Have you had a midlife marriage crisis like this? If so, how did you solve it?

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 10:39am

I’m posting this on CC because while I have friends who’ve had marriage crises at midlife, I haven’t had friends who’ve had this kind. If you have, I would appreciate hearing about your insights and experiences. PM me if you don’t want to post publicly.

I’ve been an empty nester for 3 years, and over the past 5 years or so (basically since my lifelong chronic depression was diagnosed, and I got on antidepressants) my life has been flourishing with one exception: my marriage.

My husband of more than 30 years and I either seem to have gone off on different paths or I’ve gone off on a different path while he has stayed the same.

I have developed a wide group of fascinating friends of all ages, and have plunged into new interests that keep me busy with my new friends, activities and causes.

My husband has continued with his longtime interest as a sports fan – attending and watching games by himself (something he has done since our older son – the only other sports fan – grew up and moved away almost 10 years ago) – and he has gotten into solo long distance bike riding and has become even more immersed in his job as a college prof.

For instance, he spent a year planning a weeks long out of town summer project with students, and when he didn’t get the funding to pay for him to receive a salary for being involved, he still did it even though we’re struggling to pay for our own college student’s education. This is the first time he ever has let work interfere with family responsibilities, and I find that alarming. He still is in denial that his actions are having severe financial consequences even though he recently dipped into his retirement fund to pay bills.

He’ll go to plays and concerts with me and enjoys those things, but then has to rush home or stay up late to do work. If we go any place that is a long drive away, he brings work to do and listens to his IPod during the car trip. Our conversations are superficial and dull, and I find it more fulfilling to talk to my friends.

The kinds of reminiscing conversations that many couples and friends find enjoyable – things like, “Remember that vacation that we took and how much fun we had?” somehow make him feel defensive. After years of trying to start such conversations out of love, and getting conversation killer responses like, “You say something like that about once a month,” I’ve given up.

At my insistence, we tried marriage counseling for about 2 years, but there were no fundamental changes in our marriage.

There’s no evidence that he is an addict, womanizer or closet homosexual – things that have destroyed marriages of some of my friends. He isn’t verbally or physically abusive or totally irresponsible with money like my father was. My husband is a friendly, pleasant, responsible person who can make reasonably good cocktail party conversation about world events, sports, and his job. His students and acquaintances – even virtual strangers he has met on planes – say he speaks often and proudly of me.

I’m considering divorce, but I don’t want to take such a drastic step if the marriage could be salvageable. Still, I feel that throughout most of our marriage, I have been the main person in charge maintaining intimacy, and I am no longer willing to do that.

Does anyone have insights or similar experiences to share?

toneranger · June 22, 2010, 10:52am

I think it’s really hard for couples when the kids leave and there aren’t many shared interests. I see it among friends…after SO much kid activity and shuttling…many couples don’t know what to do with each other and end up going separate ways.

My experience is that most guys like to share activities vs sit around and talk. I sit around and talk with my girlfriends…for hours. But most guys just don’t do that.

Can you try sharing in some of the activities he likes? Maybe go out on a bike ride with him. Or hiking maybe? Or pick one sport that you’ll watch with him…learn about it and root for the team with him? I really think it’s about compromise. You do some stuff HE likes and he does some stuff YOU like. Eventually, you might find some things you both like. And maybe he’ll open up some more during some of these activities…maybe not but it’s worth a try.

abasket · June 22, 2010, 10:56am

First of all, good for you to try and “figure” things out. I’m sure this is very difficult.

I have no big advice but have to say after reading your post, it sounds to me like you are very happy with your new adventures/friends and he is very happy continuing the life and interests he has always had. Seperately, you are happy and content. It sounds like you share some interests/activities, but you seem to want something more vibrant while your husband is more laid back and doesn’t dwell on the past or the future - he’s satisfied with “today”.

I hear the changes you desire in your marriage and everyday life. Do you think he desires any changes? Does he freely “let you” enjoy your new friends and interests?

