<p>My mother is 84, used to be pretty good health for her age and we, as well as her think she is going to live to a 100 and more. Her older sis is 89, have all kinds of health issues like high blood pressure, diabetes and kidney disease (20% function) and the docs gave her two more years. I think my mother expects to live at least as long. </p>
<p>Last month my mother’s kidney started failing rapidly, from 50% function and controlled by diet restrictions the nephrologist is now giving her about having 1.5 months to live without dialysis. With dialysis he gave her 1.5 years. </p>
<p>My mother is falling apart, it’s not just the sudden shocking news, she had always been like this. Totally absorbed about her health and very very afraid of death. She goes to church regularly and her church give her support but it is not enough. My sis, who is a nurse said she had never known anyone as afraid as our mother. </p>
<p>Since we will all die sooner or later, this is a situation that I will face with her. </p>
<p>Does anyone have any advice or experience to share ?</p>
<p>Munchkin, I don’t have advice either, but I have a lot of sympathy. And I can imagine this scenario very readily. My mom will be 84 in a couple weeks. She is in good health, overall, and is very proactive about taking care of herself. She is independent and enjoys life. I know that this can’t last forever, and I know she will be devastated when she has to recognize a limit to her life, as your mother has been forced to.</p>
<p>We look at the elderly as “wise” and reconciled and accepting–but there’s only one life for any of us, and who am I to expect acceptance of losing that from anyone in that position?</p>
<p>Your post struck a chord with me. I’m very sorry for your sadness, and offer sympathy and fellow-feeling to you and your family.</p>
<p>I lived with my MIL for the last two months of her long life (89). She was so capable and wise, but the reality of her late stage illness was so depressing to her. She was greatly helped by Hospice professionals, who know how to answer many questions well. One thing they did was prescribe anti-depressant, which she initially hated “on principle” because she didn’t want to be “on drugs.” The pills immediately helped her out. We didn’t refer to them as anti-depressants, just “her medicine” so it wouldn’t hurt her pride.</p>
<p>One afternoon, I witnessed my MIL ask the hospice nurse how will it feel, will there be pain as I die? The nurse was able, in her case, to assure her that when that did occur, she’d experience it as going to sleep and it would all happen when she would not feel it; there would not be pain. </p>
<p>Of course, Hospice kept her comfortable (palliative care) in the final weeks leading up to her dying. In actual fact, it went as the nurse described.</p>
<p>Following this convefrsation, my MIL was much more at peace. She basically wanted reassurance that she wouldn’t be screaming in agonizing pain, which is how she saw people die in her day. She had, in her own past, cared for 6 different people to the point of death on her own home sofa. She was Hospice before there was Hospice. </p>
<p>I realized that she had an idea based upon what she had seen of dying during the 1940’s, 50’s, 60’s. Her own experience was sad but pain-free. Big difference.</p>
<p>If your mother has had a relationship to any church or religion, this is an important time to bring over a pastor for some spiritual counsel that meshes with what she already believes.</p>
<p>Thank you everybody for offering sympathy and advice. </p>
<p>nysmile - my mother would absolutely not take any anti-anxiety medication. My sis is a psychiatric nurse and she and I long thought our mother would benefit from some. </p>
<p>paying3tuitions - you may have a point about her being afraid of being in pain. She is as terrified of pain as dying. She had a melt down the day before partly because an aunt told her dialysis is painful. So she was obsessing about it. I didn’t quite know how to handle her. </p>
<p>I am a fixer by nature but not particularly nurturing. I will resolve situations for my parents, as in - ok, so you are too frail to cook ? Fine, let me go figure out how to get meals delivered. Mother don’t want to pay for services ? Ok, let me find some subsidies or I will pay for them. Dialysis is painful ? Let me ask the doc regarding painkillers. </p>
<p>Words of comfort on the other hand, does not come easy. </p>
<p>I don’t know what to say to help her less afraid. She had been afraid of dying all her life. For eg. when my (adult) son wanted to go fishing in the ocean - mom told him so and so died when their boat capsized and they drowned.</p>
<p>Yes. Both my mom and step mom were very afraid of dying. both also got to a point where their death was going to be soon.</p>
<p>I agree that Hospice was terrific at that point…not only for the mom and step mom, but for the rest of us. They actually helped US address questions and worries.</p>
<p>When I was young I heard a saying “Young people are afraid of dying - old people are afraid of how they die”. Worrying about pain, disorientation and despair are certainly daunting. So finding a way to reassure her about those would be helpful - how about calling and asking to visit the dialysis center she might use? Visiting a bright happy room full of patients knitting, reading, watching tV will probably help, and dialysis nurses are great.</p>
<p>Dialysis could give her over a year - and in one’s 80’s that’s pretty good. But once this crisis
