner of one of the upscale escort services there. He gave her his business card and she contacted him about a job. She continued to work part time at the hotel while also working for him. IIRC, she was eventually fired by the hotel because it realized she was soliciting guests for the escort service. She was making a lot of money and living a lavish lifestyle.
She’s no idiot. She also recognized Spitzer the first time she saw him.
Fast forward to today–last I heard, she was married to a wealthy man and is a SAHM to two young kids.
I am surprised that you are making this argument. There is a big difference between the two, even though they may both be illegal. One is still consensual, and the other isn’t. There is no comparison.
@zinhead “How do you know that? Many people who engage in prostitution do so against their will, or do so because they feel they have no other options. The women that Spitzer and Vitter paid for were likely as powerless as the women that were victimized by Weinstein.”
You are basically arguing that rape and prostitution are equivalent crimes. I don’t believe that they are.
About 85% of prostitutes have been sexually abused as children. Spitzer’s prostitute could have been abused by her oral surgeon stepfather and fled to NYC. We don’t know what is in her past that led her to prostitution.
I think they are equivalent in that, unless the person otherwise would have uncompensated sex with a john, someone who agrees to have sex in return for compensation is essentially being paid to allow themselves to be raped.
The essence of rape is lack of consent. The prostitute consents to sex, and certainly Spitzer’s escort was not coerced in any way. It’s not the same.
We’ve all heard of cases where girls or boys are tricked and coerced into prostitution, and where prostitutes are held in virtual slavery. But the Spitzer case is not an example of that.
@Cardinal Fang - The only reason a prostitute consents is that they are being paid. No payment, no consent.
Taking your logic further, let’s say that Weinstein corrals a starlet, and proposes sex with the vague promise of a movie deal. If the starlet agrees, by your logic, there was consent and nothing wrong happened.
I don’t support the legalization of prostitution. I’m just saying that in this particular case, it’s probable that some of Weinstein’s victims were every bit as victimized as Ashley Dupre. In fact, I think they were treated worse. You are the one who drew some big deep divide between the women Weinstein victimized and the women who “serviced” Spitzer. You said that the ones Weinstein victimized probably went on to normal, possibly successful lives and the one who was a call girl for Spitzer was powerless and likely has a miserable life. I was simply pointing out that in THIS case that just isn’t true.
That TMZ reported contract is astounding. They may have fired him illegally unless they can get him on criminal charges. You’d think they should be able to but I’m not sure. Some of the sexual harassment he engage in is not a crime. Some of course is. Question is whether the statut of limitations where the events occurred ( Ny, California, London) has run. I think Californias is six years
Harvey is a predator. IMO much much worse than Spitzer. But since Spitzer was a high profile Attorney general going hard after white collar crime, including prostitution, and ruffling a lot of feathers in the process, he was seen as terribly hypocritical and that was a major part of his downfall. And think there was also some shenanigans with how the hotel rooms were paid for involving government funds.
I keep thinking Alec Baldwin may be one who will be next to come crumbling down. Yes, his Trump impersonation is funny, but he is a jerk as his many temper tantrums and tirades show. Don’t understand why people give him a pass.
Alec Baldwin’s may be a jerk with a temper problem that came out in his marriage, with his daughter, etc, but IMO it is peanuts compared to, and note even close to being in the same league as HW and other perverts.
I really don’t see how Ashley Dupre was victimized. She just happened to accept a client that made her activities very public. That’s a risk you take in that business.
The only reason the woman at the bagel shop consents to make my sandwich is because I pay her. That doesn’t mean I’m raping her. It means people work for money. Prostitutes work for money, and sandwich makers at bagel shops work for money.
I understand that in many situations of prostitution, the women are not free to not consent to sex, and of course children can never consent to sex. But adults can consent to sex.
If Weinstein offers a starlet a movie role in exchange for sex, and if he is actually sincere about that offer, and she consents, I don’t call that rape. I don’t call it right, either, for several reasons, but many things are wrong but not rape. I’m not even saying prostitution is right. I’m just saying prostitution is sometimes rape, and sometimes not rape.