While I understand how you must feel regarding the financial loss from his trip, I also want to say I read the fact that he still wanted to carry out the planned trip with his students an admirable trait. He seems very dedicated to his work and students. Are you a bit jealous of that? Of course, I do understand the strain financially on your family and how that would put you out.

I hope others can give you some suggestions or comfort.

VeryHappy · June 22, 2010, 10:58am

Ah, Northstarmom – so much to say, so little time.

Every marriage has its ebbs and flows. You say your husband talks about how proud he is of you – that’s wonderful! He’s probably just retreating somewhat since you say you’ve changed significantly over the last five years. He’s trying to find the new equilibrium for your relationship. He probably feels left out while you’re doing new things. I think that with some time, the two of you will become close again. But alleviating your depression has undoubtedly changed everything, and he needs to work that through.

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 11:11am

" He seems very dedicated to his work and students. Are you a bit jealous of that? Of course, I do understand the strain financially on your family and how that would put you out."

Nope, not jealous. Years ago, I went with him and a study group to where he’s taking the students. Both of us were funded by our jobs. It was a wonderful trip, but I don’t need to go again even though he invited me to go on this one (and would have had to dip more into our retirement fund to take me).

A big change in our lives has been that now that I have so many friends and activities at home, I no longer am interested in traveling. We used to travel a great deal connected with H’s work. He’d get paid for us to live elsewhere or travel during the summer. I no longer want to do that though it’s fine with me if H continues to be employed elsewhere during the summer, and I’m willing to spend a few weeks with him where he is working.

I am concerned, though, that due to his obsession with the student trip, it will be very difficult to pay for S’s senior year. Also H didn’t get our taxes in yet (we are owed a big refund) due to his spending so much time organizing the trip with his students. The paperwork that our accountant needs is paperwork that only H can provide. S was not able to get work study jobs in his major because H didn’t submit taxes yet, which means S can’t submit his FAFSA.

"He’s probably just retreating somewhat since you say you’ve changed significantly over the last five years. "

I suspect that H probably always has been this way, but I just was too depressed to notice. For instance, younger S has said that he doesn’t know H well because even when they take long car trips together, H either listens to his ipod or talks nonstop about things like sports that S has no interest in.

zoosermom · June 22, 2010, 11:21am

I agree that it’s part of the ebb and flow process. It seems to me that over a long marriage (we’re at 25 years laster this year), the ebbs and flows can last so long that they’re harder to identify. I always think that the first step is to affirm that the life you want is one in which you are married to your partner. From there it’s details. We had a very difficult time for a period of several years that ended last April. It didn’t end with a current pulling us together, it was a cataclysm that forced a decision. Sometimes I think that’s a better thing because you have to do something, it’s a question of what. For us, we took a drive in the car, just the two of us, and parket it in a private spot and poured our hearts out. We both cried and, staring into the abyss, both knew in our souls that our lives would not be better without each other. So we then each listed a few non-negotiables that would be the cornerstone of our new foundation. My husband could be very distant in the marital-emotional sense. He is not a warm person, although responsible, hard-working and present. I told him that I was no longer willing to be lonely in my marriage and time/attention/intimacy with me had to move to the top of his list if there was any hope of saving the marriage. He knew that I wasn’t kidding and it was hard for him. His parents were the coldest people I’ve ever met in my entire life. It didn’t come naturally for him, and some people would say it is sometimes forced, but I’m ok with that. Whether he has a mental list that says “kiss wife goodbye” or “run with wife on Saturday” doesn’t matter to me. What does matter is that we both enjoy the kiss regardless of why it happens and we generally have a good time when we do things alone together even if it’s not spontaneous. So my suggestion to you would be to come up with a very specific, detailed list of a few things that would make a difference to you and then present him with the list and let him know how close to the edge things are for you. It’s been my personal (not vast!) experience that if you spell something out clearly and respectfully for a man, he will comply if it is in his heart to do so. But if he doesn’t, then you know where you stand. What you don’t want to do is present some touchy-feeling “I’m not fulfilled” thing where he has to figure out what steps to take to make things better. Hubby and I have struggled mightily over the years, but I still find him sexy, cuddly and peaceful. I’d never want another man than he and I really don’t want to be alone if I don’t have to. I believe he feels the same way and this is a good time in our marriage. I wish you the best of everything and I’ll be thinking of you!