is over, maybe find a way to discuss planning for her affairs, and talk over her wishes, make sure there is a will, get finances documented and organized. That also helps people feel prepared.</p>
<p>Family events where she would get a chance to tell others about the history of the family, perhaps make a scrap book, review her life’s stories, is also comforting.</p>
<p>I keep coming back to your statement that MO will not take anti-anxiety meds )benzs). Is she alert enough to know what meds are given to her? My dad didn’t question it when we added Zoloft (an SSRI) to his regimen. He questioned me when he was moved to Hospice, but accepted the why.</p>
<p>Hospice, perhaps framed as comfort care, is a great help, and the anti anxiety meds which will come with hospice if her doctor does not prescribe them first. The hospice nurse can explain the physical benefits of the anti anxiety med too. Easier breathing, etc</p>
<p>If she is religious I think her pastor comforting her would be helpful. </p>
<p>I too am very sorry for her at this seemingly shocking change of events and for all in your family. </p>
<p>My 80 year old mother is a worrier, and those anti anxiety pills calm her so well. She takes a really low dose which calms her enough to start thinking more rational. </p>
<p>Your mom is not ready to give up control. I do think she is probably more fearful of the pain. My mom has shown me that sometimes we imagine things to be so much worse than reality. That is where I think your pastor may comfort her.</p>
<p>A friend of ours is a nephrologist, and I once asked H how long his patient’s could live on dialysis. H said, that with Dr. X, they would live as long as possible. Really, no one knows if they have 1.5 years to live or 1.5 minutes. Anything can happen at anytime, to anyone. </p>
<p>My own mother lived concerned about her health and afraid of death, until she was at death’s door. At some point months before she died, she kind of gave up on things - didn’t pay her bills or take her medicine, which was out of character. She just did not care, and did not want to go on. As odd as it seemed from knowing her, she really wanted to die, and when the time came, she was detached from her existence here on an emotional level. My MIL, also was very sick with alzheimer’s and she really wanted to go “home”. My FIL on the other hand, is pretty sick, but will not accept the possibility of dying, and he is quite old. I think his sheer tenacity will add time to his life. I don’t know if it is better for him that way.</p>
<p>I am sorry that your family is going through this, as I know how hard it is. I think the hospice folks can be good. We actually went to a lecture on end of life planning as a professional event, and that doc was outstanding. Let her have a professional to talk to so that her remaining time is satisfying to her. This was a good take home message from that doc - what does she want to do with her time now?</p>
<p>When my Dad was diagnosed with an untreatable condition he was very angry, he remained angry the entire time, 3-4 years, though he did not show that anger to anyone but my mother. Sad, he made it difficult to talk about anything related to death and this was very unexpected given the way he had always led his life. We were only able to address some final planning and wishes by couching it under ‘estate planning’ as they moved from one state to another and had to update will etc. as a matter of course, not because he was dying.</p>
<p>When he needed a hospital bed, Hospice came in, they were great, but it was a very short time, called them one day, they came to meet us the next day, brought the bed the 3rd day, gave him morphine and he never woke up, died the next day. I have to say, in hindsight, he was not complaining of pain, probably could have skipped the morphine, and let him hang on through strength of will as i think that is what had him lasting, pure strength of will. The morphine seemed to let nature take it’s course, but the speed surprised all of us, even hospice!</p>
<p>Is she afraid of pain or of what happens when/after she dies? If it is the former, perhaps a nurse or hospice could explain the extensive pain management tools available to her, or, when all else fails, how treatment A is less painful than just living with the condition.</p>
<p>As for death itself, perhaps you could have her pastor, priest, or rabbi speak to her. If she is Christian, then read to her from the Bible and talk about how God cares for His children when they pass into His hands. In many ways, there is no better person to discuss this than a child, someone who can talk about all the comfort that she gave as a parent and how that is the same comfort and love that God promises her.</p>
<p>Promise to pray for her. </p>
<p>There’s certainly something to be said for being God-fearing, but there is also something about not missing the joy - the overabundance of love that is promised.</p>
<p>Talk to her about unfinished business - things she is sorry about, grudges she might hold, people she wished she could apologise to.</p>
<p>What a fantastic thread… I have no insight to add, but am really impressed at how thoughtful you all are. And how kind of you to take the time to articulate these thoughts to others you will likely never meet! You are wonderful people, and I have gained insight from reading your comments.</p>
<p>My parents both died before they could considered elderly, but i agree that if you can get your mom to take anxiety medicine it may help a great deal.