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 11:28am

I appreciate everyone who has taken the time to respond. Zoosermom, reading about your experience especially was helpful.

dmd77 · June 22, 2010, 11:41am

My husband and I haven’t had a marriage crisis in some years, partly because we did have one when our children were very young. After our son died, we kind of stopped talking, because every conversation ended with me in tears… a few years later we realized we had a problem, and we saw a counselor, who ended our visits by telling us we were better served spending $70/week going out to dinner than seeing her. So we started doing that ;-)

In any case, we started having a weekly conversation about whatever was on our minds, and I learned that my husband is so concrete in his thinking that he really needs to be told directly “it would make me happy if you did this.”

He is also a solo long-distance cyclist and treasures his long rides. I took up a hobby–dog agility–that also fills my weekends, and we now make a point of sharing what we did during those weekends, and sometimes we schedule trips where we both do our thing during the day and just have dinner together. I also enjoy helping him plan his rides–we talk over routes and he takes a tiny camera with him and shows me where he’s been. Occasionally I drive while he scopes out a new route.

You say you’re no longer interested in traveling–but you are interested in being with him. It may be that you need to travel to get that intense time you seem to be craving? Is there a special interest you could indulge on a trip together? (DH and I have started driving around the Oregon wine country on some weekends. I drive, he tastes, and we have a nice lunch.)

I know it’s terribly expensive to travel, especially with a child in college, but the costs of a marriage breakdown are huge as well.

When your husband speaks proudly of you to strangers, what does he say? What is he proud of? Can you together work back to those moments?

I am also wondering if the focus on his career is because he has something particular he wants to accomplish that he hasn’t yet? Many of the men I see in their early 50s seem very driven right now. It’s a scary time, and they’re worried about their jobs, their futures, providing for family…

SamuraiLandshark · June 22, 2010, 11:49am

Sometimes men aren’t very good at telling us what they think. We have to translate their thoughts and words. We aren’t mind readers.

And sometimes we women aren’t very good at telling our husbands what we think about the big stuff. Most moms I know spend so much time micro-managing the household and their kids, and as the kids move on, it’s exhausting and emotionally hard to reestablish a new family dynamic. Also, as women we often talk a lot and sometimes our men tune us out, so when we say something big, it’s often not “heard”.

NSM, it sounds like your husband loves to travel, even if it means that the family finances are neglected. Do you generally sit down and number crunch your household finances with him? It’s always been a difficult point in my marriage, like many others. Talking about money is really painful, especially when one partner thinks the other is being cavalier with the finances.

Getting your depression under control is wonderful, but it also changes the interpersonal dynamic he has had with you. Suddenly, you feel different - maybe you aren’t the same person you were 30 years ago, or even 5 or 10 years ago. You are going through the adjustment of an empty nest, as well as looking across the table and trying to figure out if this is the man you want to spend the rest of your life with. I guess the question is, do you have more happy time with him, than sad ones? Are you just generally feeling unfullfilled, or is it something more? Do you like spending time with him? If you were to split, how would you deal with that void?

emeraldkity4 · June 22, 2010, 11:50am

::::::::::Hugs-:::::::::: I know how hard it is.
We just celebrated our 29th anniv ( although because my H has to work 2 weekends to every one he has off- we haven’t gotten to go out yet). :(

I also will say that about three years ago, I started in on landscaping our house myself- ( because with the kids- I had never had time/energy before) primarily because I wanted it to add to appeal when we sold it for the divorce that I was sure was around the corner.
To my surprise, I found that I really enjoyed it & while H often did not relate to other things that I did- he appreciated what I was doing in the yard very much & it started to bring us closer together- ( but we still have a long way to go- unfortunately something else that contributed to that- was the death of H’s long time best friend almost two years ago- which I would term a " bromance" but of the hippie /redneck we wont actually have a “conversation” but we will watch a lot of football together type.
:rolleyes:

We have also gone to counselors over the years- and it can be really difficult to find one which is a good fit. It also is a lot of work and can be very draining- but even if you both don’t have the time to do so now, I would recommend that you try one to help you sort out what is going on for you.

The money thing is a piece many couples have trouble with. On the one hand if he doesn’t spend much money on himself ( and taking the trip with his students seems to fill a need for him)- I could justify it- but still a budget has to take it into account someplace.

It is a big flag however, that he hasn’t gotten his stuff for the accountant- as that is for money that you need- I am thinking- and I only do this because my H does the same thing… that he is depressed/anxious and the way that he shuts out the thoughts in his head is by staying busy, listening to his ipod or focusing on external activities like sports/his students.

I will look for the titles of some books that have helped me- but I also want to be frank with my thought that perhaps he feels that - since he has not really changed as much as you have- he doesn’t see the need to change in response.

I also am thinking- that since you have so many activities that are different than his own interests, and he is continuing with his own activities- he probably hasn’t really internalized that you have changed and need something else from him.

Men( IMO ) change very slowly- I think women must be hard wired to adapt more quickly, just because in 1 year we go through having a waist and being a “sexpot” to pushing a baby human out of our body and becoming their refrigerator. ;)

poetgrl · June 22, 2010, 11:52am

I started dating my H freshman year in highschool, and at a certain point, maybe 5 years or so ago, we’ve been married for 20, together for 30, I noticed I’d been the one doing all the heavy emotional lifting in the relationship for a decade, or so. I’d been in therapy, gone through many changes, had a lot of new friends and interests and his interests had remained the same.

Let me say this man is a great guy in the traditional sense of “He’s a great guy.” That’s how anyone would describe him. He’s a great dad, successful, never disrespectful, none of the things that would make you just pack up your bags and say, “I can’t do this anymore.” Still, I felt very alone in the marriage, for whatever reason.

In the great tradition of “great guys” everywhere, he is not the type to go to counseling, even though he loves to brag about the fact that I’m a therapist. “You should talk to my wife about that,” he says all the time. But, we’d just been going down different paths.

I decided, at this one point, I can either say something now, or else I’m going to end up leaving when the kids leave. I need to give him a chance to respond, grow, change, or at least to “know” he was making a choice, as well. Whether he chose to join me or not, I was okay with it. In addition to loving him, I really like him very much, as well, and he is the father of my children.

In the end, we started to work things out.

I wanted to get separated but he was pretty horrified by that idea, so we started simple, with a date night once a week. Every other week, he plans a date and every other week, I do. Also, we take a walk now five nights a week, together, and it’s not a serious talk walk, unless one of us makes an appointment for that, first. We never have serious conversations without an appointment to do so and without the other person knowing the subject matter in advance. This is more for him, since I’m a better talker and he tends to feel ambushed.

Nobody will mention this, but it has to be said in terms of marriage, an agreed upon amount of physical intimacy has to be met, as well…so that the affection and passion can return to the marriage, as well.

Nowadays, five years later, I really find it hard to believe where we were back then, or how alone I was feeling. And, I’m not really sure he’s changed all that much, to be honest. We just spend better time together, pay a little more attention to each other, and make sure we remember to give each other the benefit of the doubt.

I think the biggest AHA moment came when we both realized we’d been trying hard, but he’d been giving me what he wanted from a relationship and I’d been giving him what I wanted, and so niether of us was really getting what we wanted, but the other one was frustrated by what it was we had to give. That really changed a lot for us both.

zoosermom · June 22, 2010, 12:01pm

This is extremely important and can’t be overstated. My husband and I have an analogy for this that is repeated every time we have an issue about this. The story goes: "honey, I’m crossing the Sahara to get to you. I’m crawling, scratching and doing everything I can to get there. But I have no water. I’ve started to hallucinate. Death is imminent! I can see you in the oasis, you’re standing there like a beacon of hope for me. I know that I can make it now! I’m almost there, reaching out with my last burst of energy. As I draw in my last breath, you hand me

an order of French fries."