Even if she wont take a prescription, there are alternative remedies and nutritional supplements that could help.</p>
<p>Really, no one knows if they have 1.5 years to live or 1.5 minutes. Anything can happen at anytime, to anyone.
I have no words of wisdom to add to your specific situation… but I would certainly encourage her to do the dialysis treatment.A lot can happen within the next year in terms of better meds or new techniques or treatments.
I copied the above because sadly I spent the afternoon at a funeral of a long-term friend who was killed in a car accident on Tuesday night at age 68. My friend had lost both her parents within the past 18 months, her father at 101 plus and her mother at 99. Both had been in excellent health their entire lives until the past few years. Her father’s decline initially began as a result of being mugged in a parking lot in Florida. She spent the past 4-5 years commuting to Florida from NY to oversee their care and visit… but before that she spent the previous 10 year supervising the care of her in-laws who had suffered a long decline… so this is a woman I never saw complain once, I never heard her say a bad word about anyone, I never saw her without a smile on her face… the service was overflowing with people like me in state of shock and not comprehending that we will not see that smiling face or hear her infectious laugh. Sorry to hijack this thread… but today just a reminder that you truly never know and you do need to stop and smell the roses.</p>
<p>Once again thank you everyone for sharing. Mom saw a gerontologist yesterday who confirmed the nephrologist’s dx. My sis and one of my brothers were with her to take notes and ask questions so we have a much better understanding of her condition. </p>
<p>Mom is seeing the nephrologist today, another brother plus two of her church friends will be with her. </p>
<p>From my conversations with my sis and brother yesterday, mom would go for dialysis. She has a heart valve problem (probably congenital) and dialysis may affect this condition so there are risks. </p>
<p>The previous day was my dad’s appointment with another gerontologist t to monitor his AZ conditon, his test scores deterioriated about 10% so that was a hard two days for us. </p>
<p>I want to address the suggestion that mom take anti-anxiety meds. As I posted previously, both sis and I long thought mom would greatly benefit from some. </p>
<p>Mom is a person who would not even take tylenol or any pain medication for spinal stenosis. I think she said it is bad for her liver or whatever. Mom does not behave in a way that is rational to all of us. She seeks relief for her pain by acupuncture or massage. Let me say these treatments are only semi-effective in controling pain. Try as my sis and I might, mom will not take any pain medication and she just suffers. The chronic pain affects her personality somewhat. </p>
<p>We used to joke since mom will not take anti-anxiety medication - we need to take anti-depressants to deal with her.</p>
<p>I haven’t had time to read through all the posts yet - but one idea that is very helpful was Hospice. I am going to talk to my sis about it. She is the leader in managing our parents. I live 3000 miles away and try to fill in the gaps. I help by going there twice a year and stay with my parents for a month to relief her.</p>
<p>bookmama22 - I am sorry about your friend. I totally agree no one knows if they have 1.5 years to live or 1.5 minutes.</p>
<p>I recently bought a lovely notepad and have it placed prominently on my desk - Live the life of your dreams. I try to remind myself of that everyday. (That did lead to some excessive shopping and general sloth regarding housework)</p>