Now, these may be the best fries in the history of the world, but I need water or I will die. We both giggle now about the melodrama, but it took my hubby a long time to know that “I don’t drink, gamble or screw around” wasn’t quite enough. Nor was “I clean the bathroom.” I’d so rather do the bathroom myself and have a romantic dinner.

Poetgrl is spot-on about the umm, intimacy area, as well. It’s hard to be really fed up with someone when you’re having exciting, memorable, umm, intimacy.

NewHope33 · June 22, 2010, 12:02pm

NSM - Many hugs to you. If I had a solution I’d gladly provide it, but I don’t have any “one size fits all” solutions at hand.

In the three decades I’ve been married I’ve seen marriages withstand major crises (like the loss of child), and break up over seemingly trivial issues (once over placement of a trash can … a trigger issue for something bigger obviously).

What I have noticed is that people get more fragile as they age, and it’s always a temptation to withhold relationship pressures during those times … in a well-meant effort to let the individual work through his/her issue.

emeraldkity4 · June 22, 2010, 12:20pm

but he’d been giving me what he wanted from a relationship and I’d been giving him what I wanted, and so niether of us was really getting what we wanted,

Good insight.

This book is full of concrete things- which helps me when I feel like we are getting off track & I am getting into the naggy/needy stage.[Couple’s Comfort Book: A Creative Guide for Renewing Passion, Pleasure and](<a href=“http://www.amazon.com/Couples-Comfort-Book-Creative-Commitment/dp/0060776692/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_5”>http://www.amazon.com/Couples-Comfort-Book-Creative-Commitment/dp/0060776692/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_5</a>)

We have also participated in a Couples workshop years ago- that wasn’t site based- but it was very helpful years ago- & I have been considering doing this weekend one- .
My H was raised in an alcoholic/enabler household, and he still has great difficulty ever- ever- saying anything even remotely negative about either of his parents- no matter how they treat him/me/their grandkids.
But that workshop started to heal some of the wounds that he didn’t even want to look at.
[Couples</a> Retreat - Exclusive, Small Group Two Day Workshop with John & Julie Gottman](<a href=“http://www.gottman.com/51282/Private-Couples-Retreats.html]Couples”>Private Couples Retreats - Couples | The Gottman Institute)
It is also very private- you are just talking to your partner/counselor, not a group sharing sort of thing which H would have run from.

I have also been reading Real Love by Greg Baer which is really good on the how to show unconditional love, when we might not recognize it if it bought us dinner.

I agree with the physical stuff- and as a sensory kinesthetic person- sex has always been important to me- but I bet I also speak for a lot of women when I say that “unless I feel loved, I really don’t feel like making it so much”.

I do like these books though.
[Divine Sex: The Tantric & Taoist Arts of Conscious Loving- Caroline Aldred](<a href=“http://www.amazon.com/Divine-Sex-Tantric-Taoist-Conscious/dp/1903258022/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277223145&sr=1-1”>http://www.amazon.com/Divine-Sex-Tantric-Taoist-Conscious/dp/1903258022/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277223145&sr=1-1</a>)

[Passionate</a> Marriage: Keeping Love and Intimacy Alive in Committed Relationships- David Schnarch](<a href=“http://www.amazon.com/Passionate-Marriage-Intimacy-Committed-Relationships/dp/0393334279/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277223302&sr=1-1]Passionate”>http://www.amazon.com/Passionate-Marriage-Intimacy-Committed-Relationships/dp/0393334279/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1277223302&sr=1-1)

musicamusica · June 22, 2010, 12:41pm

Mid-life crisis kicked in two years ago for both of us. Sniping at one another, not considering each other when we made our individual plans, arguments about pointless details, silly grudges…a little bit of everything that added up to a potential split.
After a first time long session with a highly recommended counselor, in which we both cried,ranted and raged about one another…the counselor said only one thing. “Have you tried being nice to one another?” We both collapsed in laughter and said…“no”.
That was an expensive one sentence response, but we didn’t go back because it really did help us. It certainly didn’t fix everything, but it certainly helped A LOT.

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 12:52pm

"Nobody will mention this, but it has to be said in terms of marriage, an agreed upon amount of physical intimacy has to be met, as well…so that the affection and passion can return to the marriage, as well. "

My husband does not understand this at all. Counseling did not help. I don’t want to get too personal on a public message board, so read between the lines. This has been a big change over the course of our marriage, and one that he has been totally unwilling to address in any way despite my bringing up the subject directly as well as tactfully.

I will check out the couple’s retreat info that was posted in #14.

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 12:55pm

"I started dating my H freshman year in highschool, and at a certain point, maybe 5 years or so ago, we’ve been married for 20, together for 30, I noticed I’d been the one doing all the heavy emotional lifting in the relationship for a decade, or so. I’d been in therapy, gone through many changes, had a lot of new friends and interests and his interests had remained the same.

Let me say this man is a great guy in the traditional sense of “He’s a great guy.” That’s how anyone would describe him. He’s a great dad, successful, never disrespectful, none of the things that would make you just pack up your bags and say, “I can’t do this anymore.” Still, I felt very alone in the marriage, for whatever reason."

Except for the fact that I met my husband when we were in our mid 20s, the above sounds like my marriage.

kelsmom · June 22, 2010, 1:05pm

Only you and your husband can decide whether or not you will ultimately stay together. But I just want to point out that the “for better or for worse” part of the marriage vows is there for a reason. Not all the days in a marriage are wonderful. Sometimes, things aren’t so great … but the thing is, the better days may very well be there again for your marriage. The point is, if you can weather the bad, the sun may well come out again.

It sounds as if your H has some issues he needs to work through. It may be his midlife crisis. He has to own that crisis, though, and decide that changes are in order. Of course, the tax thing is not a small issue - it affects you, too, doesn’t it? Can you do the taxes, rather than waiting for him? That may also open the door to a discussion of just what the heck is going on … why is he dragging his feet? He may need to be evaluated for depression, or he may need to talk to a counselor … but men don’t necessarily like that sort of thing, and just saying it to him may go over like a lead balloon. Paving the way by taking on the task he said he’d do & didn’t (the taxes) could open the door to a conversation he really needs to have.

Beyond that, no advice from me … but hugs to you, because I know this is not an easy place for you to be right now.

Bottom line, though … do you love him? Do you want to stay with him? Are you better off with him or without him? The answers to those questions may help you figure out what YOU want.

Northstarmom · June 22, 2010, 1:15pm

"Can you do the taxes, rather than waiting for him? "

Unfortunately, no because it requires living expense information from his work abroad during most of 2009 that only he has.

" do you love him? Do you want to stay with him? Are you better off with him or without him? The answers to those questions may help you figure out what YOU want."

Living with him is like living with a pleasant, cordial roommate that I don’t have much in common with.

Anyone here who has divorced: What brought you to that decision? Did you just give up or was the one last straw?

mathmom · June 22, 2010, 1:25pm

Great suggestion. Honestly this is something I struggle with too. My husband is a great guy, but it does sometimes feel like all he does is work. We have some things we have always done together though and that he will always make time for - The Sunday Times Crossword puzzle, watching a TV show together every night, family dinner, fancy meals out for celebrations, the quest for the perfect BBQ in the NYC area (and the rest of the US when we are on the road.) If you can find some little things you can do together on a regular basis it may help you to reconnect. Maybe you will never be a sport fan, but is there one sport you could learn to enjoy? (I’m not a big sports fan, but I’m glad I spent the hours I did watching football with my Dad now that he’s gone.) Maybe travel doesn’t fit into your current extra-marriage life these days, but perhaps he’s really counting on you being there with him? Is there something new that you could both enjoy doing together? (We take ballroom dance classes from time to time to no very good effect sadly!)

As for the taxes, maybe it’s time for you to take over. I used to pay the bills until I got lazy and missed a couple of credit card payments and then dh took over.

Have you had a midlife marriage crisis like this? If so, how did you solve it?

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